"PVP in many forms and fasion" and what we want ?!!

[Menetherin]

Ive been watching this game from afar with quiet anticipation. Im a PvPer at heart now, never used to be but I dont get PvE too much these days. It can be nice break now and again or for a few shinies,but to be your main focus....meh.

I am currently playing WaR and with all its faults etc it does have some fun pvp within it, especially if like me you try and stay away from the zerg and do small scale. The thing that has been putting me off a bit with this game is I havent heard enough about the pvp. I will obviously role on a pvp server which is always going to add to the fun but what are they going to be implementing into the game?? Do any of you guys know of any information, links etc??

Also my first post, so a hello to all you guys on the forums

Im not going to put too much info down right now as I have just finished a 12 hour shift, but something I would love to see implemented is the BG system from daoc. I recently took a break from WaR to play daoc and even though its far from its prime the pvp is still amazing fun. That Bg system is soooo much better than the WoW and WaR counterparts and does feel alot more like open world pvp compared to a timed instance. Will have a think about some more bits and bobs, and there have been some great suggestions here by you guys. But who knows how it will turn out. Lets just hope they get a decent balance and succeed where others have failed.

Regards

Mene

[DarkoneNeo]

What I feel kills OPEN world PvP is not the BGs but imbalances in the classes. In BGs, you least forced to play as teams whereas in open world, you encounter a lot of 1v1 and OP static classes in other games leave too many people having no choice but to do BGs and Arena's with teammates instead.

Least to me, that's what killed it in WoW. If I saw Warlocks, I just ran instead. Good Warlocks were practically impossible to beat 1v1 unless you tag teamed them down then they would die fast. What a lot of people do like about world pvp is the ganking or rolling solo.

Now I know this isn't everyone's story, but it was mine for a while. I just happened to have played the most gimped class of the game and had trouble with every class and basically had to prey on scrubs cause of my gimped static class so I was sort of forced to roll in groups or what I eventually did was level another class and did fine. But find that a little crazy because I personally like just maxing out one char as much as possible and the only reason I would roll a 2nd is for the reason above or if I did max out one (which doesn't happen if there is a lot of good end-game). Why I don't think there will be too many issues in Rift.

So what I will like about this game is the fact that if you run across someone and they do skills against you where you have little defense and can't beat them. You can simply respec to find a vantage point through different skills to win.

[Garangula]

I am currently playing WaR and with all its faults etc it does have some fun pvp within it, especially if like you me you try and stay away from the zerg and do small scale. The thing that has been putting me off a bit with this game is I havent heard enough about the pvp. I will obviously role on a pvp server which is always going to add to the fun but what are they going to be implementing into the game?? Do any of you guys know of any information, links etc??

Also my first post, so a hello to all you guys on the forums

Regards

Mene

Warhammer got allot of good pvp in it and i play with my wizard with so much fun.I quit the game after the 2-3 months because the high end pve content was almost 0 and the another thing that i hate was that you cant duel allot and only big masses of players for pvp was not what i like ,me being more of a solo pk

[Cyborg]

A) PVP BASED server(s)

on this server(s)

1. OPEN, FFA pvp; without it, it takes any of the camaraderie and guild cohesiveness out of a game for those of us who want ffa pvp.

I will love to have 80% -90% of the whole map ffa pvp on the pvp servers..with very restricted protection areas only for nubs area..

[Oggiefishier]

What I feel kills OPEN world PvP is not the BGs but imbalances in the classes. In BGs, you least forced to play as teams whereas in open world, you encounter a lot of 1v1 and OP static classes in other games leave too many people having no choice but to do BGs and Arena's with teammates instead.

Least to me, that's what killed it in WoW. If I saw Warlocks, I just ran instead. Good Warlocks were practically impossible to beat 1v1 unless you tag teamed them down then they would die fast. What a lot of people do like about world pvp is the ganking or rolling solo.

Now I know this isn't everyone's story, but it was mine for a while. I just happened to have played the most gimped class of the game and had trouble with every class and basically had to prey on scrubs cause of my gimped static class so I was sort of forced to roll in groups or what I eventually did was level another class and did fine. But find that a little crazy because I personally like just maxing out one char as much as possible and the only reason I would roll a 2nd is for the reason above or if I did max out one (which doesn't happen if there is a lot of good end-game). Why I don't think there will be too many issues in Rift.

So what I will like about this game is the fact that if you run across someone and they do skills against you where you have little defense and can't beat them. You can simply respec to find a vantage point through different skills to win.

heres the problem .. no MMO with multiple classes that havent been seriously homogenized will ever be balanced for 1v1.. this is a part of the game genra.. rock paper scissors is your best bet where there is always one lass that rules ofver another.. but not all of them.. rogues wtfpwn locks so i'm assuming you were playing a mage.. which wtfpwned warriors.. who wtfpwned rogues.. though with a skilled player those disadvantages could be overcome. its not a locked ins ystem but the fights are handicapped in those directions.

as for what i want out of pvp? the complete ability to avoid all pvp and still complete all pve content.. aka dont go putting a pve raid in a pvp zone forcing me to pvp if i want to do that pve content.

[Rickster1522]

I love Open World PVP.

And to be honest, the most fun i have had in pvp is the vanilla WoW... hmm whats the name of the battleground.. anyhow, its 40v40 defeat the castle style play. Fun Fun.

[Cyborg]

I love Open World PVP.

And to be honest, the most fun i have had in pvp is the vanilla WoW... hmm whats the name of the battleground.. anyhow, its 40v40 defeat the castle style play. Fun Fun.

In wow it was allot of fun in the open world at the enemy faction zones.Allot of fun for me but allot of cry for others

[Unknowen]

[QUOTE=DarkoneNeo;150066]What I feel kills OPEN world PvP is not the BGs but imbalances in the classes.

Where is luck since Rift will never be balanced unless is is utterly over powered 1 build will be grate a few weeks later a build will counter it.

[DarkoneNeo]

heres the problem .. no MMO with multiple classes that havent been seriously homogenized will ever be balanced for 1v1.. this is a part of the game genra.. rock paper scissors is your best bet where there is always one lass that rules ofver another.. but not all of them.. rogues wtfpwn locks so i'm assuming you were playing a mage.. which wtfpwned warriors.. who wtfpwned rogues.. though with a skilled player those disadvantages could be overcome. its not a locked ins ystem but the fights are handicapped in those directions.

as for what i want out of pvp? the complete ability to avoid all pvp and still complete all pve content.. aka dont go putting a pve raid in a pvp zone forcing me to pvp if i want to do that pve content.

I don't know how it is now, but back in the day when I played it, you could never beat a semi-knowledgeable lock. You were tore down fast and feared away again easily. Couldn't even get near them. I don't know how it is now. And I do believe you can have a balance through simply having options. Or offering consumables that make up for what you may not have (ie potions that dispel if you aren't a cleric to dispel yourself.) I just think game companies don't wanna do it or know about their own product as much as the users do. I think this is a huge problem with Aion. You go to conventions and ask any of the Aion reps about certain things in their game, they are all like uh, this is a question for the devs. Then you go to the devs and they kind of answer around it or are too drunk or something to care at the bar. It's just a paycheck.

I like the rock paper scissors feel, but even then you rarely get that. I would actually be fine with this. BUT, it's always just ONE or maybe two chars that dominate and everyone else is semi-balanced. And I think the problem with that is poor defenses vs. damage. Defenses don't scale well as damage does. Never usually does. Or the skills that offer defenses are static and are attuned more to average damage and then when new patches and such are released, you got poor skill defenses cause they failed to scale those up properly.

Also, when you put PvP away from PvE, then what happens is you get no one in the PvP areas. People just see it as "why bother with going there? you get jumped." It happened in Aion too. Personally, I prefer it all the be meshed together. Not two separate mini-games feeling. If you on PvE server, then simply just do NOT flag yourself to PvP where you don't wanna PvP. However on PvP servers, I hope there's no safe zones.

[Shinimas]

Where is luck since Rift will never be balanced unless is is utterly over powered 1 build will be grate a few weeks later a build will counter it.

Which is not an option in a game with so many classes. If you need a specific build and class to counter the FotM class, chances are this build is going to suck against all other classes.

[Vihar]

At least Rift offers the potential for players to balance the classes.

If one class is truly dominant, you'll just find everyone speccing specific vs that class, and taking their chances with everything else.

For example, if I am grinding, minding my own business in an open world map, I'd probably run an anti-scout spec..in anticipation of that being the class that is most likely to try and gank me.

But....I'd run a different spec if going to a battleground in group PvP.

Now...there is still the chance that caster classes will just be squishy no matter what, and scouts will just burst them down.

We'll have to wait and see.

[Cyborg]

At least Rift offers the potential for players to balance the classes.

If one class is truly dominant, you'll just find everyone speccing specific vs that class, and taking their chances with everything else.

For example, if I am grinding, minding my own business in an open world map, I'd probably run an anti-scout spec..in anticipation of that being the class that is most likely to try and gank me.

But....I'd run a different spec if going to a battleground in group PvP.

Now...there is still the chance that caster classes will just be squishy no matter what, and scouts will just burst them down.

We'll have to wait and see.

I fear that balance will be a hard business for the devs.At least if they dont focus on 1v1 ballance allot they wont do big changes.Rock/paper/scissors is fine by me.I can smell allot will build a owning build for they core classes and that will be ...

[Xthos]

I am not big on some of the stuff, I worry it takes away from open world PvP/RvR.

Duels - sure, have an arena area, like in EQ, where even on PVE servers, people, groups ect, can come and fight. No rewards, want to do it, have fun.

Arenas - I don't play wow, so maybe I don't get it, but it doesn't sound that fun and interesting to me, to play 1v1, 2v2, or 3v3...I prefer bigger battles and I think I wouldn't find much interest in it, and if people want to do it and have some kind of ranking thing, great...I am against having gear and rewards for it though, I feel if you want that, then it should be from larger pvp/rvr events.


Scenarios - larger battles, like 10-18 verse 10-18, they can be fun, but I find these can take away from open world PvP/RvR. If they want to have things for this, then I say make the items/equipment on a lower tier than the open world stuff.


I guess the theme of my post is evident, I like open world RvR/PvP, not a big fan of instances, I would prefer to not have people hiding away in some instance grinding points/gear...It seems repetitive and boring to me, I know everything can be repetitive, but it seems more repetitive.


This is just my opinion, and I am sure I am in the minority overall, could be in the majority if you add scenario events...

[DarkoneNeo]

Which is not an option in a game with so many classes. If you need a specific build and class to counter the FotM class, chances are this build is going to suck against all other classes.

You can hotswap between 4 builds from what I read. I assume most people will have a PvP build, maybe two, a PvE build and/or support build, then their solo build. A mix of that. I might have 2 PvP builds or even a PvP support like build for when in groups. I don't know just yet. But I also feel some people will have a full blown dmg spec or something that works for melee and something that works for ranged attackers. Before the fight starts, you swap to the correct build. If you are jumped and in the wrong build. Then it's GG. As you can only swap when out of combat.

But as you can guess, this is also a balancing effect as well. Simply swap out your build to accommodate your present situation. More options. I think balancing is not in the game anymore, it's in the user's hands.

[Gwaehir]

What I feel kills OPEN world PvP is not the BGs but imbalances in the classes. In BGs, you least forced to play as teams whereas in open world, you encounter a lot of 1v1 and OP static classes in other games leave too many people having no choice but to do BGs and Arena's with teammates instead.

Least to me, that's what killed it in WoW. If I saw Warlocks, I just ran instead. Good Warlocks were practically impossible to beat 1v1 unless you tag teamed them down then they would die fast. What a lot of people do like about world pvp is the ganking or rolling solo.

Now I know this isn't everyone's story, but it was mine for a while. I just happened to have played the most gimped class of the game and had trouble with every class and basically had to prey on scrubs cause of my gimped static class so I was sort of forced to roll in groups or what I eventually did was level another class and did fine. But find that a little crazy because I personally like just maxing out one char as much as possible and the only reason I would roll a 2nd is for the reason above or if I did max out one (which doesn't happen if there is a lot of good end-game). Why I don't think there will be too many issues in Rift.

So what I will like about this game is the fact that if you run across someone and they do skills against you where you have little defense and can't beat them. You can simply respec to find a vantage point through different skills to win.

Your reasoning is THE REASON that FFA pvp works. The leveling areas need to be patrolled and/or you need to have a group of your guildmates/friends to assist you in leveling to deter the RPKS out there.

While I am not opposed to instanced pvp ( and yes, both need to be implemented in the game IMO), I have found that instanced pvp turns into a game of range and CC, rather than player skill. Instanced pvp more often than not becomes a who has the most ranged dders and crowd control; thereby leaving many other types of players out in the pasture.

Past games like AC1 darktide and DAoC worked well because of the nature of the pvp that was implemented.

WAR could have been a lot better had they offered true stealth classes. True stealth classes allow for really good open, ffa pvp, in which you have the stealth wars as well as stealths vs visables.

I also dont mind the a faction pvp system, as long as opposing factions can get into each others leveling areas at anytime to pvp-- like AION implemented.