NO DPS or Threat Meters

[Haseno]

There is no need to compromise, you act like you or this has any say in what they will put in.

You can't make compromises, because you are not in charge.

And just because people share the same opinion as you, does not make it a fact.

We actually do have a say in whether or not they get put in, it's called feedback. Trust me, moderators are reading this thread.

We as a community can agree to a compromise, it's called being civilized. But then again, i guess everyone who feels the same way I should do. Should just be excluded right? It's not about being in charge, it's about us caring about our game and community.

Sadly, if people can agree with me. It means they also experienced the same issue.Which does make it fact.

[silentwraith]

We actually do have a say in whether or not they get put in, it's called feedback. Trust me, moderators are reading this thread.

We as a community can agree to a compromise, it's called being civilized. But then again, i guess everyone who feels the same way I should do. Should just be excluded right? It's not about being in charge, it's about us caring about our game and community.

Sadly, if people can agree with me. It means they also experienced the same issue.Which does make it fact.

The compromise is it being in and you ignoring them and not using them... your not using it so they only time it can hurt you is if your deemed to have low dps. The rest of us should have the choice.

[Mr_Teatime]

So, that's your counter to my post? Bringing up a ridiculous statement like that didn't counter my statement at all. If anything it served my statement better.

Testimonials are proof to the developers. It can be used as feedback. Simply because it can be, it's indeed factual.

We offered you more than zero proof. Someone even stated that it's a "worst case scenario." You even stated yourself it's possible, yet you keep telling me it's just an opinion.

-sigh- I wish people could honestly read what they're typing sometimes.

Also, nice try insinuating I am intolerant. I have nothing against religion. However, some religious people in the audience may have found your statement regarding it offensive.

My point is this... you continually say that your opinion is fact. That is just plain wrong. Yes, the devs want to hear opinions. See that? Opinions. They're not asking you for facts. If they wanted facts, then they would look them up. You're providing opinions. Stop pretending you're right. You're only fooling yourself. If you are unable to see the distinction in this, then I'm just plain sorry.

Here's a fact if what you said is true: Bunnies are the most deadly mobs in games, and should stay that way. See? Now the final boss in this game has to be a bunny. It is the most deadly, and since it is a fact it has to be this way. It's just plain silly the lengths that you go to to not even understand what you're talking about.

And guess what, I did state that it is a possible worst case scenario. Does that make it a fact? Once again class, all together.... NO. Some kid got stabbed by a freaking sword and killed over ingame items in China. Does this mean that Trion needs to implement anti-sword-stabbing features in the game? Of course not. That is ludicrous.

Observations and anecdotes are not facts. Just like they are not proof. If you're under the false assumption that they are, then it's no wonder you keep arguing.

[silentwraith]

My point is this... you continually say that your opinion is fact. That is just plain wrong. Yes, the devs want to hear opinions. See that? Opinions. They're not asking you for facts. If they wanted facts, then they would look them up. You're providing opinions. Stop pretending you're right. You're only fooling yourself. If you are unable to see the distinction in this, then I'm just plain sorry.

Here's a fact if what you said is true: Bunnies are the most deadly mobs in games, and should stay that way. See? Now the final boss in this game has to be a bunny. It is the most deadly, and since it is a fact it has to be this way. It's just plain silly the lengths that you go to to not even understand what you're talking about.

And guess what, I did state that it is a possible worst case scenario. Does that make it a fact? Once again class, all together.... NO. Some kid got stabbed by a freaking sword and killed over ingame items in China. Does this mean that Trion needs to implement anti-sword-stabbing features in the game? Of course not. That is ludicrous.

Observations and anecdotes are not facts. Just like they are not proof. If you're under the false assumption that they are, then it's no wonder you keep arguing.

Well written...

[dinhosaur]

Actually, it took roughly 2 months for each boss to get their world first. Patch 3.1.1, containing Algalon, was released on April 14th, 09, and the first Algalon kill was on June 3rd, 09. Heroic Lich King was available on February 2nd, 10, and the fist Heroic Lich King kill was on March 26th, 10.

Different instances, different content patches different progression, different gating techniques.

The gear available in ulduar wasn't nearly as overkill as the gear available in ICC. Also the classes were balanced to do absurd DPS in ICC. Dramatically more so than the gap between naxx and uld, and uld and totc.

Also anyone that says X class should be Y on the dps meter is a newb, different encounters have different classes/specs excelling. (This part isn't addressed to hackie)

[Haseno]

The compromise is it being in and you ignoring them and not using them... your not using it so they only time it can hurt you is if your deemed to have low dps. The rest of us should have the choice.

"The compromise is you dealing with it and just trying to ignore the problem." Thanks for defining selfishness.

Also, I play healers. I don't need a meter to tell me I'm doing a good job healing either.

You do have the choice, it's called parsers and logs. If you want something, you gotta' take the effort to achieve it. In this case opening up a few files in your directory.

[Sire]

If you want something, you gotta' take the effort to achieve it. In this case opening up a few files in your directory.

I just wanted to reiterate.

Funny isn't it? Hardcore = Effort
Addons to eliminate the effort somewhat =/ Hardcore.

[Haseno]

My point is this... you continually say that your opinion is fact. That is just plain wrong. Yes, the devs want to hear opinions. See that? Opinions. They're not asking you for facts. If they wanted facts, then they would look them up. You're providing opinions. Stop pretending you're right. You're only fooling yourself. If you are unable to see the distinction in this, then I'm just plain sorry.

Here's a fact if what you said is true: Bunnies are the most deadly mobs in games, and should stay that way. See? Now the final boss in this game has to be a bunny. It is the most deadly, and since it is a fact it has to be this way. It's just plain silly the lengths that you go to to not even understand what you're talking about.

And guess what, I did state that it is a possible worst case scenario. Does that make it a fact? Once again class, all together.... NO. Some kid got stabbed by a freaking sword and killed over ingame items in China. Does this mean that Trion needs to implement anti-sword-stabbing features in the game? Of course not. That is ludicrous.

Observations and anecdotes are not facts. Just like they are not proof. If you're under the false assumption that they are, then it's no wonder you keep arguing.

You're right, they want facts. Factually, they do not want AddOns in their game at this time. There's a reason for this decision.

I didn't care to read the rest of your post, there's no need. I don't need to keep repeating myself. I've backed up my statements, and if you wish to keep denying that. Then that's fine. Only one of the groups are right, and so far...i've suggested compromise. You don't want this, and because of this. Already proves which side is more righteous.

[dinhosaur]

In the end i'd prefer a game that rewards skill over easy-mode. Meters help make games easy-mode, anyone that argues against that simply doesn't have a deeper understanding of how they impact games.

Lot of people pretend they are hardcore, but this happens with every up and coming game, some guilds fiend the forums, and then the game comes out and they are nonfactors and fade away into nothingness while the real players take over.

[Zyfer]

You're right, they want facts. Factually, they do not want AddOns in their game at this time. There's a reason for this decision.

I didn't care to read the rest of your post, there's no need. I don't need to keep repeating myself. I've backed up my statements, and if you wish to keep denying that. Then that's fine. Only one of the groups are right, and so far...i've suggested compromise. You don't want this, and because of this. Already proves which side is more righteous.

+1

[Haseno]

I just wanted to reiterate.

Funny isn't it? Hardcore = Effort
Addons to eliminate the effort somewhat =/ Hardcore.

I know, it's troubling.

If only they knew...

[BucMan]

Once again no excuse for low dps as a rogue... rogue lock mage hunter should always be way up on the charts..if you were a druid sham I could see why you hated meters as you added utility yet hit low but those four have only one person to blame if they don't hit high.. themselves.. either you should have speced better... geared up... or learned a better rotation.

Never said I was low DPS. Just not as much as someone with a cookie cutter spec. Or at least as PUG leaders(raid or heroic) thought. I wasn't being outdpsed by tanks or anything. I was part of that tier of DPS classes at the top of the meter. Gear and rotation was fine for where I was. Only thing that could be pointed out was spec, and it was competitive against the cookie cutters. At least before Wrath. I made some modifications to stay competitive after that, but it just wasn't who the character was. I dual specced to mutilate for raids, but then just lost interest.


Also, you should know that I am an empathetic person so most of the examples I cite are not my own, save this one about the rogue. Just feel for others(might be a character flaw or something) and don't like to see good people being turned down because of a number. I knew the people and knew they were solid raiders/group mates.

[Zyfer]

people that keep posting about their "suggestion's" of how to make a game better but are really making posts about what they think will make the game easier are just pathetic.

I still respect opinions, this is mine...

your pathetic, you need to find inside of you what satisfaction is!

[Hackiedoodle]

Different instances, different content patches different progression, different gating techniques.

The gear available in ulduar wasn't nearly as overkill as the gear available in ICC. Also the classes were balanced to do absurd DPS in ICC. Dramatically more so than the gap between naxx and uld, and uld and totc.

Also anyone that says X class should be Y on the dps meter is a newb, different encounters have different classes/specs excelling. (This part isn't addressed to hackie)

I listed the February date for H Lich King, because that was the date heroic ICC was available, after the gating.

I personally haven't read anything to back up whether or not the DPS increase was not proportional to the encounters in H ICC.

Here's a MMOChampion poll that suggest H LK is harder- http://www.mmo-champion.com/threads/...unter-in-WoTLK

(of course, take MMOChamp with a grain of salt :P)

Don't forget that Algalon had a 1 hour spawn timer. H LK had the 50 attempt limit.

[Sire]

I know, it's troubling.

If only they knew...

I'm sure they do.

which proves once again you have never been in a top 100 guild as a leader or as an officer.

You don't get into the top 100 having no effort. Wanting something badly enough disillusions you.