Non-reaver tank spec?

[Sebb]

You can slap just about anything you want together to tank anything below ID. I tanked Zilas with 32rb/26vk/8 pal and did 2.2k dps for the fight, no relic tanking gear.

Unfortunately ID is a different matter, and I'm sure they're working on a solution to the Reaver dilemma.

I had fun time tanking Garau in 22RB/44VK just to see if I could port during obliteration

And I'm pretty sure they are not. My guess is they're not doing anything to fix the souls until xpac...which is why my sub expires at the end of the month.

[Viscid]

38 points in reaver, the idea itself is putrid.

I giggled.

[nocks]

You should try 26VK/20PL/20WL.

I like this build much more for clearing dungeons than I like 38 Reaver. You have to remember that a lot of 38 Reaver's mitigation is only going to come once you've stacked all three DoT's on every enemy attacking you. This takes at least 4.5 seconds if everything goes perfectly. If you're fighting a lot of trash, that may be 20-30% of the time that mob is alive. So in those situations, you might end up taking less damage on average with this build Sebb just suggested.

Mainly though, that build has much better agro thanks to having Surge and Pact Conversion. I use this build on everything except the most difficult boss fights.

[Purutzil]

Keep in mind that without 38 reaver your basically making yourself a bland tank. Unfortunately tank speccs in the game aren't very good except for 38 reaver. Take that away and rogues can be considered superior tanks to warriors.

None the less if looking at other tank trees Your best bet really depends on the fight. 20 Warlord is a good investment with the synergy crystal just due to the fact its easy to apply and applies good mitigation so your going to want that. As far as going 'non reaver' your best bet probably would be pally... which honestly isn't all to great. It has some good physical reduction but it falls quite behind in other areas, but it has the most potential for holding through and tanking I believe of the other trees.

VK right now is a good disruption class in pvp but a terrible tank specc. It lacks mitigation and is probably the worst possible tank specc to play in game, unless your talking about some crazy build. Even with a heavy magic damage fight it loses out a lot.

Warlord is pretty useful utility wise but after 20 points you will find yourself applying things that other classes will apply that should already be in the raid. It has better tanking power then VK and group support but its not going to be a great choice in many cases unless your maybe lacking an Archon.

Hopefully they do something to buff the warrior tanking souls so it doesn't feel so limited in options or you gimp yourself.

[MealRain]

/snip

I don't even want to touch this. So much wrong info in here.

[nocks]

Keep in mind that without 38 reaver your basically making yourself a bland tank. Unfortunately tank speccs in the game aren't very good except for 38 reaver. Take that away and rogues can be considered superior tanks to warriors.

None the less if looking at other tank trees Your best bet really depends on the fight. 20 Warlord is a good investment with the synergy crystal just due to the fact its easy to apply and applies good mitigation so your going to want that. As far as going 'non reaver' your best bet probably would be pally... which honestly isn't all to great. It has some good physical reduction but it falls quite behind in other areas, but it has the most potential for holding through and tanking I believe of the other trees.

VK right now is a good disruption class in pvp but a terrible tank specc. It lacks mitigation and is probably the worst possible tank specc to play in game, unless your talking about some crazy build. Even with a heavy magic damage fight it loses out a lot.

Warlord is pretty useful utility wise but after 20 points you will find yourself applying things that other classes will apply that should already be in the raid. It has better tanking power then VK and group support but its not going to be a great choice in many cases unless your maybe lacking an Archon.

Hopefully they do something to buff the warrior tanking souls so it doesn't feel so limited in options or you gimp yourself.

If you're talking only about mitigation...

Reaver > Void Knight > Warlord > Paladin.

None of Warlord's pre-20 stuff is going to work in a Raid, with the exception of Cutting Distraction. Some of the level 28-32 abilities will work in a Raid - only one of them is overwritten by an Archon ability, I believe it is Assault Command but I'm not sure on that. Call to Battle/Spotters Order/Call to Entrench are all going to be overwritten in a Raid setting.

Paladin gets by okay as long as there is no magic damage. His physical mitigation is actually pretty good, assuming he manages to block. However his magic mitigation is lacking by a huge margin when compared to the other three tank specs.

I would argue that even 38 Reaver is a bland tank spec, because it doesn't get any of the coveted 44-point cooldowns. None of our "equal to Justicar" specs do. That's where Trion has screwed us most blatantly.

[apalebluex]

I like this build much more for clearing dungeons than I like 38 Reaver. You have to remember that a lot of 38 Reaver's mitigation is only going to come once you've stacked all three DoT's on every enemy attacking you. This takes at least 4.5 seconds if everything goes perfectly. If you're fighting a lot of trash, that may be 20-30% of the time that mob is alive. So in those situations, you might end up taking less damage on average with this build Sebb just suggested.

Mainly though, that build has much better agro thanks to having Surge and Pact Conversion. I use this build on everything except the most difficult boss fights.

Don't you mean one dot? Blood Fever? Unless I'm missing something, necrotic wounds is useful to pull but not necessary, and soul sickness just has a healing component if you spec into it (not mitigation).

Blood Fever will apply the DR from Binding of Death and also the 5% reduction in chance to hit.

[nocks]

Don't you mean one dot? Blood Fever? Unless I'm missing something, necrotic wounds is useful to pull but not necessary, and soul sickness just has a healing component if you spec into it (not mitigation).

Blood Fever will apply the DR from Binding of Death and also the 5% reduction in chance to hit.

I think you're right, there. For some reason I assumed that each one applied 3%, rather than any of them applying the full 9%.

This is what happens when I try to rationalize Trion's design decisions.

[Sebb]

If you're talking only about mitigation...

Reaver > Void Knight > Warlord > Paladin.

It's hard to compare straight up. There are a couple issues.

1. Reaver is the only tree that gives us mitigation for spending more than 26 points.
2. The amount if mitigation in each tree is unequally distributed. Paladin only gets 3% to magic. Warlord 6% to all, VK 8% to all and another 3% to magic. Reaver, for reasons unknown, gives 19% to everything. Meaning spending 38 points in reaver is better than 16 in WL AND 26 in VK AND 15 into Paladin (minus gift effects).
3. Paladin gets physical mitigation through unyielding defense, which is more OP than BoD in some ways. The problem is it requires you to block.

The net effect is that non reaver builds cannot match up for magic defense. The only way they even out for physical mitigation is through UD. On average you take about the same, but when you don't block you get hit 20%+ harder.

[Sebb]

I think you're right, there. For some reason I assumed that each one applied 3%, rather than any of them applying the full 9%.

This is what happens when I try to rationalize Trion's design decisions.

It was this way on PTS.

And BF -hit is not effective in a raiding situation except against adds and trash.