AP Scaling and other DPS changes to the Warrior going up to PTS

[MiO]

I'd rather they just keep the margin for ST DPS between 2h and DW much closer (100-200... or less).

You know, this one liner is said in this thread more than any other but it still means one thing. One weapon set is better than the other.

[Majorin]

Yup. They are basically duplicating the cleric in regards to dps capability and soul choices (aoe, single target) and destroying relevant soul synergy or creativity in regards to warrior dps spec soul combinations.

Good thing warriors can still heal like clerics. Oh wait..... If any class needs or even requires dps souls that have strong AOE and single target dps it is warriors.

Yet another design flaw and poor direction of the game. The devs are going to get wake up call with massive lost subs and 90% of the player base Clerics soon. Only an idiot would devote hours of time and money to a game with class balance this inherently unfair and broken.

Or perhaps Atrius realizes this fact (it is obvious) and will make adjustments when the game goes live.

[XxShunsuixX]

38-22-6 beats the old 40/26 spec.

40/26 is still ahead.

[Sebb]

So after some extensive testing with full t3Pa and full ID Test gear, here are my thoughts about the current PTS changes:

Keep 51cha/15rb as it is with DB only working on physical (yes I really mean this)
The AOE in this spec is a beast doing ~7.7k on 3 targets, while only doing ~3k ST.
All good for an aoe spec.

There needs to be a ST champion spec. Champion finishers need a big improvement.

Trim off 44para/20cha/2rb dw abit, atm its st dps is ~3.7k can be lowered by 100-200
Can be done by nerfing deadly grace abit.

Yea DG is probably the best thing to look at.

Boost 41rb/21cha/2rvr, dps is at ~3.4k
Give it 100-200dps more making it a viable 2h st dps spec
Can be done by lowering cd of frost strike to 4sec while boosting elemental touch by a marginal
Frost strike -> thunder strike abit bugged, bonus doesn't apply to secondary hits of the thunder strike but applies to first hit.
Decent aoe on ~5.7k on 3 targets

I'm not sure why you'd do 41/21/2 and not 39/23/2. I wish they'd do something about RB/Champ rotations feeling so slow, but people seem to like this build for some reason.

BM is looking good tested a 39cha/21bm/6rb, ignored the extra ap from DS. Used FB and TS as finishers, dps ~3.4k fine for a support spec.
Around ~5.5k on 3 targets using BF, Titan and fb as finishers with bm crystal, also fine for a support spec.

Why is BM suddenly a support spec? When this isn't even a BM spec. And everything the BM brings to the raid is overwritten by another class except 2% of the essence aura.

[paper]

Why is BM suddenly a support spec? When this isn't even a BM spec. And everything the BM brings to the raid is overwritten by another class except 2% of the essence aura.

Which only affects your party as opposed to the entire raid.

[Angryweasel]

Why is BM suddenly a support spec? When this isn't even a BM spec. And everything the BM brings to the raid is overwritten by another class except 2% of the essence aura.

Why isn't it a BM spec?

Pet used? check
Aura used? check
BM abilities used? check

BM spec? Check

40/26 is still ahead.

All the tries I've done have put it behind by a few hundred dps are you sure that your statement is correct?

[LocoOne]

Will try out the 39rb/23champ/2rvr on pts soonish.

As for BM being a support spec, i feel it is atm since its dps is lower and it brings a unique buff to the raid, if only it worked.

While i do agree that these current BM spec isn't real bm spec, more like a champion with a pet. Fact still stand that it's using a pet.

Might just be me that dont want BM to be top dps, never really liked pets but that's just 1 opinion out of many.

[Rizaz]

How does it make sense to have ranged dps equal to melee dps. It is a fundamental flaw with the overall dps goals. Melee will always have less time on the target due to mechanics. Making it so everything is equal on a practice dummy seems silly. Now raid encounter dps results should take this into account but even then it is not exact. I can give multiple examples of this... Like being assigned to interupts, moving to get adds, vs. Others who may be focusing only on dps.

This is still the wrong goal.

I'll repeat what I have said before:

Melee dps (warrior, rogue, cleric) should always out parse ranged dps on a stationary target dummy. In an actual raid environment with raid mechanics like boss mob movement, AoE dodging, add switches, etc., melee and ranged dps should end up parsing about the same. It's unfortunate that raid mechanics in Rift are more unfriendly to melee dps than ranged dps, but that's the way things are today and the dps scaling should account for that.

When all is said and done in 1.8, warrior dps parses on the stationary dummy better outparse rogue ranged specs and mages.

Maybe so. I've thought about this, but there are casting disadvantages that are being ignored in both of your posts. For example: If we have a fight that forces a lot of movement (ie a "run around guurloth mechanic, zilas laser, or akylios breath/wave, etc) then casters lose a huge chunk of their dps. Much like we do with disconnect mechanics (prince hylas, estrode, matron, etc).

[Undrsiege]

That was before the most recent set of BM nerfs, and it was with 40/26, so was actually high champion, and then the rest BM.

It seemed you used only BM skills and finishers in that parse besides frenzied strike, disruptive strike and stormblade...

[Sebb]

It seemed you used only BM skills and finishers in that parse besides frenzied strike, disruptive strike and stormblade...

Disruptive = 38 champ though.

This would be a losing patch for BM if there is no viable spec beyond 26 points into. In my mind, which ever soul has more points = main soul.

In 51 champ ST spec, you never use any champion abilities besides disruptive/frenzied strike. That's broke imo

[paper]

It seemed you used only BM skills and finishers in that parse besides frenzied strike, disruptive strike and stormblade...

Yea, but the only reason it was doing damage was because of the champion passivises, which recently lost their synergy with BM bleeds.

[paper]

All the tries I've done have put it behind by a few hundred dps are you sure that your statement is correct?

I was doing just under 3100 as 40/26/0 in my live gear and pa, self buffed(enraged + slayers + storm) as of Wednesday evening. I'll try out 39/21/6 this evening and see what happens.

[Undrsiege]

This would be a losing patch for BM if there is no viable spec beyond 26 points into. In my mind, which ever soul has more points = main soul.

For every 1 person that likes BM it seems 10 hate it...

[Sebb]

For every 1 person that likes BM it seems 10 hate it...

Horrible, god awful pet AI.

[Undrsiege]

Horrible, god awful pet AI.

All pet souls need to have all abilities,buffs and dps moved off pet and into the main soul... The only thing the pet should be good for is some free auto attack and looks.....