AP Scaling and other DPS changes to the Warrior going up to PTS

[Sebb]

198% is the maximum base amount of additive damage from Tot5R, WS and RF if you spend 66 points into a DPS soul. 5% extra on top of that isn't really going to make much of a difference.

3% multiplicative >>>>>> 5% additive.

Right. Then you get things like deadly strikes, SLI, crystal bonus, etc

[Sekhmet The Fierce]

Right. Then you get things like deadly strikes, SLI, crystal bonus, etc

Aye, it gets a little inflated with the additive damage bonuses. Shame really, but I think to change most of that would require a serious overhaul on top of what's already been done, and I think enough has been butchered to get us where we are now.

[mattya802]

I don't parse much on dummy but if fs does 35% of total damage and crystal increases it by 10%. Then wouldn't it make it a 3.5% Dps increase? So around 100 Dps based of posted parses. Once again I don't know if its a straight increase or anything but just assuming.

10% isn't exactly 10% though. Like you guys are stating, due to already high additive bonus that 10% becomes what? 3%? So 3% of 35% is 1.05% increase ~ 31 dps.

He doesn't do it in a good way, but PF is kind of right here.

[Sebb]

Summary of current feedback & Suggestions (3/19):

Riftblade:
It's looking a lot better now than what it was before. The pointwise scaling in ET works well. I like the changes to EB and the new finisher.

Suggestion: Change AOTR to make it so that it enhances all elemental damage by 50% (maybe lower) damage instead of just burst damage by 50%. This opens up champion to pair with as well as paragon and makes 2h weapons near equally viable as DW weapons. As a niche, I'd say let AOTR also use two weapon enchantments for PB fun.


Champion:
I'd say most of this tree is really good at the 51 level. The only complaints I have are that: 1) There's very little in the tree higher than 22 points aside from the root abilities. Proper timing is fun for pvp, but in a raid setting not so much. Bloodthirst, Overrun, proper timing, blood frenzy - pretty much pvp focused at the top of the tree. Also, debilitating strike is of debatable usage. 2) Punishing blow still doesn't hit hard enough to warrant use.

Suggestions:
1. Change Debilitating strike to a finisher that does the same damage as Power Strike, but increases AP by x% for 10 seconds. Switch with Mark of Extermination. This creates a finisher rotation for us.
2. Make Blood Thirst usable after a critical strike with punishing blow or death blow instead of just after a KB.
3. Make Deadly Strikes apply to all physical damage (attack point consuming abilities too).


Paragon:
Nothing to really say here. The 44/20/2 build is really solid and familiar. My only complaint: Weapon Master procs seem REALLY slow. Swift blades is kinda lol.

Suggestions:
1. Make Swift Blades a 24 second CD instead of 25. The paragon rotations are all 12 seconds.
2. Make Swift Blades give +crit % like Fight as one does.
3. Make Weapon Master procs instant.



Beastmaster:
I'm admittedly a noob at BM, but I spent considerable time trying to make rotations work at deep BM levels. One thing i noticed was that it's impossible to keep 5 bleeds up on your own while keeping Fight as One and Primal Fury going. There's also a lot of fluff in the tree. As a result, 51 BM is parsing really far below where it should be.

Suggestions:
1. Make Primal Fury 12% per bleed up to 3 bleeds. This makes it much more feasible for a BM to do while keeping other buffs up.
2. Make Primal Fury last 30 seconds just like Fight as One.
3. Change ties that bind to reduce the damage your pet takes by 10/20/30% to make them much less susceptible to aoe damage.
4. Consider making Bond of Alacrity usable in combat
5. Diversion strike needs to do damage comparable to Rift Strike with a comparable cool down.



Again these are my suggestions, others may be inclined to disagree

[Achamian]

10% isn't exactly 10% though. Like you guys are stating, due to already high additive bonus that 10% becomes what? 3%? So 3% of 35% is 1.05% increase ~ 31 dps.

He doesn't do it in a good way, but PF is kind of right here.

I wasn't sure if it was additive or multiplicative. But, I have read every page of this thread and every parse posted uses the bm crystal for st usage. If pfalcon IS right, why haven't any parses been posted stating otherwise? You can say "its additive not multiplicative so its only a 30 Dps increase" but all numbers ive seen show the difference sebb is stating.

[Sebb]

I wasn't sure if it was additive or multiplicative. But, I have read every page of this thread and every parse posted uses the bm crystal for st usage. If pfalcon IS right, why haven't any parses been posted stating otherwise? You can say "its additive not multiplicative so its only a 30 Dps increase" but all numbers ive seen show the difference sebb is stating.

It's probably about somewhere in between. I parsed the FS version again and it's consistently coming out high. My PS parse has a low crit RNG (only 31% for PS).

[Kedon]

Beastmaster

The cat doesn't seem to 'quick recover' his health when out of combat like other calling pets seem to. Not sure if it's intended or not but its a little annoying when trying to use it to solo.

Kinship and Primal Recovery are still extremely weak pet heals. They don't cut the mustard in Ember Isle and they're certainly not going to do a thing to help keep the cat alive during a group or raid. Give them some very significant AP scaling or make them "% of max health" based instead. Hm, maybe even change Primal Senses into a talent that improves said heals?

Spoils of the Hunt's new description is a bit misleading. It kind of implies that the healing is based off the Warrior's damage, not the cat's.

Also not sure about Fight as One. Trying to keep it, a 5-bleed Primal Rage and your bleeds up feels... awkward. Having one SLI-copycat ability is enough I think. Maybe it really should be a Passive or some kind of on-crit reactionary instead of a Finisher.

[Flashmemory]

suggestion

Debilitating Strike: Reduces the enemies life by 10-20% for 6 secs.
Bloodthirst: After killing an opponent with Deathblow regen 25% of you maximum Hp to 25% over 4sec.
Blood frenzy: further increases your Bloodthirst to 50% of your maximum HP over 6sec.

[AlienFromBeyond]

suggestion

Debilitating Strike: Reduces the enemies life by 10-20% for 6 secs.
Bloodthirst: After killing an opponent with Deathblow regen 25% of you maximum Hp to 25% over 4sec.
Blood frenzy: further increases your Bloodthirst to 50% of your maximum HP over 6sec.

These are terrible, how about no.

[LocoOne]

Atrius think you need to look into the blood fevor damage in pvp.


on live same gear it crit a ~1k valor player for 1.1-1.3k damage, while it on pts same spec it does 1.3k - 1.6k

spec used was 32 rb 26 cha 8rb in p40 with 2h sword and full sword PA t2

maybe reduce the 50% weapon damage to 25% weapon damage.

[PFalcon]

I wasn't sure if it was additive or multiplicative. But, I have read every page of this thread and every parse posted uses the bm crystal for st usage. If pfalcon IS right, why haven't any parses been posted stating otherwise? You can say "its additive not multiplicative so its only a 30 Dps increase" but all numbers ive seen show the difference sebb is stating.

Because the only people who tend to parse have the same focus and priorities. No other kind of player really goes to a PTS dummy and starts beating on it but a min/maxer. They're a very tight cohort.

They all use the BM crystal for ST usage because once anything else has been deemed inferior it's ignored. Power striking left their minds the second they saw Fierce Strike hit for more than it. Doesn't matter if it's 60 dps and most of the time you won't even be able to tell who'se running it on straight simple meter.

[Blackblade]

Atrius think you need to look into the blood fevor damage in pvp.


on live same gear it crit a ~1k valor player for 1.1-1.3k damage, while it on pts same spec it does 1.3k - 1.6k

spec used was 32 rb 26 cha 8rb in p40 with 2h sword and full sword PA t2

maybe reduce the 50% weapon damage to 25% weapon damage.

Maybe this is the much desired patch for warriors in PvP.

From your numbers, it definitely seems to have been buffed. In general, overall damage should be higher I reckon.

Buffs

• Point per investment in DPS trees increases from 2% - 3% (probably the biggest difference)
• Ability effects being affected more by AP now
• Rift Fury now affects Physical damage as well (Frenzied strike for SS builds). This will open up alot of new builds in PvP.

Nerfs

• Enhanced Burst is no longer multiplicative
• Nerf to SB which has a multiplicative effect
• Nerf to W-DPS in place of AP

4 piece HK crystal should no longer be desireable as well.

Not tested PvP on the PTS yet I do think it should be a buff.

[Aasterinian]

Atrius think you need to look into the blood fevor damage in pvp.


on live same gear it crit a ~1k valor player for 1.1-1.3k damage, while it on pts same spec it does 1.3k - 1.6k

spec used was 32 rb 26 cha 8rb in p40 with 2h sword and full sword PA t2

maybe reduce the 50% weapon damage to 25% weapon damage.

what does a 1k crit matter when casters can spam off 3k crits on 1200 valor players? not really caring if war dps goes up a bit quite frankly...its needed.

[Aasterinian]

overall from what i am reading i don't think i am personally looking forward to this change...i get the impression that its bad and getting forced on us like every other change ever made to war...barring the tank change i guess.

[Bayne420]

All I ask is we have atleast 2 specs that can do 100-200 more dps then Rogues and Mages will be doing in 1.8 and stay better tanks then these 1.8 clerics... As these r the only 2 roles we can fill

I would rather have another quick "fix" then another patch pushed to live when it's not ready. Especially while working on Infernal Dawn

PS. With the new nerf to touch of life we r now 100% dependant on pocket heals, when with a healing debuff it already does 50% of health... Other classes need to learn to use there cc and stop screaming "nerf warriors"

Atrius, you my man r a nerfing machine... And don't u let anyone tell u different!