PTS paragon

[Tisch]

OK well ive been testing multiple 44 paragon and 51 paragon builds and even though im actually somewhat content with the numbers and play there is 1 issue that really bugs me. when pulling for the consistant damage that the new Way of the Wind provides for abilities that require Dual wielding. Rising Waterfall never procs it. why? because it does not require dual wielding. ok i can understand that this might be a big skill for other specs but could we get like a change on way of the wind before it hits live to also proc rising waterfall.

such as

Way of the Wind

all abilites that require two weapons deals xx weapon damage
Rising waterfall deals extra xx weapon damage

[Jalariel]

OK well ive been testing multiple 44 paragon and 51 paragon builds and even though im actually somewhat content with the numbers and play there is 1 issue that really bugs me. when pulling for the consistant damage that the new Way of the Wind provides for abilities that require Dual wielding. Rising Waterfall never procs it. why? because it does not require dual wielding. ok i can understand that this might be a big skill for other specs but could we get like a change on way of the wind before it hits live to also proc rising waterfall.

such as

Way of the Wind

all abilites that require two weapons deals xx weapon damage
Rising waterfall deals extra xx weapon damage

try path of the raptor instead of rw. with the buff from wotw, it might do more damage.

[Yraen]

try path of the raptor instead of rw. with the buff from wotw, it might do more damage.

It does.

My spam macro with 38 Para (on PTS) looks like

Path of the Hurricane
Path of the Raptor
Rising Waterfall (Rarely triggers)
Path of the Wind
Dual Strike
Reactives

[Belgan]

Paragon with 3pts in Force of Will should always use Raptor/Hurricane > Rising Waterfall. The only time RW> Raptor and RW ~= Hurri is when you 5pts in 5-rings and 0pts FoW. If you add Way of the Wind, Raptor/Hurri always > RW. The only situation where you would want to use RW is when adds may be a problem. In those cases use Raptor/Death Touch before RW. Hurri/DT does cost more power than RW so that may be something to think about.

So follow up priority is (if you don't have power issues): Hurricane > Raptor > Death Touch > Rising Waterfall
With that the chance of RW going off is very low. All those follow ups do more damage than RW.

On PTS Raptor and Hurricane are still not affected by Teaching of the Five Rings. But they did fix Hurricane to work with Force of Will. RW and Raptor/Hurricane benefit from FoW differently, Raptor/Hurricane benefits more.

PTS data
Blue line and above is mathcraft, below the blue are numbers I gathered on PTS. Yellow numbers are the pts results corresponding to the blue mathcraft. Yeah, the mathcraft isn't exact but it gets pretty close in all weapon setups and AP levels I've tested.

@Yraen: Put Path of the Wind after Dual Strike, it does less dmg than DS+DG and should only be used at range. And Path of the Wind is still 1H+stat stick even while requiring DW.

(Looks like there is a patch for PTS today, so some of the info above may change.)

[jaym7018]

way of the wind is pretty underwhelming to me.

[Kutsuu Isback]

What paragon needs is another dual wield only single target melee range followup around ~32 points in the spec that is better than rising waterfall.

This would give the option to use New followup + raptor when you need to single target DPS, or new followup + hurricane for "max" damage output.

[Mdorty]

If they fixed AP scaling for warriors, and gave paragons a passive (or deep in the tree buff) that made all finishers off the GCD, a deep paragon spec would be a very viable DPS spec.

This would help the problem in comparing paragon's DW with rogue's DW. Our GCD is .5 seconds longer, and this would help with that a lot. Right now, using finishers that sound awesome, like shifting blades and reaping harvest, actually lower your DPS when compared to using something like fiery burst.

[Caeldan]

Is way of the wind mathematically better though?

Just my quick testing on PTS - it's essentially just an extra 'autoattack'. I think I was seeing hits for about 60 or 70 a swing.

If you consider followups are roughly every other attack... you'd need bonus damage of about 150 to beat it yeah? (This is really rough head math) Even worst case I think 200 bonus would be most required.

So basically you're looking at I guess when a regular hit is 800 it's always a better choice... but I know from past parsing you're probably looking overall at anywhere between a 33-50% crit chance on followup attacks and that's only in expert gear.

So if you're hitting for 600 and critting for 1200 33% of the time... over every three followup hits you're looking at a bonus of 400 with mountain... but for wind you'd be looking at that being about the same (figure 7 hits at 60 a pop is 420).

Seems to me like mountain actually might scale with higher gear better.

[Dashel]

Paragon with 3pts in Force of Will should always use Raptor/Hurricane > Rising Waterfall. ...

Good info thanks. It might change but still good to have this reference point.

[Tisch]

So follow up priority is (if you don't have power issues): Hurricane > Raptor > Death Touch > Rising Waterfall
With that the chance of RW going off is very low. All those follow ups do more damage than RW.

didnt think of using death touch not bad but im just saying why do our our ranged attacks do more than the 1 that requires us 3m from the guy doesnt make sense to me also its just 1 little followup to and imo all followups should be DW cause itd be the offhand with the followup attack. just sayin.

on PTS in T3 it deals an extra 100 damage ya thats not much but the thing is that makes it better than mountain in certain situations is how in some battles you cannot stay in melee or it is best to be in ranged so that new buff boom. also with the correct rotation it might be better. ive meant to test it on the parser but the stupid thing is bugging out on me ill probably need to reinstall it.