Tablets, Fervor, and Energy - Problems and Solutions

[TroubleMagnet]

This is what I meant by a slap in the face. Giving an energy aura required only by rogues, to every class except rogues (bard excluded), would effectively be a statement on Trion's part. Specifically, they would be stating that Rogues are meant to be reliant on other players in order to use their competitive specs, which is a limitation not put in place for other callings.

Personally, I'd be fine with that; but only because I essentially never solo in this game (given I only log on to do daily randoms and raid). People who do solo frequently would deserve to be a bit angry about it, though.

Again, I also feel that everyone can agree it'd still be better than the current situation, in which you're basically boned unless you're in a group with a chloro healer or bard.

No, it wouldn't be better than the current situation as I'd be far to angry to log into the game.

[Scrumdiddly]

No, it wouldn't be better than the current situation as I'd be far to angry to log into the game.

Well, if nothing else it'd be funny for a few seconds just as a means of trolling the entire rogue calling. Some great stuff would probably pop up on these very forums.

Side Note: my post should have said "Specifically, they would be stating that Rogues are meant to be reliant on other players in order to use <a spec other than BD or MM>, which is a limitation not put in place for other callings."

Also yes, BD still gets starved, blah blah blah

[Akizuki]

in all reality if a rogue could perform at peak ability without the need for supplements = nerfbat

true story


'the squeaky wheel gets the grease'

careful what you ask for, might not be what you want

Nerf what exactly? Our damage profile is balanced around the 1s GCD not around energy starvation.
That's why rogues are competitive when they have fervor/LE and completely fold if they don't have it.

[Gynxz]

This is not a fix, a good fix, a half fix, nor a bad fix. They solved a different issue. We are starved and will still be... as much before and after. All they did was change the COST of being as starved for casuals and give a minor energy to non progression guilds. They didn't fix our starvation.. just allowed us to STARVE without spending plat for energy.

If you dont have a Chloro healer in a 5 man you will hit starvation before that 1rps ever helps and any progression guild will still buy tablets for the buff. The only place I would see a change is in Old raiding content since I dont pop tablets for that but having fervor/LE might help strech out starvation a little bit so you get a few ticks of that extra 1rps before starving.

[Qan]

They didn't fix our starvation.. just allowed us to STARVE without spending plat for energy.

This x1000

[Dunharrow]

Pretty much can assure you, I won't be responding to a new avatar based on fervor.

~Daglar

Good. Thanks for working for us. Many of us really do appreciate it.

[DTM300]

This is so stupid. EVERY single person saying we'd have a dps increase is talking about being able to use EW every 20 seconds? Then nerf EW a little bit. Problem solved. Boost energy regen, slight nerf to EW.

Anyone disagree?

I know I'm willing to trade energy problems across all souls for "the ability" that will raise our dps in the process of doing so.

[TroubleMagnet]

This is so stupid. EVERY single person saying we'd have a dps increase is talking about being able to use EW every 20 seconds? Then nerf EW a little bit. Problem solved. Boost energy regen, slight nerf to EW.

Anyone disagree?

I know I'm willing to trade energy problems across all souls for "the ability" that will raise our dps in the process of doing so.

Totally agree. Even though testing has indicated we won't see a big increase in DPS I'd be totally fine with nurfing our DPS back down to current levels (via EW nurf or something else) if it turns out to be a big boost.

I want a QOL improvement, not a DPS boost. Our DPS relative to other callings is fine now.

[Wulf9]

This is so stupid. EVERY single person saying we'd have a dps increase is talking about being able to use EW every 20 seconds? Then nerf EW a little bit. Problem solved. Boost energy regen, slight nerf to EW.

Anyone disagree?

I know I'm willing to trade energy problems across all souls for "the ability" that will raise our dps in the process of doing so.

Exactly. The potential impact on rogue dps is a good reason not to fix it tomorrow. It does not explain why the issue should go ignored for months. Just like with this tablet change, a net zero impact on dps is fine.

[Ravynia]

As a 'unique' idea, what about making rogue movement increase energy regeneration? Rogues (for the most part) are supposed to be a 'mobile' class. Why not incorporate that in to the solution?

[DTM300]

As a 'unique' idea, what about making rogue movement increase energy regeneration? Rogues (for the most part) are supposed to be a 'mobile' class. Why not incorporate that in to the solution?

Uhhh, no. Warriors, since they wear plate, are supposed to move slower, nerf their movement speed. Also up their power cost because swinging big weapons while wearing plate should take a lot of power.

No.

[Viscio]

The problem is that DPS gets adjusted based mostly on how classes compare in a raid setting, where generally every form of regen is available.

So when a class gets pushed forward to be more along the lines of lets say the rogue BS spec, this is in a raid setting. The problem however is that our BS spec can only perform that DPS with all that regen available.

When put into a solo / 5-man situation the BS spec is NOT playable (with or without a tablet). In fact the only "DPS" spec available is MM. This would be fine if other classes had the same problem, the same need for "energy" buffs.

The fact is that they don't. Other classes can pour out the same, or close to the top DPS they have in a raid setting without having that regen available. Here's where things go wrong.

I'm glad that I don't have to farm tablets, but that does not fix the actual issue at hand. The issue isn't about making fervor useless, it's about making us even in regen to other classes. If a warrior can spam his AE solo without running out of power then so should a rogue. I shouldn't run out of energy spamming simple combo point generating abilities.

A choice was made to help out warriors with their power regen, my warrior doesn't run out of power and doesn't need fervor. How can the fervor arguement now be used against rogues?

I just don't see how it can be fair that only rogues suffer so greatly in non raid settings.

[barrysneaks]

Exactly. The potential impact on rogue dps is a good reason not to fix it tomorrow. It does not explain why the issue should go ignored for months. Just like with this tablet change, a net zero impact on dps is fine.

Zyzyx already posted parses of sinrs and ranger under chain VoJs and the "potential impact" on rogue dps was far from stellar.

[Mirimon]

Exactly. The potential impact on rogue dps is a good reason not to fix it tomorrow. It does not explain why the issue should go ignored for months. Just like with this tablet change, a net zero impact on dps is fine.

I've said it before, we have alrdy tested what the "DPS IMPACT" of being a rogue w/o starvation would be, in all dps specs... it ranges from barely noticeable to slight. Ask zyzyx and the few others who established some data via proper experimentation. in the end, the "gain" still had is in the same ranking of dps order. It dod not cause us to shoot over the heads of anybody, even ourselves. in the best spec.. it's about the difference between a ranger with a pet and a ranger w/o a pet. provided on a boss that doesnt move and you only have to faceroll all day.

this "fix" simply makes being a rogue cheaper, JUST AS STARVED, but cheaper to raid with.

[Shieldy]

i have to admit i missed the last 4 pages, ok i skipped them i didnt miss them, but how bout this.

make LE = Fervor. it makes no sense why one is 10 and one is 13. that way you dont have to give up fervor for runspeed on progression fights. it would also help in 10 mans where you never have access to a archon, chlor, and bard at the same time.

the next step would be to ask, why do mage healers have LE and cleric healers dont. obviously you can see where im going here, give a fervor equivlant energy cost reduction to them as well.

i dont see why any of this would be out of line. warrior tanks had spotters, this made 1 warrior tank per raid almost mandatory, bam they gave spotters equivelant to bards and archons.