Upcoming Rogue changes for 1.7

[Hellebron]

Isn't 51 sab still a 2 min cd? If that were changed to a 30 second cd, maybe it would be awesome.

1 minute I think.

I mean, it's not fantastic, but it's fun and a good ability that has a lot of good aplications in a raid or party environment, expecially paired with Incriminate.

[DTM300]

1 minute I think.

I mean, it's not fantastic, but it's fun and a good ability that has a lot of good aplications in a raid or party environment, expecially paired with Incriminate.

I've not seen a 51 sab in a raid in at least 6 months. Not even for lols. Highest I've seen is like 44 or 46.

[Gynxz]

I've not seen a 51 sab in a raid in at least 6 months. Not even for lols. Highest I've seen is like 44 or 46.

Cuz anyone higher than 44-46 (including estrode) would be the loled at

[DTM300]

Cuz anyone higher than 44-46 (including estrode) would be the loled at

I did include: Not even for lols .

Which is exactly why the 51 pt sab ability is pretty much useless.

[Hellebron]

Well yah, but move Rapid Setup to Nightblade 51 pointer or something, then you would be talking.

[Durango]

i don't think this 2 minor change can push BD in part with BS. We are talking for a difference of 20/30% dps , if not more.

The differential between 51BD/10MM/5RS and BS in BiS gear is roughly 10% currently. BD currently scales 50-60% better with AP than BS.

1 : change HK crystal 4 piece bonus. Bd have the worst crystal , you need 51 point for our crystal 100% effective and 40 point for 50% effective. When you compare to others....... this crystal is just ********.

The crystal just needs to affect all rhythmic actions and then it will be fine.

2 : add a "proc on crit" condition to Strike back , reprisal , and turn the tide. Add an ICD for strike back , increase cd for Reprisal.

You cannot just add a "proc on crit" condition to Strike Back and Reprisal as it would in general be too OP. Realistically it would have to be roughly a 20% base chance on crit and 2% per point spent in BD above 11.

[Durango]

Said it before, I'll say it again - BD HK 4p needs a change. Maybe a flat 30 second reduction in all rhymic abilities excluding sprint and side steps? Maybe crit damage increase by 2% per crit stacks up to 20? Maybe increases the charges on DD from 3 to 5? Something.

Only realistic change is to make it affect all rhythmic abilities. All your other suggestions would actually be DPS reductions.

Isn't dancing steel still on a 2 min cd? Not sure it would do too much but, can that be lowered to 1 min? I'm not sure this ability is even used short of for lolz.

No one really uses Dancing Steel as it is a flat DPS loss currently, even in AoE situations.

[Durango]

Apparently they think Dancing Steel and Living Flame are such awesome skills they need to be wasted on a 2min cooldown.

Trion, no one uses them, fix them.

While living flame does need a buff, it is in a much better place than dancing steel. Living flame is a several 1000 DPS increase when used. The only reason no one goes 51 into NB is because the bonus from the 20% crit damage for 2 points in sin is so good.

[Kedon]

Bladedancer - Dancing Steel
That bringa up a good point about Dancing Steel. It starts off kinda 'okay' at low gear levels but falls away due to it not having any bonus from AP (even Nightblade's Living Flame gets a +100% AP bonus). It also won't benefit from the new Combat Expertise as it does not add a combo point!

I would consider adding Dancing Steel to Contra Tempo or add a new root passive that specifically improves Dancing Steel; in a similar fashion that Nightblade's Blackout improves Scourge of Darkness. Since Dancing Steel is channelled (no Twin Strikes while you're busy twirling around) and on a long cooldown it really should do a lot of AoE damage.

[hejtmane]

Also can we make compound attack a non dps loss to use. I mean due to Deadly dance + twin strike using compound strike means you do less aoe dps. Which makes the attack just as useless as it was before the last change in 1.5 or just delete the dam thing and make it a passive ability that does something.

[Enaki]

I did include: Not even for lols .

Which is exactly why the 51 pt sab ability is pretty much useless.

It would actually be a great 32 point branch ability, and a whole lot more useful than Land Mines.

[Atheres]

Hello Aillion.

Good news you have some plan for BD , but i think it's not enough.

you need more change to make BD viable.
Here is a list of suggestions :

- make Reprisal (adjust cd to 8 seconds like serpent strike), Turn the tide and strike back (add a condition like cannot happen more than one every 5s) proc of Crit too , or a % to proc on each crit.

- up the value of Turn the tide to 20% more damage.

-Make deadly dance proc from Blade dancer finisher , not just Deadly strike. This way , we are viable in Aoe , since our Aoe finisher is a loss in dps when we are doing Aoe. A non sense for me.

- Make False blade up our crit and dodge by 5% instead of just dodge. Change Improved false blade too , with a 6% more in crit and dodge instead of just dodge (stack with other buff)

-Change the +5% crit finisher to a + 10 % critical damage or a + 15% AP (just for us , not raidwise) , with duration based on CP

- Switch Blade and soul parity with Dancing Steel and reduce CD for Dancing steel to 30 seconds .

[Durango]

- make Reprisal (adjust cd to 8 seconds like serpent strike), Turn the tide and strike back (add a condition like cannot happen more than one every 5s) proc of Crit too , or a % to proc on each crit.

Stop making ANY suggestions to make Strike back/Reprisal proc on crit unless you understand the ramifications. And NO, ICD = BAD.

- up the value of Turn the tide to 20% more damage.

Does Jack all. would increase DPS by 4ish%

- Switch Blade and soul parity with Dancing Steel and reduce CD for Dancing steel to 30 seconds .

Um no. Only thing that needs to happen with BaSP is the crit damage multiplier needs to be upped about another 20%.

Dancing steel will remain useless with a 0s CD. DS needs a larger AP contribution and needs to grant combo points.

[Kedon]

Dancing steel will remain useless with a 0s CD. DS needs a larger AP contribution and needs to grant combo points.

Keep in mind that having Dancing Steel grant combo points would very likely require it to be changed from a player-centered-AoE into a targetted AoE like Twin Strike and Weapon Flare.

Though that would allow it to benefit from builder damage increase talents (e.g. Deadly Dance, Combat Expertise, Blazing Fury) so it'd be a compromise. Part of Dancing Steel's problem is it is neither a builder or finisher so few things buff it.

I'd be in favour of just giving it a very substantial bonus AP contribution instead by some means or other.

[Coffande]

1.)Change Dancing Steel to a follow up attack after Twin Strike which grants 2CPs and hits 4 targets with maybe 5sec CD which hits as hard as Precision Strike.
2.)Let Contra Tempo increase AP-contribution of Dancing Steel aswell.
3.)Let Compound attack trigger Deadly Dance.
4.)Change 4piece HK bonus to a similar effect like the champion crystal by upping all (melee?) AoE-Attacks by 20-35%.


See what i did there?
Yea.
Fixed rogue AoE-DPS for 2 - 4 targets.

We are decent enough (still not really good, but whatever) for 6-10 targets, but i don't mind rogues focussing on either small amount of enemies (melee-AoE) or huge amount of enemies (Rain of Arrows).