Upcoming Rogue changes for 1.7

[Gery]

What? bloodstalker is one of the most engaging and interesting specs in the game, easily the most fun rotation I've had on my rogue since launch.

If you want to make the rotation even more fun then replace MM with NB and do manual fiery spikes.

Personally I am not a big fan of bloodstalker because it's so situational build. Single target only, behind target, no interrupt, must be 100% at meleerange and preferably not much target changing. Basically it's only good for a few bosses and decent for a couple more. I find myself using NB much more than bloodstalker because of that.

[Zyzyx]

So much wrong in this post i have no idea where to start. First of all, Bloodstalker is one of the best and most enjoyable specs rogues have had since i have been playing. The only players i know that "hate" bloodstalker are ones who are not good enough to use it.

Second of all, Nightblade is closer to Bloodstalker right now than you think, and Sabdancer for AoE? I don't know a single rogue who has run Sabdancer in months. There is no reason to use that spec, ever.

So we cant expect a big "Gyle want bloodstalker nerfed" thread aytime soon?
=P

[Vindicit]

How can you whine about dps when you don't want to do what every class does? maximizing buff and debuff uptime is central to every build. Even worse is you're talking about builds we havent used in 3 months...

Cause Im more useful to my raid then just a single target little b|tch like you are apparently that just wants the "best" specs to get buffs.

[Rosario]

Well the BD buffs look nice, but we really need a buff on our AOE...

In my guild we have a Cleric hk dpser, and im a 51 MM, in Hk cleric can do like 9k DPS AOE, while im lucky if i get 3-5k Aoe dps><

We did a T2 run Random and got into RD, Cleric where doing like 15-19k AOE DPS, while i was lucky if i was at 4-6 k AOE ><...

[Gynxz]

Cause Im more useful to my raid then just a single target little b|tch like you are apparently that just wants the "best" specs to get buffs.

I bet ur really useful Purging with that sab spec. :P
Bard brings more utility that Sab but u dont have all rogues go Bard do you? you do need som Actual DPS in your raid right?

[Am0n]

Whoo!

My BD/Sin PvP spec is going to make people cry again (>'.')>

Aillion you may never talk to us, but today I love you!

[MoonfireSpam]

Well the BD buffs look nice, but we really need a buff on our AOE...

In my guild we have a Cleric hk dpser, and im a 51 MM, in Hk cleric can do like 9k DPS AOE, while im lucky if i get 3-5k Aoe dps><

We did a T2 run Random and got into RD, Cleric where doing like 15-19k AOE DPS, while i was lucky if i was at 4-6 k AOE ><...

A little bit off topic, but perhaps not.

AoE dps doesn't reeeeeally matter, but one was parsed for a bit in guild out of curiousity. Duration doesn't really seem to matter as no one has CDs that really affects AoE. (at least i can't think of any, feel free to correct me and i'll go fetch a longer parse next week) So it was started after the mobs were settled on the tank and ended before something died, so everyone had max targets. AoE dps obviously drops off once stuff starts dying and folks no longer have max targets.

http://img847.imageshack.us/img847/9551/dpszo.jpg

Of the folks that were doing it right, the difference is pretty in-your-face and obvious. The +35% AoE dmg from the champ crystal likely makes up for all of the difference, with PA's accounting for some of the more minor differences... and they'd be about where the rest of us are at without it.

[Gynxz]

Woot for 12 secs parsers!

[MoonfireSpam]

Woot for 12 secs parsers!

It was a spur-of-the-moment parse =P

Who the heck parses aoe packs anyway!

I'll get a longer one next week, but those things die too fast give a good parse.

Though the numbers kinda lined up like you'd expect, not counting the folks who were picking their nose and probably cybering during trash pulls.

[Gery]

When we talk about aoe the thing that gets ignored often is what kind of dps distribution that aoe has on the targets. Warrior aoe is excellent not only because of the raw damage but because it can be done with almost no sacrifice to single target dps. In fact warriors cleave by default even with the normal single target rotation.

When a rogue wants to do aoe it means a huge drop in single target dps. For example MM might do 2k on single target and if it starts aoe then it's like 800-900 per target which is why using MM for aoe is even worse idea than raw numbers would indicate. NB is kind of an exception since it actually gets a single target dps boost from adds but the amount of cleave it can do while maintaining single target dps is extremely minor compared to warriors.

One of the main reasons why sabdancer was so good was the ability to kill all the adds while maintaining solid single target dps. Now sabdancer has been nerfed, it scales really poorly with AP and the saboteur synergy crystal is terrible so that is no longer an option for us.

[Gyle]

NB is kind of an exception since it actually gets a single target dps boost from adds but the amount of cleave it can do while maintaining single target dps is extremely minor compared to warriors.

This is the reason i use NB on Akylios, the cleave damage actually does not decrease your ST by much, since weapon flare hits about 2/3's as hard as your ST abilities. Right now NB is probably the best spec we have for any fight that needs both ST and AoE DPS.

[WarUltima]

Warrior with champion crystal is undoubtfully the highest aoe dps by FAR especially if they know how 2 play and also uses weapon switch to proc PotH as filler/builder and switch back for 3ap bladefury.

Warrior is also the only calling where they have the best of all worlds (Best AoE, ST, Interrupt and of course Way of the Noobs which is game mechanic breaking advantage). Stormcaller has decent AoE but its ST is pathetic compare to RW/Pyrolock and the worst part is stormcaller is unable to sustain their max aoe dps on more than four (4) mobs.

Also properly built 38/28 Pyrolock has no firestorm which is basically the lowest aoe dps in the entire game out of all viable raid specs across all callings. Yes you are looking at MM LoLout spam and out-dps the "oh-so-op" pyrolock by 50% in aoe.

36/30 has decent aoe due to firestorm but the AoE gets trashed by RW and even 51 Inquisitor but 36/30 ST is no where close to 28/38 (you know the mage highest ST dps with the lowest aoe dps spec that everyone QQ about).

Mage is the only calling where if you are running your highest ST dps spec (lets dont even get into the rotation difficulty) you get completely ultra underpowered AoE dps that makes MM aoe looks like GOD.

Be careful what you wishful. And I hope DEV is reading this... I will even make it colorful for yall.

DEV all callings should have comparable ST dps but please make all 4 callings similar to mages where they will suck in aoe completely if they decide to use their highest dps specs.

Yes basically make warrior rogues and clerics to completely suck at aoe if they are doing their top ST, and REQUIRE a different spec for aoe which will suck in ST Dps just like how mage is. And please if possible make the rotation difficulty on par across the board... it sickens me how certain calling has dirty easy rotation yet does great ST dps.

Basically make RW warrior, Bloodstalker and MM rogues, 51 Inquist all on par with pyrolock ST dps but nerf their AoE in those specs so they are all lower than 6k dps with max targets just like how mages are in 28/38.

[Adnoz]

Warrior with champion crystal is undoubtfully the highest aoe dps by FAR especially if they know how 2 play and also uses weapon switch to proc PotH as filler/builder and switch back for 3ap bladefury.

Warrior is also the only calling where they have the best of all worlds (Best AoE, ST, Interrupt and of course Way of the Noobs which is game mechanic breaking advantage). Stormcaller has decent AoE but its ST is pathetic compare to RW/Pyrolock and the worst part is stormcaller is unable to sustain their max aoe dps on more than four (4) mobs.

Also properly built 38/28 Pyrolock has no firestorm which is basically the lowest aoe dps in the entire game out of all viable raid specs across all callings. Yes you are looking at MM LoLout spam and out-dps the "oh-so-op" pyrolock by 50% in aoe.

36/30 has decent aoe due to firestorm but the AoE gets trashed by RW and even 51 Inquisitor but 36/30 ST is no where close to 28/38 (you know the mage highest ST dps with the lowest aoe dps spec that everyone QQ about).

Mage is the only calling where if you are running your highest ST dps spec (lets dont even get into the rotation difficulty) you get completely ultra underpowered AoE dps that makes MM aoe looks like GOD.

Be careful what you wishful. And I hope DEV is reading this... I will even make it colorful for yall.

DEV all callings should have comparable ST dps but please make all 4 callings similar to mages where they will suck in aoe completely if they decide to use their highest dps specs.

Yes basically make warrior rogues and clerics to completely suck at aoe if they are doing their top ST, and REQUIRE a different spec for aoe which will suck in ST Dps just like how mage is. And please if possible make the rotation difficulty on par across the board... it sickens me how certain calling has dirty easy rotation yet does great ST dps.

Basically make RW warrior, Bloodstalker and MM rogues, 51 Inquist all on par with pyrolock ST dps but nerf their AoE in those specs so they are all lower than 6k dps with max targets just like how mages are in 28/38.

Bloodstalker has less AOE than mages in their ST spec, MM is no longer able to be considered a viable ST spec due to low DPS.

[Am0n]

@Aillion, with these new changes to leeching poison, will it actually scale with the buffs you have up? Or will we continue to have to wait for all of our AP buffs to take affect and then apply leeching for it's most potential.

As it stands if you have no ap buff on you and cast Leeching it will not scale as you buff your ap. If you reapply it will then take affect of the new ap level.

Seems a bit strange

[Adnoz]

@Aillion, with these new changes to leeching poison, will it actually scale with the buffs you have up? Or will we continue to have to wait for all of our AP buffs to take affect and then apply leeching for it's most potential.

As it stands if you have no ap buff on you and cast Leeching it will not scale as you buff your ap. If you reapply it will then take affect of the new ap level.

Seems a bit strange

Did not know this, good info.