[Bug] 2 x Saboteurs = mixed up charges

[Vindicit]

hmm
maybe

[Hamish]

I think I get what is going on... I ran into this problem a few times, and its not necessarily a bug with multiple sabo's mixing their charges up, but one sabo mixing up their own.

The problem is that charges have a travel time, and detonate is not. When max ranging and throwing charges, it is possible to detonate before the final charge hits. This is what likely happened.

Input at max range: Spike Spike Spike Spike Spike, Detonate, Shrap Shrap Shrap Shrap Shrap, Detonate.

What actually happened (in theory): Spike Spike Spike Spike, Spike is still flying, Detonate x4 spike, Spike lands. Shrap, Shrap, Shrap, Shrap, Shrap is flying, Detonate 4x shrap, 1 spike. Spike refreshes into 1x spike. Lone shrapnel remains. Repeat.

Solution: when you are > 20m from the mob, wait 1 second before detonating. I've experience this problem many times and I've been aware since to wait to detonate ever since.

What made me realize this in the beginning is often I'd throw 5x shrap and detonate immediately, and I'd only see 4x shrapnel on residual shrapnel debuff. I'd check my parses to see if my 230 hit made me miss, but my hit rate is always 100%, so I realized that the last charge was not landing rather than it was missing.

I noticed this last night as well. You must wait for the fifth charge to land before hitting your det.

[Noburu]

I noticed this last night as well. You must wait for the fifth charge to land before hitting your det.

Yes, of course is much easier if you are pure Sab and the only combo points you are getting are from charges.

[MaxOhm]

Seems like this is in fact a bug, my DPS dropped 500-600 from being in a raid with another sab using the same rotation just today =(

[Zentraedi]

Anyway, I think this issue may be localised to open world RAID RIFTS rather than with INSTANCED DUNGEONS. Something in the mechanic that gets put into effect anytime a rift event is nearby is screwing with the way charges are being stacked and detonated.

Running GS on Friday with another Sab - no issues.

Will report back if it happens again next time I run a Raid Rift if it happens again.

My guild sabos (I'm one of them) had this happen on Lord Greenscale.

[iNaddict]

I havent noticed it.. Though i do notice timer resetting but thats my own fault for mixing charges. because as previously said. the travel time for the charges coupled with lag etc..

[Vindicit]

If you guys read the rest of the topic you would see it has nothing to do with more then 1 Sab

[Noburu]

Again, Ive never seen this happen, even with THREE sabs. Make sure you let the 5th charge LAND before you DETONATE. It does have a travel time.

[Gustuf]

I've double checked my theory on the dummy, and its 100% replicatable, so go test this if you do not believe me.

Goto a boss dummy alone, meaning no other sabos, then back off until you get to max range. Plant 5 spike charges, immediately detonate once GCD is up. Spike duration = 14s. Plant 5 shrapnel as soon as you can, detonate once GCD is up. Spike duration = 14, shrapnel charge = 4@5 seconds. Repeat until you feel convinced.

Round 2: toss 5 spike, wait 2 seconds, detonate, toss 5 shrapnel, wait 2 seconds, detonate. Problem solved.

Again, solution: wait a second before detonating, or else you will either clip your last charge or refresh your spike with 1x spike or both.


edit:
add: actually, there is one part where sabo's charges technically get mixed, it is in the class/charge indicator. The charge indicator is instant and misleading, but if you have 2 sabo's, the maximum number of charges on a mob's charge indicator goes up to 10, 15 for 3, etc. The charges itself do not mix up. If you turn on other player's debuffs, you can see exactly what charges they have on them. /technical.

[Noburu]

I've double checked my theory on the dummy, and its 100% replicatable, so go test this if you do not believe me.

Goto a boss dummy alone, meaning no other sabos, then back off until you get to max range. Plant 5 spike charges, immediately detonate once GCD is up. Spike duration = 14s. Plant 5 shrapnel as soon as you can, detonate once GCD is up. Spike duration = 14, shrapnel charge = 4@5 seconds. Repeat until you feel convinced.

Round 2: toss 5 spike, wait 2 seconds, detonate, toss 5 shrapnel, wait 2 seconds, detonate. Problem solved.

Again, solution: wait a second before detonating, or else you will either clip your last charge or refresh your spike with 1x spike or both.


edit:
add: actually, there is one part where sabo's charges technically get mixed, it is in the class/charge indicator. The charge indicator is instant and misleading, but if you have 2 sabo's, the maximum number of charges on a mob's charge indicator goes up to 10, 15 for 3, etc. The charges itself do not mix up. If you turn on other player's debuffs, you can see exactly what charges they have on them. /technical.

Thanks for testing (Im at work). But Im sure some forum **** will still argue :P

[Tamber]

On an off-note not related to this issue, Tamber, how do you incorporate 20 assassin in your build? The best I could imagine is THIS but I don't truly know if Serrated Blades would proc with sabo charges or if poisons even apply on either charge or detonation. I'm a bit new to the sabo game but so far I've really enjoyed the soul. Blowing stuff up is a hoot!

Base spec is this: http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0M...b.VV0cEb0koR.M

Put remaining points in Sab as you wish. Serrated blades only procs on melee hits, so it's useless for a ranged build. I have a more complete guide written up here:
http://forums.riftgame.com/showthrea...ation-tips-1.2)