Warlock pvp build

[Willyy]

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0z...kqeo.VVb0h0x0o

Lots of defensive cd's, lots of cc, and solid dmg with dots

[DinoSS]

You skip Radiate death, which is probably one of the best warlock skills unless this build is solely for dueling? Also no real point imo buffing life leach, you're missing out on a lot of potential damage to ALL your abilities when you really don't have a GCD around to be casting Life Leach anyway with all the dots you have to throw as it is. Keeping with the same souls, here's what I would recommend:


http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0z...xoAkqqek.EVb0h

This is a lot more aggressive build, it grabs Radiate Death which greatly increases your AOE damage by spreading dots. I don't spec all the way up the arch mage tree in favor of grabbing 15%(!!!) extra spell damage against players, while still going up far enough to get the reduced cool down on Break Free which is very helpful.

Between Neddra's Essence, Shadow Life, Draining Bolt, Rune Shield and the 3 minute cool down reduction on Break Free I don't feel you need to spec any higher up that defensive branch to get Mana shield. It's either the Mana Shield and improved Rune Shield, or 15% more spell damage against players and Radiate Death to spread your dots, and I think the offensive route will be a lot more potent while not draining your survivability terribly.

I also toss 2 points into Dominator to get Thunder Blast for the knockback, this partially makes up for the reduction in defense.


I haven't played at level 50 so this is just theory crafting, feel free to use whatever build you want, just my opinions.

[Willyy]

Great suggestions, your build looks very solid

I guess I still have the WoW frame of mind where AoE type abiilities are useless. But they appear to be really viable in warfronts.

I was wondering locks will be using void bolt.. Lethargy looks like a better filler

And also wondering if its worth taking ward of detection, and puting 4 points into planar attunment

[Repail]

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0z....scRAkoq.Vtocc is more what i was thinkin for a warlock pvp build

[Willyy]

http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0z....scRAkoq.Vtocc is more what i was thinkin for a warlock pvp build

I feel like dinoss' spec is the best. Your build doesn't include mass fear, radiate death, or neddra's essence, chocke, sac life: speed and the extra stun time on dark fury. Like dinoss said, Imp life leach isnt really neccesary. Due to sac life: mana, The mana regen and intellect you took in the domin soul isnt really needed and doesnt make up for whats lost later in the lock tree. deny is nice, but you get the same effect with phase shift.

The knock back in the Arch tree seems pretty good, but i don't think its worth giving up all the passive dmg resistence, and the reduced CD on break free.

[Foofmonger]

All of these specs are pretty bad.

First of all, if your going that high in Warlock, you should be going 51 points for the 75% damage boost. Don't get close and not get the best skill you get, heh.

Second of all, the 50% extra crit damage from elementalist is worth its weight in gold. Here are two specs to think about.

Full Warlock: http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0zsvq..eeRAkqqek.Vp0x

Sure, you lose the 15% damage to players and 30% crit damage from archmage. But you get +75% damage overall and +50% crit damage overall, a bit better trade I think.

Ok, so you don't want to go full warlock maybe, but you want to main it and do good damage. http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=1z...Aksqek.yVd0h.M

Over a full warlock build, you gain +10% crit, +30% crit damage, but you lose -50% damage. You gain some of the nice utility from going archmage though.

[Egoist]

The elem crit damage talent is over rated, at 100% crit it only increases your damage by 33%. At lower crit values it gets worse as its not an exponential skill. At 50% crit you will get an extra 50% crit damage on one in two skills, lets say you hit for 100.

Without elem you hit for 250 in two casts, with elem you hit for 300 in two casts. A total of 20% extra damage.

With 25% crit you get 50% more crit damage one in four skills. So hitting for 100 again, 3 hits for 100, 1 hit for 150 without elem is 450 damage total. With elem you hit for 500, a tiny 9% increase in damage.

So your giving up a constant 15% extra damage from archmage to get a potentially smaller damage increase through elem crit damage? Not to mention all the survivability skills and stats your loosing to get the crit bonus.

I'm not saying your spec is bad but maybe you should do a bit of research into how spells and talents actually work before bandying about your opinion on someone else's spec when you obviously have no factual basis for said opinion.

To the op, i like the spec but the second one listed does seem a little better, stick with am as well. Detaunt is really one of the best pvp skills available to mages when you can pick out who to use it on.

[Foofmonger]

The elem crit damage talent is over rated, at 100% crit it only increases your damage by 33%. At lower crit values it gets worse as its not an exponential skill. At 50% crit you will get an extra 50% crit damage on one in two skills, lets say you hit for 100.

Without elem you hit for 250 in two casts, with elem you hit for 300 in two casts. A total of 20% extra damage.

With 25% crit you get 50% more crit damage one in four skills. So hitting for 100 again, 3 hits for 100, 1 hit for 150 without elem is 450 damage total. With elem you hit for 500, a tiny 9% increase in damage.

So your giving up a constant 15% extra damage from archmage to get a potentially smaller damage increase through elem crit damage? Not to mention all the survivability skills and stats your loosing to get the crit bonus.

I'm not saying your spec is bad but maybe you should do a bit of research into how spells and talents actually work before bandying about your opinion on someone else's spec when you obviously have no factual basis for said opinion.

To the op, i like the spec but the second one listed does seem a little better, stick with am as well. Detaunt is really one of the best pvp skills available to mages when you can pick out who to use it on.

Dude, you are making some big errors here.

First of all, you are calculating this totally wrong. You are thinking about sustained damage... lol. This is about BURST! The +50% crit damage is all about bursting harder, not doing more sustained damage. And yes, I do have a factual basis for "said opinion". Not to mention that DoTs, one of the main focus of the Warlock, either are ALL crit or no crit. If you crit initially on a DoT, all ticks will crit, meaning that the +50% crit damage is worth its weight in gold.

Plus, its all about scaling. Yes, you are using 100 damage (low numbers) to prove your point. I'll use high numbers, to prove mine.

Say your Void Bolt is hitting for 1000 damage. It will crit for 1500 normally. With the Ele crit damage increase, it now crits for 2000 damage. Statistically, its the same percent of increase, but its much more burst damage when you do crit. Again, the last thing the warlock needs to worry about is sustained damage, as you already have a ton of that. What you need is burst, and thats exactly what this provides.

All the survivability skills and stats to get the crit bonus? You mean Detaunt and Break free? Because thats all you are losing. You are also gaining -8% damage taken all the time, a root, and an absorb shield. And if any mage needs detaunt, it's not the warlock, who already has multiple oh crap buttons.

Not to mention your biggest error is ignoring the fact that my build picks up the +75% damage skill. Oh wait, your piddly +15% damage increase for Archmage isn't looking too hot now it is?

By going AM in that second spec posted above, you are gaining (for damage) at best, +5% crit chance 50% of the time at best (and losing 5% the other 50% of the time). What are you trading for it? 20% crit damage and +50% overall damage, a huge loss.

So lets start with a 1000 damage void bolt. With the AM damage increases (+15% damage +30% crit damage), you will hit for 1150 and crit for 2070. With the Warlock/Ele damage increases (+75% damage, +50% crit damage), you will hit for 1750 and crit for 3500 damage. And if you go the second spec listed above which doesn't pick up the AM crit damage and focuses on survivability (which a warlock is already good at), you hit for 1150 and crit for 1725.

Thats why that spec isn't good. It CRITS for less than mine HITS for. You are a DPS class in pvp, and if you aren't doing burst and can't kill things, you might as well not be playing a Warlock.

[Ceol]

So your giving up a constant 15% extra damage from archmage to get a potentially smaller damage increase through elem crit damage? Not to mention all the survivability skills and stats your loosing to get the crit bonus.

I'm not saying your spec is bad but maybe you should do a bit of research into how spells and talents actually work before bandying about your opinion on someone else's spec when you obviously have no factual basis for said opinion.

Actually I like his build better and i disagree with you. By going into Elemental you also get +5% crit chance and you cut your damage by 8% and get the ice shield too.

And while we dont know exactly how the lvl 51 warlock skill will perform, ANY skill that can increase your damage by 75% (!!) for any reasonable length of time is worth its weight in gold IMO. Get a couple +50% crit damage when you are tossing out +75% damage and enemies are going to drop.

Also, you should be more respectful to other people's opinions, no need to be a jerk about it, especially when he DOES have factual basis for offering a different opinion. You may not happen to prefer that build but it doesnt make him wrong, and at the very least it gives people other ideas to think about.

[Egoist]

Burst does kill in pvp i'll agree, but thats what opportunity is for. Its all relative to your crit rate but i personally think am is a better pvp soul than elem.

Crap pet, a non insta root, some crit, a weak damage reduction, an absorb shield and crit damage. This is compared to break free, detaunt, a death damage snare channel that just screams warlock synergy since its a dot (yes n. inf works on it) and a 25% damage reduction skill for 15 points. Then depending on how you spec, 15% damage, insta cast spells on interupts (fear or mass fear), 10% crit chance, 30% crit damage, auto crit every 45 seconds, healing debuff stackable on voidbolt, dispell all snares and boost run speed... Thats just the dps side of the tree. Like you said, lock have plenty of oh **** buttons but for a few points in am you get a lot more than elem.

[Foofmonger]

Actually I like his build better and i disagree with you. By going into Elemental you also get +5% crit chance and you cut your damage by 8% and get the ice shield too.

And while we dont know exactly how the lvl 51 warlock skill will perform, ANY skill that can increase your damage by 75% (!!) for any reasonable length of time is worth its weight in gold IMO. Get a couple +50% crit damage when you are tossing out +75% damage and enemies are going to drop.

Also, you should be more respectful to other people's opinions, no need to be a jerk about it, especially when he DOES have factual basis for offering a different opinion. You may not happen to prefer that build but it doesnt make him wrong, and at the very least it gives people other ideas to think about.

Exactly my friend. As I posted above, its the difference between doing roughly 1150 hits and 1700-2000 crits, and doing 1750 hits and 3500 crits.

And its not like Warlock survivability is bad by any means anyway. The -80% damage skill, the +50% hp skill, mass fear, the lifetaps/drains, reconstruct. Basically, you already have a bunch of oh crap buttons, and if you play smart and have decent healers, you should survive just fine. Worst comes to worst you pop -80% damage and you'll get healed to full by your healers in almost any situation.

[Foofmonger]

Burst does kill in pvp i'll agree, but thats what opportunity is for. Its all relative to your crit rate but i personally think am is a better pvp soul than elem.

Crap pet, a non insta root, some crit, a weak damage reduction, an absorb shield and crit damage. This is compared to break free, detaunt, a death damage snare channel that just screams warlock synergy since its a dot (yes n. inf works on it) and a 25% damage reduction skill for 15 points. Then depending on how you spec, 15% damage, insta cast spells on interupts (fear or mass fear), 10% crit chance, 30% crit damage, auto crit every 45 seconds, healing debuff stackable on voidbolt, dispell all snares and boost run speed... Thats just the dps side of the tree. Like you said, lock have plenty of oh **** buttons but for a few points in am you get a lot more than elem.

The problem is that as soon as you start going that deep in AM, you lose the +75% damage skill. You've got 15 points to spend max, to not lose that.

[Ceol]

Say your Void Bolt is hitting for 1000 damage. It will crit for 1500 normally. With the Ele crit damage increase, it now crits for 2000 damage.

Overall I agree with you. But I thought the elemental skill gave up to +50% on the additional damage from crits. So if 1000 becomes 1500 because of a crit, wouldnt it add 250 more (+50% of 500), giving 1750 overall. Even so, I still like the skill, in part because the 10 points in elemental leading to that skill are also good, and the 15 points fit great with a 51 point warlock build.

I also agree that its all about burst damage. Being able to increase damage 75% after your charge builds up is a really good skill. Now I understand that some folks want to spend those extra points in other trees, but personally I like the extra burst damage, and not jist for PvP but for PvE too.

[Egoist]

The problem is that as soon as you start going that deep in AM, you lose the +75% damage skill.

You can still put 15 points into am with full lock. So 15% damage, insta cast on interupt, 10% crit chance and, 30% crit damage are all available. Also you still get all of the handy root abilities compared to the poor pet, the non insta root and the shield.

Lethargy is currently wrong for locks as nearly all single target channels currently count as dots.

I also didn't slag off his build, we're currently discussing the relative benefits and weaknesses of am or elem for a second soul full warlock build. I did however find someone coming into a thread and saying those builds are all bad in his first post a little impolite, however foof's responses to me have been cordial and i think he may have a point with his burst damage idea. I'm going to do a little bit of math comparing 1000 damage hits and crits with a base 20% crit chance and see what i come up with for am and elem.

Personally unless the results are ~30% higher for elem i'd still prefer the am utility, if its higher i'll have to make a tough choice whne it comes to my pvp spec.

[Foofmonger]

You can still put 15 points into am with full lock. So 15% damage, insta cast on interupt, 10% crit chance and, 30% crit damage are all available. Also you still get all of the handy root abilities compared to the poor pet, the non insta root and the shield.

Lethargy is currently wrong for locks as nearly all single target channels currently count as dots.

Yep, so its a really trade off here. Do you want +15% damage, instant cast on interrupt, and lethargy/detaunt? Or +20% crit damage, -8% damage taken, an absorb shield, and a root (notice I've never even mentioned the pet, since its garbage).

I see your point though, and now I'm beginning to think that the best spec may be one nobody has posted yet but we are coming to agree on. Maybe full warlock with archmage secondary with 15 points in it?

Something like....http://rift.zam.com/en/stc.html?t=0z...RAkqqek.xx0M0c

The only caveat of course is that the Warlock/Ele spec is obviously far more useful in PvE, so it would be more of a balanced spec (you wouldn't need to respec to do whatever).