Dear Mage developer, i would like a answer about the chloros veils

[DaCommando]

Regarding your second edit, I play mage, not cleric. I see you're assuming that because I know more about cleric than you, but check my post history. Anyway, not to be rude, but if anyone should leave the discussion it should be you You're comparing cleric and chloro without knowing the extent of it(see my first reply to you ).

By the way, yes OW>healing cataract spam(wasting mana) in phases where there is little to no raid damage.

Naa i just assumed ur a cleric coz obviously ur a bad mage :P

And no i dont cleric. But i know how they work.. Didnt say im an expert, and thus u dont c me posting in their section. However, i know and understand very well how chloros work. Thats

[NotTrev]

Naa i just assumed ur a cleric coz obviously ur a bad mage :P

And no i dont cleric. But i know how they work.. Didnt say im an expert, and thus u dont c me posting in their section. However, i know and understand very well how chloros work. Thats

But you're comparing the two when you obviously are uncertain how clerics work..?

Edit: You can also stop with the "bad mage" routine any time now. It reflects really poorly upon yourself when you can't couple it with sound arguments. Being in a top tier guild doesn't make everyone else horrible. You have no idea who you're speaking to.

[DaCommando]

To my recollection this isn't a comparison between 2 classes thread. This is a straight forward plea to change 1 of the most crucial chloros mechanic.

I'm not comparing both classes, i'm just talking about my class that i understand pretty well.. People that are otherwise, are comparing it with clerics. Which to begin with is a faulty comparison.

All top end raiders in this thread, have agreed to the same thing, chloros are fine as they are, and mostly, these people have done their homework, done the math, and already compared which class is more effective in which role assigned to in the raid.

Trying to explain that, people have derailed the thread to what chloro can and cant do and what clerics can and cant do. Why stop at healing then? Mages cant tank discuss.

P.S: Learn to figure out when people are joking :P

[Crovack]

The main change I would like to see to chloro is Natural splendor heals to be 20m around chloro and not around target and maybe its healing to be tweaked a bit. That would make a decent AOE cooldown which chloro really misses.

As to cross-veil healing - surely this stupid limit should be removed or tweaked. Say synthesis should overwrite veil on target to prevent cross-LBV healing. Cross-LGV healing should not be limited.

First who really suffer from this are different hybrids. But without many points in chloro they do not really heal much so that limitation still has no sense.

Closest thing to reasonable I've seen. Make the mage receive -1.5*pointsInChloro% of others' veil heals (ie: 61 chloro receives 2.4% of other's heals, but a 32hab/44chlor would get 34%, and some newb in your drr running 61harb/8chloro would still get 88%)

[NotTrev]

To my recollection this isn't a comparison between 2 classes thread. This is a straight forward plea to change 1 of the most crucial chloros mechanic.

Agreed.

I'm not comparing both classes, i'm just talking about my class that i understand pretty well.. People that are otherwise, are comparing it with clerics. Which to begin with is a faulty comparison.

Well, an earlier poster was comparing them. I replied to him and you replied to my reply with critiques, which got you into that discussion. No matter the "who's right, who's wrong" of it, my point in replying was that clerics bring many things to the table chloro does not, so listing out all of chloros "pros" isn't exactly a great arguement for holding on to terrible game design.

All top end raiders in this thread, have agreed to the same thing, chloros are fine as they are, and mostly, these people have done their homework, done the math, and already compared which class is more effective in which role assigned to in the raid.

That's fine. But some of these raiders are so scared that if you take away the veil limitations that raids will stack 5 chloros. I think, in our previous posts, we've already outlined that there are things a cleric brings and things a chloro brings. Raids will need both. The point is that chloros shouldn't be balanced around that bad design, it's a stupid limitation that isn't intuitive. If, after that limitation is removed, we see an influx of chloros being stacked in raids and an absence of clerics, who's to say we can't have some balance changes to bring that in line? Personally I'd prefer to see clerics buffed or chloros suffer another nerf(possibly a little of both?) to maintaining this terrible design. Is that what most chloros are afraid of? Lol.

Trying to explain that, people have derailed the thread to what chloro can and cant do and what clerics can and cant do. Why stop at healing then? Mages cant tank discuss.

We already have threads on this, lol.

P.S: Learn to figure out when people are joking :P

Sarcasm isn't exactly something you can read in text(perhaps if you know the person, and what to expect..). If this is your "Lawl i wuz trollin joo" statement, then I don't know what to say, lol.

[Crovack]

The only cleric souls that get any decent overlap are puri and sent. This is why you see raids with 1 puri and 1 defiler and 2 chloros 99% of the time

Only fight warden is needed for is crucia (where i go oom after 10 seconds. Not super sustained). Mages can heal zaviel fine now. Warden can be useful on a few other fights but isn't necessary if you have 2 chloros.

Don't buff chloros plz i'd like to heal more fights and know most mages would rather dps than heal anyway. Not that you guys care because i'm just a biased cleric

Naw, 'bias cleric' is the one that keeps barking for chloro nerfs.
Looking at the status quo and seeing that, albeit it not being perfect, that it is close enough to not need a major change (and chloro's healing each other for full would be a major change), isn't biased - it's just common sense.
Clerics could certainly use a few adjustments (sentinel doesn't seem to see much raid time anymore since defiler can apply links that make tank cooldowns less necessary), but puri, defiler, and warden certainly all have their place. (Warden could also probably use some talented mana return, something like 'x% of your overhealing from <certain spells> is returned as mana" - would need to be a very very low percent, but would at least allow for casts that landed just after someone else's big aoe heal (and thus did very little actual healing) to be less punishing on mana use).

[Daglar]

I hate coming out and saying no, but that is what I'm going to do here.

There are no plans in to change the mechanic with Chloros where their veils do not affect other veil holders.

~Daglar

[Primalthirst]

Thank you Daglar, hopefully that will be the end of this.

[NotTrev]

I hate coming out and saying no, but that is what I'm going to do here.

There are no plans in to change the mechanic with Chloros where their veils do not affect other veil holders.

~Daglar

I wish you would say why, at least, lol. If you stated your reasons for/against it I think it would do better to curb the plea to have this change go through. Specifically saying "There are no plans", too, doesn't imply that it's out of the question in the future(when plans could be developed!), which is likely going to perpetuate this issue.

[Eosmeep]

I wish you would say why, at least, lol. If you stated your reasons for/against it I think it would do better to curb the plea to have this change go through. Specifically saying "There are no plans", too, doesn't imply that it's out of the question in the future(when plans could be developed!), which is likely going to perpetuate this issue.

Because kervik is gonna try to make cleric healers more balanced with chloros again, not make the disparity between the two larger and have to go back and rework cleric and chloro healing values.
Right, right?

[NotTrev]

Because kervik is gonna try to make cleric healers more balanced with chloros again, not make the disparity between the two larger and have to go back and rework cleric and chloro healing values.
Right, right?

Implying that is impossible to do with raid wide veils is silly, so I would hope so.

[Valnak]

I would like a PvP healing veil that allows chloros to heal each other there though.

[Crovack]

Thank you Daglar, hopefully that will be the end of this.

Once again Primal, I couldn't have said it better.
Though I'm not particularly hopeful.

As to the "no plans" component - they ALWAYS use that terminology. They'll rarely if ever answer a question with a "no, never, isn't going to happen no matter what" but then they tend to ignore the kind of questions that could possibly result in that response (example: Daglar, will you ever force Primal to put down his beer?)

[Ianto Jones]

Now begins the "well he said there are no plans, but that doesn't mean they won't change their mind if we make a lot of threads!" phase.

I wish you would say why, at least, lol. If you stated your reasons for/against it I think it would do better to curb the plea to have this change go through. Specifically saying "There are no plans", too, doesn't imply that it's out of the question in the future(when plans could be developed!), which is likely going to perpetuate this issue.

I'm pretty sure this thread is chock full of reasons why it's a bad idea. You ought to read them (though I'm not surprised you haven't).

[NotTrev]

Now begins the "well he said there are no plans, but that doesn't mean they won't change their mind if we make a lot of threads!" phase.



I'm pretty sure this thread is chock full of reasons why it's a bad idea. You ought to read them (though I'm not surprised you haven't).

I read them, doesn't make them good reasons. Besides, I wanted to know his reasons; ie technical(inability), manpower/time(imposed balance changes) or otherwise(design).