The Support Role Defined

[Nightreaver]

Archon is described as an offensive soul, which is somewhat misleading for sure and when you first start you do not get the purple flag. It flags DPS origibnally. When it changes to the purple flag I don't know, but I am assuming it does

It never does, just a lot of misinformation.

You can go full 51 points into Archon and you will still be flagged as Offensive.

If the secondary soul is Offensive you will remain flagged as Offensive. i.e 51 Archon/7 Chloro /8 Pyro

If the secondary soul equals the tertiary soul you will remain flagged as Offensive i.e. 51 Archon /7 Chloro /7 Necro

To be flagged as Support, two conditions must be met:
1) the secondary soul must have more points than the tertiary soul
2) the secondary soul must be either Chloro or Dominator

Here's another fun fact.
If I have 51 points in Chloro I'm flagged as a Healer
If I then add 14 points to an offensive soul like Pyro, I remain flagged as a Healer
But if I put that final point into Dominator then suddenly I am flagged as Support.

Bottom line is that Archon is defined by Trion as an Offensive soul NOT as Support.

So just a Clerics expect Justicar to be able to compete with other Tanks souls, Archon should be should be able to compete with other DPS souls.

[bri bates]

Clerics already have 3 Healing roles for heals, each one with a Brez more effective than Chloro and it didn't prevent them from giving a 4th Brez and another AOE Heal to their Tank role.

You clearly haven't been around clerics long if you think this is the case. Until the most recent patch only 1 cleric healing soul and the tank soul had a B-rez. Originally the Sentinel version had a 10 min cooldown, not the 5 min version it currently has and warden and purifier had no battle rez.

As far as effectiveness, it is less clear that chloro's shorter cooldown is/isn't better than a full res now that the cleric healer b-rez has a 5 min cd but you can certainly make a case for it in many situations.

f.e.: dead rogue/warrior at 4 mins on timer during no/low aoe phase=clear win for chloro

[Flashmemory]

Our tank souls shouldn't be all tank. They need either to offer dps or support. This is the way Trion created warriors. If you read the descriptions of our tanks we lack dps. We should actually be dealing more dps than any other calllings tanks and to some extent viable dps when combined with other dps souls. Reading from the descriptions of the website paladins and void knights should deal much more damage to a point where they should be scaling greatly with both offensive and defensive armor types. Warlords should offer support and reaver would act like how all our tank soul act now slowly grinding and debilitating the enemies and most durable.

[Nightreaver]

You clearly haven't been around clerics long if you think this is the case. Until the most recent patch only 1 cleric healing soul and the tank soul had a B-rez. Originally the Sentinel version had a 10 min cooldown, not the 5 min version it currently has and warden and purifier had no battle rez.

Yes , I am well aware of that and it changes absolutely nothing. What is the relevance of previous versions no longer in effect when comparing current ones?

As far as effectiveness, it is less clear that chloro's shorter cooldown is/isn't better than a full res now that the cleric healer b-rez has a 5 min cd but you can certainly make a case for it in many situations.
f.e.: dead rogue/warrior at 4 mins on timer during no/low aoe phase=clear win for chloro

If there was only one Healer with BRez in the raid I would agree. But when every Healer has one I would beg to differ. Dead Rogue/Warrior at 4 mins on time? No problem, have the 2nd or 3rd healer Brez. After that, the first one should be up again. If you're having more trouble than that keeping up on Brez then I seriously doubt shaving a minute off one is going to help.

Would be more than happy to trade for your Brez.
The points it take to reduce the CD are better spent elsewhere now with Brez being so available.
So Chloro get 2 extra points to spend in their tree + the best Brez in the game whereas Clerics would have to remove two points from somewhere to lower their CD and get a the worst Brez in the game .

[Eglareth]

not entirely on topic, but can anyone pls tell me what the conditions for being flagged as support as a cleric are? ATM I run a solospec Inqui (44) / Justicar 11 / Sentinel 3; an Inqui 34 / Justicar 16 / Sentinel 8 and a Justicar 18 / Sentinel 20 / Shaman 20 and all of them are flagged DD, although the dungeonfinder tells me that I could heal with one of them. Bugged since 1.7.?

[Myschief]

@Eglareth

If I'm not mistaken, it takes 22 points in Justicar to be able to que as support.

I'm not entirely sure why they chose that number. It's about 7 more than I think is necessary under most circumstances, and 4 more than I think is ever needed.

If anyone else knows why they picked that number, I'd be interested in the reasoning behind it.

[Eglareth]

thx for the information... in effect, I made a tankspec with max justicar and can from that now count as support -.- but at least I can ^^

[Flimble]

@Eglareth

If I'm not mistaken, it takes 22 points in Justicar to be able to que as support.

I'm not entirely sure why they chose that number. It's about 7 more than I think is necessary under most circumstances, and 4 more than I think is ever needed.

If anyone else knows why they picked that number, I'd be interested in the reasoning behind it.

You don't have to go 22 pts to queue as support if you also have a healing spec in there, for instance I can queue as support as 14/42/10 (Just/Inq/Sent) with the 10 in sent on the increased spellpower + increased damage/heal crit.

[Shodeath]

What if buffs were tuned to be weaker the more people there are in the raid or party. This would allow a support class to provide a desirable DPS boost to a 5-10 man and not be overpowered in a large raid.