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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: OFFICIAL FEEDBACK: Eternal Weapon Adjustments

  1. #16
    Rift Disciple Semiso's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wynford View Post
    If that were the case then they would nerf the weapon for rogue heals - with abilities like Curative Remote which trigger 8-20 times a second depending on raid size and curative/restorative engine which is entirely passive and makes them almost invincible tanks at it's final stage. I don't think that the lower value has anything to do with our healing.
    When it comes to curative remote first of all, im not sure if it's suppossed to be buffed by eternals at all, as i see it as a debuff while i look at the tooltip of rogues eternal and Think its suppossed to buff direct heals only

    As with the curative/restorative Engines, yeaaaa they need a fix

    Btw Primalist has an ability idk what it was called again but its basically a DoT that doubles dmg every tick for 20-30 secs,with these adjustments it will in the end alone do +200k dps meanwhile ur spamming alot of stuff (also counting for the 20% of the primalists eternal value on dots)
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  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Semiso View Post
    When it comes to curative remote first of all, im not sure if it's suppossed to be buffed by eternals at all, as i see it as a debuff while i look at the tooltip of rogues eternal and Think its suppossed to buff direct heals only

    As with the curative/restorative Engines, yeaaaa they need a fix

    Btw Primalist has an ability idk what it was called again but its basically a DoT that doubles dmg every tick for 20-30 secs,with these adjustments it will in the end alone do +200k dps meanwhile ur spamming alot of stuff (also counting for the 20% of the primalists eternal value on dots)
    You're referring to Excoriate, yes it doubles each tick but it is by far in the dps break down one of the lowest abilities on the meter. Beyond that, as I'm talking purely PvE, as no PvP healer should be stupid enough to let that get to its full duration and just cleanse it; Maelstrom is not even a relevant damage soul at this point if you're speccing 31 Maelstrom. Many other specs can outpace it with ease.

  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Semiso View Post
    When it comes to curative remote first of all, im not sure if it's suppossed to be buffed by eternals at all, as i see it as a debuff while i look at the tooltip of rogues eternal and Think its suppossed to buff direct heals only
    It is buffed, and the eternals value is further increased by all of the tact and bards modifiers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Semiso View Post
    Btw Primalist has an ability idk what it was called again but its basically a DoT that doubles dmg every tick for 20-30 secs,with these adjustments it will in the end alone do +200k dps meanwhile ur spamming alot of stuff (also counting for the 20% of the primalists eternal value on dots)
    Excoriate isn't effected from my testing. Damage is still roughly the same - and it's tooltip value doesn't change with either buff.
    Wynford@Greybriar (Cleric) - Martyrdom@Greybriar (Primalist) - Salmoneus@Greybriar (Mage)

  4. #19
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    One thing that I just never understood with this proc is, why having it done like that in the first place. With that I do not mean the +% dmg or the cost part - I mean the proc as whole.

    At least for warr the wep proc does benefit souls that naturally dump a lot of power while for example RB will be left out. The change does of course account now for that as you will power drain with any of the souls we have. However, since there is no ICD anymore the goal is going to be to trigger the proc as many times as possible and that will benefit again the souls that use naturally a lot of power + the souls that have many GCD skills.

    Just make it a passive and adjust the flat dmg increase to whatever makes sense to you - if that means you need to drop the power part of the wep so be it, we have lived without it for many years, so we will survive. For me, the whole one soul does benefit more than the other makes it a nightmare for soul balance.

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  5. #20
    Telaran
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    Very, very big nerf for us warriors. We are the worst dps class already and this take a lot of our dmg because we get it wtth the burst. I really think they only play roques and primalst that they make such a ********.

    Arbosch Bloodforge

  6. #21
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    I'm tired of playing Rift like a bastard.
    Especially on stupid Eternal weapon ...
    Do you think you're going to use this **** like T2 and T3?

    There is only one thing I can expect from the T2, I can use a new weapon.

    It is released from Eternal weapon such as dog ****.
    But you're going to fix the Eternal weapon?
    You just do not have to do anything.

    I do not think you can understand the many opinions that point out the problem here.
    If you have time to do that, fix the Mage's bug.
    Last edited by Skidrow; 10-08-2017 at 03:36 AM.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skidrow View Post
    I'm tired of playing Rift like a bastard.
    Especially on stupid Eternal weapon ...
    Do you think you're going to use this **** like T2 and T3?

    There is only one thing I can expect from the T2, I can use a new weapon.

    It is released from Eternal weapon such as dog ****.
    But you're going to fix the Eternal weapon?
    You just do not have to do anything.

    I do not think you can understand the many opinions that point out the problem here.
    If you have time to do that, fix the Mage's bug.
    I wholeheartedly agree with you, i cannot simply see myself and others using the eternal weapon for the rest of the expansion. I miss the system in previous expansions where getting multiple pieces of armor or accessories could be worth more dps than getting a weapon. A good resolution would be to have a replacement for that eternal weapon that can be purchased from the rift store like in previous expansions as well as having weapon drops in raids WITH weapons procs already on them.
    Help me make Mages of Alittu an awesome place for Mage guides, discussion, and overall help for those who need it most. https://discord.gg/rNQqJTg

  8. #23
    Ewa
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    Default Change not equal

    Quote Originally Posted by Yaviey View Post

    Eternal Weapon Adjustments

    Warrior - Damage bonus has been changed to a flat damage add (250, 500, 1000, 2000, 25,000, 30,000). 100% of this bonus will work on DoTs and HoTs. ICD has been removed. The weapon now reduces base energy regeneration by half, but increases generation after dropping low drastically.
    The change from 50% increased damage for 10 sec on 10 sec gcd is higher than recommend change.

    I've tested it and on the 2nd to last upgrade at 25% increase. I'm on 13/16 irotp High Priest.
    I've worked very hard to earn the final weapon upgrade and now learn it's appears to be nerf. This is upsetting.

    I recommend increasing the flat damage amount on final upgrade to make it at least equal.
    Thank you Devs for all your hard work and asking for our feedback.

  9. #24
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    If we're going to go with flat bonuses on all eternals, they need to be tweeked a bit. Provide +X for damaging abilities, +Y for heals, +Z for procs (weapon enchants/poisons/vengeances/etc). They way it is currently favors lots of small hits (assassin before poison change) or heals (like tactician stuff). Though honestly, a % buff seems like it would be better for these issues.



    About primalist changes: The top raid specs won't change much. The melee version of Molten Wave/Fury Blast will see no change, as none of the abilities are actually affected by the eternal proc (you never hit full cunning, so no buff for MW/FB). The ranged version will change very slightly, as Stroke of Brilliance and Vorpal Salvo benefit from the proc.


    The eternal proc itself needs to be redesigned. Hitting max fury and max cunning to get the buffs up isn't easy for some specs, and there are a lot of abilities that are neither cunning nor fury, so don't benefit from the proc even if you get it up. A good example is Primal Lord - Hawks Wrath is fury, Thresher's Maw is cunning. Every other ability is neither, so they get no benefit.
    Nivv <Stack More Crit>
    Nivva <Stack More Dodge>
    5th best primalist NA (also 5th worst)

  10. #25
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    Default Eternal Weapons - not fun

    The Devs lost the plot and have forgotten this is a game and supposed to be fun. The grind around the eternal weapons, poor drops on celstial matrix's and running TD ridiculous amounts of times and missing gear have stopped this game being fun. Then have to grind out NMR to get planarite.
    As a player, I am having to revisit the past over and over and over. This is not about progression. This is not about having fun.
    Crifts now have half the people not bothering to actually participate because they have run them so many times they just cant be bothered.
    And who can blame them
    PUT THE FUN BACK IN THE GAME OR IT WILL DIE

    Focussing on the mechanics of the eternal weapons is missing the point. I wont be levelling mine through 80 experts, another 80 rifts and mindless boredom. I would rather get teeth pulled. It also excludes people who cannot play 2 hours a day. Yet here you are spending time fixing something alot of ppl wont bother to use.

    You have lost the plot

    And I am quitting. This is why your player base is shrinking. Whichever ****wit is setting the direction of this game needs to be fired. I work on an ASX listed company, high up, in strategy. I know what I am talking about. You are rewarding a small element of the game with fixes and ignoring the majority.

    Go to the values of Atlassian, (not my company) they have an amazing value which says "Dont ^*&%% the customer"

    You need to learn from this
    Last edited by Grumpyoldman; 10-13-2017 at 07:09 PM. Reason: additional comments

  11. #26
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    Also would like to mention that it is hard to compare live to PTS due to fragment stat scrambling. You can do it with no frags, though that requires a (wasted) frag set that has nothing in it.


    It would be better if fragments level 12+ were not scrambled. There is no RNG in the stats after level 12, so no reason to scramble.
    Nivv <Stack More Crit>
    Nivva <Stack More Dodge>
    5th best primalist NA (also 5th worst)

  12. #27
    RIFT Guide Writer huangchingho's Avatar
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    Changing all procs to static values are a very nice approach for DPS balancing to close gaps between geared and undergeared characters. (Multiplicative procs will just make DEVs work harder, EG. MoM healing trinket, imagine Primalist and Warrior could abuse the proc when 5.0 is launched, well, Primalist less likely, but Warrior's offhand.)

    As for DPS or DPS-support or Tank souls abusing healing proc, I strongly suggest to categorize the eternal weapons. Maybe make one piece of (unique) eternal weapon only for static damage numbers increase, another one only increases static healing numbers. (These two will have less endurance). While add the third piece to accommodate tanks, obviously with higher endurance, give the tank eternal piece with a static proc value of X:

    - Static Shield while blocked or dodged
    - Static values of damage reduced. (100% uptime), tune contents around this proc and make this required to tank raid encounters.

    The tank eternal proc has to be attractive enough (or mandatory) so the DPS and Healer proc don't get abused as a tank. That being said, there are still tons of plausible workarounds for this issue. Many souls are dependent on the eternal proc, some souls get to abuse the proc, many souls got into identity crisis or became obsolete because of this. (Procs, dots, non-working-interaction). If DEVs have the intention in fixing this issue, I think this will be the right route. (Unless it isn't an issue, in DEV's perspective).

    Also, for open-world content or quest/soloing, players can simply switch out the DPS eternal weapons to the Healing proc eternal weapon freely when they are not in combat. (Just like the synergy crystals). If sustainability is a concern, it's worth it to sacrifice some DPS for the HPS when necessary. While in raid, DPS will use DPS eternal weapon to maximize DPS output as a damage dealer, while Healers should use healing eternal weapon to increase their HPS output; tanks should only use Tank eternal weapon in order to stay alive in raids.
    Last edited by huangchingho; 10-13-2017 at 11:37 PM.

  13. #28
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by huangchingho View Post
    Changing all procs to static values are a very nice approach for DPS balancing to close gaps between geared and undergeared characters.
    Thats the worst they could do. Use %-Values are much better because every spell (GCD 1 or GCD 1.5) get the same buff as well as damage- and healingspells.
    Last edited by Sing; 10-14-2017 at 03:45 AM.

  14. #29
    RIFT Guide Writer huangchingho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sing View Post
    Thats the worst they could do. Use %-Values are much better because every spell (GCD 1 or GCD 1.5) get the same buff as well as damage- and healingspells.
    That's only your opinion but the fact that multiplicative is extremely bad for the game is that DEVs will come back to nerf it no matter what. Hopefully they do not make the same mistakes again.

    As DEVs have mentioned several times that multiplicative % procs do not have a limit and it is the contributing factor to imbalance (and extreme imbalance in the future, even for LVL 75 maybe even higher if hit isn't a limiting factor). It scales with stats, so imagine a T2 Maxed geared character is capable of doubling the DPS of a T1 Maxed geared character, T3 doubles T2's DPS. So on and so forth.
    (You get the idea, gap is getting farther than intended.)

    Will that be balanced? I think not.

    Will players blow up on the forums and QQ about balance? Definitely, better change until that happens.

    (Unless the eternals are all changed to multiplicative values, then we can keep and make use of them for another 10 years..)
    Last edited by huangchingho; 10-14-2017 at 08:19 PM.

  15. #30
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by huangchingho View Post
    That's only your opinion but the fact that multiplicative is extremely bad for the game is that DEVs will come back to nerf it no matter what. Hopefully they do not make the same mistakes again.

    As DEVs have mentioned several times that multiplicative % procs do not have a limit and it is the contributing factor to imbalance (and extreme imbalance in the future, even for LVL 75 maybe even higher if hit isn't a limiting factor). It scales with stats, so imagine a T2 Maxed geared character is capable of doubling the DPS of a T1 Maxed geared character, T3 doubles T2's DPS. So on and so forth.
    (You get the idea, gap is getting farther than intended.)

    Will that be balanced? I think not.

    Will players blow up on the forums and QQ about balance? Definitely, better change until that happens.

    (Unless the eternals are all changed to multiplicative values, then we can keep and make use of them for another 10 years..)
    Your are right. The weapon will grow with the tier. But it only inraise the total damage of a class and %-value are the best option to raise specs with GCD1, GCD1.5, damage and healspells the same way.

    But this isnt the problem. I use alot of specs and some are extremly underrated like defiler or caba (death after next tier) and others like shamen are pretty good. Specs like Purifier are death because they simply forgot to raise absorbtions by legendary as well as weapon if 4.3. comes out.

    The way to balance with the weapon is the wrong way. It only inraise the OP specs of some classes. They need to look at the souls.
    Last edited by Sing; 10-14-2017 at 09:13 PM.

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