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Thread: Divine Favor Changes

  1. #1
    Soulwalker
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    Default Divine Favor Changes

    I've noted the following in PTS patch notes:

    Mastery - Divine Favor has been reworked. It is now a 1 minute cooldown that applies 6 stacks of Divine Presence to all nearby allies for 30 seconds. Divine Presence increases the healing you do to the target by 5% per stack. One stack is consumed each time you cast a heal on a target.
    My main concern is how much consideration has been put into how these changes affecting purifier healing.

    Typically divine favor has made up anywhere between around 30% of the HPS of a purifier on a tank taking single target damage, up to around 40% if all 3 targets have incoming damage. This is well-documented across hundreds of logs.

    HPS has always been the weak point of a purifier. Many tanks have died simply because they could never have their hp topped off. Purifiers have been so starved for healing in the past that especially demanding content has resulted in some prominent purifiers taking healing blessing from the sentinel tree - sacrificing a significant amount of absorption capability to do so.

    The new Divine Favor changes remove this now bread-and-butter HPS component from purifier without bringing anything substantial to prevent tank deaths.

    Whatever the reasons were to change how Divine Favor works, it does not seem because divine favor is a crutch - we can see the Primalist version (albeit weaker) has been unchanged in its mechanics. I would speculate it is to further nerf purifier into being an irrelevant spec in favor of players purchasing soul packs to play Frostkeeper.

    I'm sure many clerics would be open to discuss a change in the value that divine favor provides, or whether there are other options that can be made available for purifiers to maintain their already-low HPS.

  2. #2
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Riane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storytimes View Post
    My main concern is how much consideration has been put into how these changes affecting purifier healing.
    It was put into consideration.

    Typically divine favor has made up anywhere between around 30% of the HPS of a purifier on a tank taking single target damage, up to around 40% if all 3 targets have incoming damage. This is well-documented across hundreds of logs.
    This was always the problem of Cleric single-target healing which also is why Divine Favor is a crutch. Divine Favor being reworked is the best thing that has happened to Cleric healing because now our single-target healing can be properly balanced and have it's major scaling issues resolved. Hence the following:


    Sentinel
    - Legendary Light of Redemption healing increased by roughly 60%. It now scales more aggressively with spellpower.

    Purifier
    - Eruption has been reworked and now causes 50% of overhealing to be applied to nearby targets. Only works on healing applied from the original caster.


    http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...ml#post5281772

    RE: Your concern about raw HPS from Purifier... Well, that is a valid concern but there is still a lot of APS that the soul has that no other can come close to (well maybe Physician, I haven't parsed APS in awhile.) Just because you don't see big green numbers doesn't mean you aren't "healing." You also have Blessing of the Flame and Faith's Reward at your finger tips that reduces the cast time of your spells like Flashover w/ WoS, WoF. There's still keeping up LB when it procs/expires. And SotS w/ CTC proc.

    Even so, the whole extremely spiky tank damage that was a thing for a lot of NT isn't a thing with SP and won't be since that was something they addressed for balancing raids and stuff.
    Last edited by Riane; 01-14-2017 at 04:28 PM.

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riane View Post
    This was always the problem of Cleric single-target healing which also is why Divine Favor is a crutch. Divine Favor being reworked is the best thing that has happened to Cleric healing because now our single-target healing can be properly balanced and have it's major scaling issues resolved. Hence the following:


    Sentinel
    - Legendary Light of Redemption healing increased by roughly 60%. It now scales more aggressively with spellpower.

    Purifier
    - Eruption has been reworked and now causes 50% of overhealing to be applied to nearby targets. Only works on healing applied from the original caster.
    These 2 changes don't address the main concern, which is a 30+% nerf to the HPS. Many kills across the board in the previous expansion would not have been possible, or extremely difficult, e.g prenerf zilas, HM edit:guurloth* if the proposed changes were in place for the previous expansion.

    Purifier needs another source of baseline HPS, instead of more cooldowns. Maybe eruption could be reworked to facilitate this - the meta for having 5-man healing abilities is extremely underwhelming in this game.
    Last edited by Storytimes; 01-14-2017 at 05:24 PM.

  4. #4
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Riane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storytimes View Post
    These 2 changes don't address the main concern, which is a 30+% nerf to the HPS. Many kills across the board in the previous expansion would not have been possible, or extremely difficult, e.g prenerf zilas, HM edit:guurloth* if the proposed changes were in place for the previous expansion.

    Purifier needs another source of baseline HPS, instead of more cooldowns. Maybe eruption could be reworked to facilitate this - the meta for having 5-man healing abilities is extremely underwhelming in this game.
    Divine Favor isn't the reason most guilds in Rift got their NT HK and MoM kills (if they were even able to get passed Pagura.) It was because there was no shielding cap at all on Purifier. Nothing at all to do with Divine Favor carrying Purifier "healing" in NT raids.

    HM IGP was a joke because of no shielding cap. I solo healed HM Anraak the first week it was out and the only splash healing I had was from LGV on a DPS orientated Harbinger. I covered all of the Spines with Tidal Surge + Flash Over + Fiery Will + Gathering of the Flames, Faith's Reward procs + Healing Cataract, and Flame of Life when it was up.

    And HM Guulorth? Shielding. Again. The only thing DF really made a huge impact on was not having to actively heal the person standing out since you could toss DF up on them and maintain through that. Otherwise tossing up SOTS on them would have been the go-to because.. no shielding cap when IGP was released. Yes, it was still a hard fight because of the tight DPS check and yes pre-nerf kills had to work hard at tank healing. But it wasn't DF. It was shielding lol

    Shielding. NOT Divine Favor. With it being reworked, now our ST healing souls can actually be balanced. Your posts are a perfect example of why Divine Favor was such a horrible crutch to Cleric healing.
    Last edited by Riane; 01-14-2017 at 09:46 PM.

  5. #5
    Soulwalker
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    Quote Originally Posted by Riane View Post
    Divine Favor isn't the reason most guilds in Rift got their NT HK and MoM kills (if they were even able to get passed Pagura.) It was because there was no shielding cap at all on Purifier. Nothing at all to do with Divine Favor carrying Purifier "healing" in NT raids.

    HM IGP was a joke because of no shielding cap. I solo healed HM Anraak the first week it was out and the only splash healing I had was from LGV on a DPS orientated Harbinger. I covered all of the Spines with Tidal Surge + Flash Over + Fiery Will + Gathering of the Flames, Faith's Reward procs + Healing Cataract, and Flame of Life when it was up.

    And HM Guulorth? Shielding. Again. The only thing DF really made a huge impact on was not having to actively heal the person standing out since you could toss DF up on them and maintain through that. Otherwise tossing up SOTS on them would have been the go-to because.. no shielding cap when IGP was released. Yes, it was still a hard fight because of the tight DPS check and yes pre-nerf kills had to work hard at tank healing. But it wasn't DF. It was shielding lol

    Shielding. NOT Divine Favor. With it being reworked, now our ST healing souls can actually be balanced. Your posts are a perfect example of why Divine Favor was such a horrible crutch to Cleric healing.
    The data disagrees with your opinion. Divine Favor has consistently provided 30-40% of HPS before and after the shielding nerfs that you reference. The shielding changes also came in before MoM.

    When comparing current live puri to PTS puri with the proposed DF changes, there is a valid concern that purifier will be significantly weaker than other soul single-target healing callings due to a raw inability to supplant health pools.

  6. #6
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Riane's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Storytimes View Post
    The data disagrees with your opinion. Divine Favor has consistently provided 30-40% of HPS before and after the shielding nerfs that you reference. The shielding changes also came in before MoM.

    When comparing current live puri to PTS puri with the proposed DF changes, there is a valid concern that purifier will be significantly weaker than other soul single-target healing callings due to a raw inability to supplant health pools.
    I can only repeat what I have already said to ya; Divine Favor is a crutch and your posts are proof of that.

    That being said: It's on the PTS for a reason and if Purifier needs it's raw throughput adjusted and balanced, that's fine and dandy. I even stated that. But then I also reminded you to look at the raw APS that Purifier still has.

    I suppose you'd probably also hate that I think SOTT should be removed and SOTS should be 1 target max and have a cooldown on it. ^.^

    Purifier cannot be a monster APS AND HPS without causing balancing issues. So long as the APS exists, the HPS should not surpass it and make it stand above the other ST healers. It needs to skirt a fine line because it does not need to be a staple healer again. Purifier has been an issue for far too long in Rift.

    Purifier - APS
    Sentinel - HPS
    Warden - AOE HPS
    Last edited by Riane; 01-15-2017 at 11:41 PM.

  7. #7
    Fia
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    I'm interested to see how this will affect Sentinel healing in PvP. We're already in a bad place compared to other classes, I think this will push us behind even further (even though it now makes it easier to heal, I have concerns about the strength of the heals themselves).
    Fiia@Typhiria | Asthea@Hailol
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  8. #8
    Soulwalker
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    also seeing some nice salvation numbers on PTS lol

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