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Thread: Adding Hit to PvP Gear.. Wrong thing to do...

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    Champion Zojah's Avatar
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    Default Adding Hit to PvP Gear.. Wrong thing to do...

    So, PvE and PvP players both spend yonks of there time grinding for the best gear.

    Why add Hit onto PvP gear so they can get maxed out and go straight into PvE.

    PvE players can't go straight into PvP with their hard earned gear



    Without adding Valor/Vengeance to PvE gear this would be a completely unfair thing to do.

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    The new twink threads.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qosmo View Post


    Without adding Valor/Vengeance to PvE gear this would be a completely unfair thing to do.
    Sure. Explain to me how Valor and Vengeance have an impact on your toons performance in PvE settings equal to the significant and important impact +hit makes in pvp scenarios.
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    Quote Originally Posted by spaceboots View Post
    The new twink threads.
    Oh, there's only a few thousand more of these to come.
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    lol
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    Plane Touched Bringer's Avatar
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    I personally do not care either way. However, why not make a hit pvp stat like vengeance is to power? For example..... call it penetration (aka pvp hit) that only works in pvp.

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    Ascendant Ajax1114's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qosmo View Post
    So, PvE and PvP players both spend yonks of there time grinding for the best gear.

    Why add Hit onto PvP gear so they can get maxed out and go straight into PvE.

    PvE players can't go straight into PvP with their hard earned gear



    Without adding Valor/Vengeance to PvE gear this would be a completely unfair thing to do.
    Well let's see as a top rank player, what PvE can I do with a little hit/focus on my weapon. I could go do tier 2 dungeons I suppose. Probably won't do much more than 1k DPS, but you can get away with that there. I could heal but that already doesn't require focus if I'm a cleric. Certainly won't be able to tank because PvP gear doesn't not provide toughness.

    Basically, a hypothetical top rank player in nothing but full PvP set is looking at two capabilities: Moderate DPS and reasonable healing, maybe going as high as T1 raids like Drowned Halls (actually I think I'd need more runes than are possible for that). Damn, that's really "going straight into PvE" after being maxed out. It's only 2 entire raid tiers behind what's current, but, um... clearly they're taking an easier path than you..!

    Also, PvEers can go straight into PvP with their gear - in about equivalent effectiveness as described above with the opposite transition. PvE geared players will be true glass cannons, hitting like trucks but dropping like rocks. Nothing is forcing them to wear the crappy low rank gear. If PvP gear had toughness and provided PvE synergy crystal gear set bonuses, this would be a different story - but that's obviously not the case and never will be because it would be ridiculous.
    Last edited by Ajax1114; 06-05-2012 at 12:03 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qosmo View Post
    So, PvE and PvP players both spend yonks of there time grinding for the best gear.

    Why add Hit onto PvP gear so they can get maxed out and go straight into PvE.

    PvE players can't go straight into PvP with their hard earned gear



    Without adding Valor/Vengeance to PvE gear this would be a completely unfair thing to do.
    You do know you can buy crafted gear without doing any pvp or raids? Don't worry, the relic weapons will still be better.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qosmo View Post
    Why add Hit onto PvP gear so they can get maxed out and go straight into PvE.
    Because increased endurance, vengeance and valor at the cost of dex, str and int all help so much in PvE for DPS toons that all those items lacked lacked was hit to be equivalent to ID gear!
    Last edited by Tolmos; 06-05-2012 at 12:43 PM.
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    Prophet of Telara -Shiva-'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Qosmo View Post
    So, PvE and PvP players both spend yonks of there time grinding for the best gear.

    Why add Hit onto PvP gear so they can get maxed out and go straight into PvE.

    PvE players can't go straight into PvP with their hard earned gear



    Without adding Valor/Vengeance to PvE gear this would be a completely unfair thing to do.
    PvE and PvP players do spend a good chunk of time grinding to get their gear, no argument there.

    Hit and Focus is being added to PvP weapons because Hit/Focus is not just a PvE stat, it also has a huge impact in PvP, and thus, quite rightly, deserves to be on PvP weapons. As for a PvP player maxing out and jumping straight into PvE, how are they going to do that? The R50 weapons, which are the same tier as ID weapons, have 15 less Hit/Focus on them. To make them viable to use in ID a PvP player would have to put Hit/Focus runes on them instead of Str/Dex/Int/Wis runes, lowering their overall DPS. PvP weapons also have a portion of their AP/SP converted to Vengeance, which is useless against PvE mobs. What's more they also have lower Str/Dex/Int/Wis than their PvE counterparts, making them even less effective in PvE. If a player wished to skip earlier progression they can get crafted weapons that have +65 Hit/Focus on them, and are better than the R50 weapons currently on the PTS. As an added bonus, a player doesn't have to grind 50 prestige levels, and the millions of favour required to buy a full suit of PvP gear. They can just fork over plat and be done with it.

    PvE players can go straight into PvP with their hard earned gear, and right now PvE weapons are vastly superior to PvP weapons for Warriors/Rogues. Every stat on PvE gear, with the exception of Toughness, works in PvP; unlike PvP gear in PvE, which has Valour and Vengeance. There are lots of players who use a mix of PvE/PvP gear in PvP. So, can you please explain how PvE players can't go into PvP with their hard earned gear? What you are saying is completely wrong.

    Why is it unfair for PvE weapons to not have Valour/Vengeance? Valour/Vengeance does absolutely nothing in PvE, whereas Hit/Focus work just as well in PvP as it does in PvE. We've been over this before in other threads, but by asking to have Vengeance put on PvE weapons, you're essentially asking for PvE weapons to be nerfed in PvE.

    Actually though, you are right, there is a level of unfairness with regards to PvE gear, and PvP gear. If Trion was to be totally fair they would add a new stat to PvE gear; let's call it Entitlement. A portion of the AP/SP on all PvE gear should be converted to Entitlement. The Entitlement stat should only work on PvE mobs, and be completely useless in PvP. What's more, any soul talents that increase AP/SP will not raise Entitlement at all, just like Vengeance is unaffected by these talents right now.

    There you go, that would make everything fair on both sides of the fence.
    Last edited by -Shiva-; 06-05-2012 at 10:32 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by -Shiva- View Post

    Actually though, you are right, there is a level of unfairness with regards to PvE gear, and PvP gear. If Trion was to be totally fair they would add a new stat to PvE gear; let's call it Entitlement. A portion of the AP/SP on all PvE gear should be converted to Entitlement. The Entitlement stat should only work on PvE mobs, and be completely useless in PvP. What's more, any soul talents that increase AP/SP will not raise Entitlement at all, just like Vengeance is unaffected by these talents right now.

    There you go, that would make everything fair on both sides of the fence.

    yes this exactly. i think many people dont even know hit is only on weapons, they speak of "hit on gear", guys: ITS ONLY ON THE WEAPONS and it makes about 100 hit together!

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    Ascendant HannonHellbringer's Avatar
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    Oh yay, another one of THESE threads...

  13. #13
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    What's currently the hit/focus on 1h/2h PvP weapons on PTS anyways? I know they started with 100, but announced they'd reduce it.

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    Telaran
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    Why again does it matter if pvp gear bleeds over a bit? Because I mean 2pc and 4pc haven't ever been seen in pvp before.

    Imo I think just having different options is never a bad thing! Also off topic of the thread but Hit is an important stat in pvp and is finally being recognised THANK-YOU!

    Goods will still be good. Bads will still be bad.

  15. #15
    Champion Zojah's Avatar
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    I simply used adding Vengeance etc to PvE gear as an example

    It's a silly thing to do right?

    A better option would be to make a new stat for pvp (That is similar to hit) that has no effect in PvE

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