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Thread: 10/19 cleric change feedback

  1. #1
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    Default 10/19 cleric change feedback

    Just making this thread to centralize discussion over our changes.

    Notes:

    1. Tank changes are fine.

    That's it, now I leave you guys to discuss the other tons of changes. They finally buffed our ST dps in specs that needed it! Whew, I was beginning to think that the > 500 threads created about the issue would go unheard.

  2. #2
    Ascendant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amary View Post
    PLEASE NOTE: These changes are very much in flux and this is an early version we wanted to get out for feedback as soon as possible. We're aware that a number of builds are not balanced right now so please expect further tuning and changes.
    What they need to do is make Basic Reading Comprehension a 0-point root in every cleric tree.
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  3. #3
    Ascendant Eughe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Isila View Post
    What they need to do is make Basic Reading Comprehension a 0-point root in every cleric tree.
    You would have a point if it weren't for a previous thread that they stated the very same thin after a very large list of name changes and non buffs thy had in the cleric forums.



    And then 2 weeks later 1.4 was released and nothing was added or changed.

    Breath? Not holding it.

  4. #4
    Shadowlander
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    I think the worst part is we can never get a single dev reply, not even a 'we are looking into the issue of cleric ST dps', or 'We are currently happy with where cleric dps is at the moment, DPS Clerics should not be feared in the same way that warriors or rogues should be'.

  5. #5
    Plane Walker Kolfinna's Avatar
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    Well, I really like the fact that Just Defense scales. It makes it a really nice big-hit thing. One thing I might like to see in cleric-tanks is a reduced-incoming-damage CD, though. It could tied into resplendent embrace. Instead of boosting max HP, it could reduce incoming damage by 20% and still increase healing by 20%.

    Tying magic resistance into precept is rather silly, considering most magic damage is from casters, at range. I think the best idea I've read splits magic mitigation and physical mitigation into two different "attacks", the blocking one for physical, and Thorvin's Law as its own spell.

    I'm a bit disappointed by the changes to cleric DPS. I haven't mathed it out, but it looks like the listed changes won't really help close the large gap between clerics and just about every other build, at least at high-end gear levels. This could probably use more thought, testing, and community feedback.

  6. #6
    Rift Disciple Adjana's Avatar
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    I'd like to see a small change in the heal souls.

    It would be nice if every healing soul would have an in combat rez at 34 points (so we only can get one of those). They could all be bit different (sentinel rez with x% hp/mana, warden/puri less hp but additional hot/shield on rez).
    At the moment i feel slightly forced into 32 sentinel build when learning new encounters and/or we are still a bit undergeared.
    Adjana - Shadows of the Dragon

    Yarrick - Lvl 5x Cleric@Icewatch

  7. #7
    Plane Touched
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    1. Tank changes are great.

    2. WTF still not even a mention of ST DPS.

    3. Why, for the love of god, do we still have 0 CC.

    4. Why is druid still laughable at best?

  8. #8
    Champion
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meowshwitz View Post
    4. Why is druid still laughable at best?
    WTB acknowledgement from trion they didnt forget druid soul still exists and fix thorns of asphodel!
    Gilg - 50 Guardian Cleric on Briarcliff
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  9. #9
    Soulwalker
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    Default we were forgotten

    in 1.4 we were simplified to 51point builds
    in 1.5 we become nerfed...every 3weeks old MM is a better dd...our synergie kristalls are an invention of a 5minutes coffebreak every class get 5% for the basic value of a useless skill (5% physikal dmg wtf shami use less than 25% phys dmg)
    in 1.6 they use an other 5min break to improve the tank shild but the weak st threat is the same..not to mention the dd who find no place in a grp or raid

    now we are only able/competitive to heal but which raid needs 7 healer

  10. #10
    Telaran
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    (Don't worry, for you lazy readers there's a tl;dr at the bottom.)

    Overall I like the current tank changes, but we need more. Trying to compete against a warrior for a tanking spot in a raid is sort of depressing. 10 times out of 10, even if I'm better geared, we pick the warrior. Why? They have better overall damage resistance and have some good party support and can do everything a tank should be able to do very well.

    First of all, I'd really love Bolt of Radiance to have its threat gen back. This new taunt, Provoke, that you gave us? Not liking it one bit. In my experience all it does is make one monster really hungry you for 3 seconds, then realize the healer is tastier and goes right back to it after that tiny timer is up. In that short amount of time I can barely get off another attack which is not enough to build back threat, especially if DPS and heals don't stop, drop and roll. At least Bolt gave me the threat timer and a nice place on the aggro table, while this is just a timer and zero aggro. Either give Bolt back its threat gen, or fix Provoke to not suck (make it longer or have it put me on the aggro table). I do realize Rebuke has this same 3 sec timer, but it also has a pull effect for casters and for some reason seems to give me aggro on the mobs even after it has worn off despite not causing damage, even if I am only able to get one strike in. Dunno how it works, it just does.

    Second and related to the first... I'd like to see another AoE taunt ability like Righteous Imperative or Rebuke, make it ranged (not just melee) and not on a long 1m cooldown. Rebuke is used for pulling, so if mobs get away from my melee range too fast for RI we're generally screwed. I know some clerics have builds that have AoE casts, but I tried some of those builds myself and the casting time is something that just does not work quickly enough and the casts are not taunts, so you've got to cast multiple times to get threat back. Specifically, I'd like a distanced version of RI or a muchmuchmuch shorter cooldown on Rebuke, along with Bolt getting threat gen back when you're in an OT situation and only want to aggro one. It should be noted that the only time I really have an issue with this lately is when DPS or heals don't give me a couple seconds to actually pull or start out just blazing their high DPS and pull after Rebuke wears down, but warriors don't seem to have an issue yanking back mobs from a distance if accidents do happen. I want that.

    Now... the stats thing. I just got done talking with my guild's top warrior tank to get a good idea of how far off of him I am tank stats wise since I'm pretty close to being just as geared as him. He has 5k more armor than me and almost TWICE my block, both of us self buffed. (We have pretty close parry/dodge, I actually have a bit more dodge, so that's not much of an issue.) Even with Precept of Refuge's boosts I'm not near where he is, and then you give them even more in their abilities... He has 1.5k more HP than me, but all those other stats is what make him as a warrior tank so much better. I'd just like to see more for us... I'm not even sure what to suggest here. Our gear is chain for God's sake, not much you can do to make it more sturdy. Give more boosts to Mein of Leadership maybe, I dunno. We can tank fine until there's a pile of high damage, and at that point there must be a warrior tank. They argue how we can self heal... Those self heals don't do very much. Most of my self healing comes from the proccing of SHoE, because the Doctrines don't heal for much since in tank mode your SP is a lot lower, and all the auto heals depend on the damage you do which is hardly anything as well. The 51 point ability is pretty dang useless too considering it also banks on the fact that you're going to be dealing some decent damage. Auto heals are really nice when you're spamming Even Justice in mobs, but even then its sub-par when you consider how much damage you're taking vs. how much you need to prevent from hitting you in the first place. Single target... well, you may as well not even have Salvation and Reparation on.

    I realize we can't be the best at everything and we're probably only meant for healing, but if we're going to suck at single target DPS forever (AoE we're fine) at least let me tank almost as good as warrior please? That can't be asking for too much.


    tl;dr?
    Overall changes so far are good, but not enough.
    Need Bolt of Radiance to have threat back. Provoke sucks.
    Need a distanced AoE taunt with a not 1m cooldown.
    Need more raw defensive stats somehow.
    Our DPS will probably always be sub-par, so at least let us tank next to a warrior. Healing gets boring.

  11. #11
    Live Stream Team Ferrel's Avatar
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    Personally I am voting for the resurrection change. It is insane at how easily a Chloromancer can earn the five minute resurrection. It shouldn't mean having to dump your points into sentinel or justicar for a healing cleric to do the same.

    I'd like to see a reasonably recast-timed combat resurrection in every build.
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  12. #12
    Shield of Telara
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    All three healing classes should have a battlerez, sentinel's should be 5 minutes like the chloro...

  13. #13
    Prophet of Telara
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    Chloro has a FOUR minute brez.

    Also want to trade Inquisitor's 44 armor Shroud of Agony (lulz terribad) with Stomcaller's 44 brez Spark of Life.

    Why the **** does a pure AoE DPS mage soul have a brez?

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