+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 25

Thread: Rant at overly casual players in the MMO genre

  1. #1
    Plane Touched Lepus_Iscariot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Issaquah, WA
    Posts
    194

    Default Rant at overly casual players in the MMO genre


    OK, so I was slinking around a forum today to see what people had to say about FFIV. I played the beta, and now that it is over and the game is released, I feel the need to say ... what a pile. I mean, honestly ... what a pile. It is only my opinion, so don't get up in arms, but ... what a pile. The other side of this is that I haven't liked the franchise much since the SNES days, so I might not be the right "fan" to ask, but as a MMORPG fan ... what a pile.

    But I digress.


    What I saw on those forums were people coming out of the woodwork to defend the game; and, I feel, the common example of their defense was: "I have a job / wife / kids / mortgage / live-in invalid / my house is on fire / I just don't have any time. And therefore I need a game where I can log on for five minutes, accomplish something, and log off, because I don't have time to group / raid / adventure / quest / etc"

    Now, I've heard this rhetoric repeated for many years in defense of easy / cheesy / smurfy / common denominator / uninspired games.

    My rant is this ... if you don't have time, go play a RPG, and not a MMORGP. Perhaps it isn't the genre for you! Leave it for people who do have some time, and the people who don't mind spending a long amount of time working towards the top. Sure, the power gamers will pass you up, but just be confident in the fact that those who burn twice as bright last half as long. They will burn themselves out before you catch up and be long gone. In the mean time, you will become more familiar with the game, will have slowed down and thus noticed your surroundings, explored more of the area, and learned the nuances of the world. I find it akin to a one night stand vs a lengthy relationship. Sure, sex is sex, but sex with someone who you are familiar with but not tired of is always more rewarding.

    I guess I just don't see a point in accommodating people who have so little time that they need these games sped up, dumbed down (and I am not saying you are dumb , merely that if you can accomplish something in a quick amount of time that it can't be all that hard), and streamlined. It ruins it fore the rest of us, and although it makes a easy2play. fast2master game, it really drops the quality for everyone.

    OK, I'm done.

  2. #2
    General of Telara luci's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    PA
    Posts
    768

    Default

    Thank you for saying this, I do completely agree. It drives me crazy that games do this for people.

    Computer: Massive sexy beast that rocks your socks off

  3. #3
    Rift Chaser Grovak's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    356

    Default

    Apparantly there are enough people that fit into that group out there that companies feel they need to accomodate as well. If that group makes up half of your subscription base, you need to find a way to take care of them.

    It can be a challenge to find the balance of making a game challenging enough for the hardcore gamers, while making content for casual gamers as well.

    Just because someone doesn't have a lot of time to play doesn't mean they shouldn't play these games. It just means it will take them longer to progress.

  4. #4
    Ascendant Slyde's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    California USA
    Posts
    1,669

    Default

    I agree with you 100%.

    Unfortunately this thread will probably get locked, because they don't like it when we bash other games.
    Dual Targeting - The Targeting System of the Modern MMO

    If the Lord of the Rings movie trilogy was made by today's MMO designers, the first 8 hours would be condensed into 30 minutes, and the last hour would be stretched out over 8.5 hours. It would be all about 'The Ending' and not about 'The Journey'.

  5. #5
    Plane Touched ryashani's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    DC/MD/WV
    Posts
    208

    Default

    Occasionally, I am one of those people, but I dont ever expect to be able to REALLY do something in a short amount of time. If I know I only have an hour to sit down and play, I choose explore, or do trade skills, do 'run around/deliver mail' type quests or finish up old quests I never completed when I was younger, or just BS with guildies while I look at things in the auction house. All of those things I can do in between loads of laundry or cleaning up after the cats.

    When I have more time to play I start new quests, find good hunting grounds, join groups for bigger adventures, work towards actual game goals, etc.

    I dont think a MMO would appeal to me if the bulk of the materialcould be accomplished in 15 minute spurts ;-)

  6. #6
    Plane Touched Lepus_Iscariot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Issaquah, WA
    Posts
    194

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ryashani View Post
    Occasionally, I am one of those people, but I dont ever expect to be able to REALLY do something in a short amount of time. If I know I only have an hour to sit down and play, I choose explore, or do trade skills, do 'run around/deliver mail' type quests or finish up old quests I never completed when I was younger, or just BS with guildies while I look at things in the auction house. All of those things I can do in between loads of laundry or cleaning up after the cats.

    When I have more time to play I start new quests, find good hunting grounds, join groups for bigger adventures, work towards actual game goals, etc.

    I dont think a MMO would appeal to me if the bulk of the materialcould be accomplished in 15 minute spurts ;-)
    If only they could make it so the cats could play too ...

  7. #7
    Plane Touched Lepus_Iscariot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Issaquah, WA
    Posts
    194

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Slyde View Post
    I agree with you 100%.

    Unfortunately this thread will probably get locked, because they don't like it when we bash other games.
    Yeah ... but I want to reiterate that the "bashing" of FF14 is merely my opinion. The rest of my post isn't directed at a single game, but more at a trend I've seen in other games.

  8. #8
    Ascendant Kula's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Posts
    1,412

    Default

    I've felt the way you expressed many times. Unfortunately, developers (and I assume their investors) don't care to gamble that there are people like you & I while there is ample evidence that many will pay for casual-appeal games.

  9. #9
    Plane Touched ryashani's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    DC/MD/WV
    Posts
    208

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Lepus_Iscariot View Post
    If only they could make it so the cats could play too ...
    Then the cats would complain because no one would want to group with them because they have an even shorter attention span than some of those overly casual players ;-)

  10. #10
    Plane Touched Lepus_Iscariot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Issaquah, WA
    Posts
    194

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by ryashani View Post
    Then the cats would complain because no one would want to group with them because they have an even shorter attention span than some of those overly casual players ;-)
    All they would have to do is add a program where a feather danced around the screen for 10-15 minutes; then a bed for 4-5 hours; then some food ... rinse and repeat.

  11. #11
    Plane Touched Ware's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Cleveland, OH
    Posts
    282

    Default

    It's all about the market - if they think they can get more subs by creating content that would appeal to a more casual gamer then it makes the most financial sense for them to do that. Revenue wise, casual players (as they're defined here) will likely play longer (because they'll never play long enough to get bored of the content), consume less resources (in bandwidth and for customer service), and demand less new content than "hardcore" players. If it were my company, I'd go after casual players too...

  12. #12
    Champion Kithiel's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    Location
    US
    Posts
    529

    Default

    I agree with the OP and I would contend that the people who do are a better financial bet that the 'casual' gamers because let's face it, we have a higher tendency to play (and pay) the most and the longest. Your casual gamer will probably wait until the price drops a bit to buy the new expansion and won't think twice about canceling his or her sub for a month or two because the electric bill or whatever was higher than usual and something had to give.

  13. #13
    Rift Disciple Dakgo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Posts
    149

    Default

    How many subscribers in a modern MMORPG are casual, normal and hardcore? I would say probably half of the subscribers are casual and 1 in 10 is hardcore. Thats why they make games more casual.

    I myself am between hardcore and normal, depending on RL. I would even pay double the monthly fees to get a hard game like EQ (hard compared to todays games) used to be after release. Something where you have to work to achieve things. Where achieving things means something.

    The problem is that such games wont stay on the market, they are too expansive to develop and support without the money from casual gamers.

  14. #14
    Ascendant popsicledeath's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Location
    ID
    Posts
    1,463

    Default

    Never understood why the 'I don't have time, so the games should change' argument was always accepted in mmorpg communities.

    I mean, novels aren't getting shorter (maybe unfortunately) and if you complained novels were too long and you didn't have time, so writers should just start writing less, people would laugh at you and tell you to read something else, then. And it would be legit.

    But in mmorpgs, the casual 'change the game to my time constraints' crowd is often the loudest voice. /boggle.

    In other news. I don't have the money to buy a BMW. It's not fair! I work too! They should lower the price so I can afford one, and NOW!
    -According to a Facebook quiz, I'm a genius.

  15. #15
    Plane Touched Lepus_Iscariot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2010
    Location
    Issaquah, WA
    Posts
    194

    Default

    I understand that catering to the lowest common denominator is a valid business ideal, and I do believe it drives the industry neigh completely; however, when I look at other forms of entertainment, I think that many creators have found a way to incorporate both depth and accessibility.

    It is a hard comparison to make, but I think I will use literature as a first example. Now, although I am a fan of Thomas Pynchon and William Burroughs, I understand that they will never have a 'everyman' appeal, not to say that the 'everyman' appeal isn't a valid one, but merely saying that a novel like Gravity's Rainbow or Mason and Dixon takes a certain amount of time, dedication, effort, and secondary research to get through and understand. Likewise, not everyone can handle the phantasmagoria, sex-death imagery, and rampant homosexuality and drug use offered by Burroughs. They are niche reads, and usually only appreciated by people who are somehow invested in literature. Neither authors made a fortune off writing; they certainly did very well for themselves, but I wouldn't say their big success was a financial one.

    Now, compare them to .... oh J.K. Rowling and Stephenie Meyers. Now, their books are highly accessible and can be read, digested, and processed by practically any individual, even those who usually wouldn't pick up a book. I am NOT saying that they are any better or worse than Pynchon or Burroughs, but they are certainly more financially successful, and have reached a far wider audience. They have sold millions of copies and have made movie deals galore. They are books that have a commercial appeal, but are not necessarily the type that someone highly concerned with literature would 'study,' although they would read for the pure entertainment of the plot.

    Now, here is my point. There are plenty of authors that have breached the gap. Kurt Vonnegut, Jr, Philip K. Dick, J.R.R. Tolkien, etc. We need a game that falls into this category. It is one that combines depth, purpose, accessibility, and financial success. Admittedly a lot of these authors only saw success after their deaths, but I'm not taking that into account for this argument. Their stories made a good amount of cash in time, and even though they might not have been around to see it, their stories have been perpetuated greatly.

    Even though I am talking literature, I believe this ideal can been seen at work in all forms of art and creation. Why not the MMORPG genre? It is all well and good to talk about the reality we live in, it is another thing to speak of a solution.

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts