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Thread: How exactly do you "win" in a MMO?

  1. #1
    Rift Disciple ItzCrooK2UxD's Avatar
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    Default How exactly do you "win" in a MMO?

    Earlier I noticed that a quick search of the forums for "P2W" or pay to win will get quite a few results. People would say things about selling in game gear such as T1 raid gear would make the game more P2W, but how do you win in an MMO?

    My thoughts are that there are many ways to "win" in an MMO, but all are subjective (much like how in a WF you may be tracking total damage for yourself, while someone else is tracking KBs or heals).

    Thoughts?
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  2. #2
    Ascendant the_real_seebs's Avatar
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    The etymology of P2W goes back to more directly competitive games, like some of Zynga's facebook things, where a player who spends money can stomp you if you don't spend money.

    That said, I do know of an MMO with an explicit win condition. In DDO, when you reach level cap you can reroll that character with a permanent additional flag showing they had that past life. If you have done this for every class in the game, you get a meta called "completionist", which says "You have won DDO."

    Of course, you lose it if they add another class.
    You can play WoW in any MMO. You don't have to play WoW in RIFT. Oh, and no, RIFT is not a WoW clone. Not having fun any more? Learn to play, noob! I don't speak for Riftui, but I moderate stuff there. Just came back? Welcome back! Here's what's changed. (Updated for 2.5!)

  3. #3
    Plane Walker Gehrgontra's Avatar
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    In terms of MMOs, there is rarely if ever a straight up "Win" condition (though that DDO example is kinda humorous). In these kinds of games, "winning" can be in terms of victories in PvP or in achieving World First kills. The assertion is that someone who spends money has an advantage over someone who doesn't that cannot be remedied in reasonable time through in-game effort.

    For example, consider the Tenebrous enchant from Neverwinter. That thing is basically solely responsible for the whole P2W debacle, because not only is it incredibly powerful it can only be obtained through the lockboxes. While it can also be purchased on the auction house if someone decides to put it up there, the currency required to buy it is limited in how much you can get per day unless, of course, you directly purchase it. With the price those enchants can go at, it can take weeks if not months to get a single lesser enchant; combine three to get a normal, combine three to get a greater, and did I mention that the chance to successfully combine them is so abysmally low that you need to purchase a separate item to guarantee it? Tenebrous enchants are so powerful that equal gear, equal skill, he with Tene wins. If someone without a Tene is better geared and more skilled, that enchant still has a pretty good chance of letting the so-called "Credit Card Warrior" win. So in NWO, your options if you want to win in PvP are to dump hundreds into the cash shop for keys to open the boxes, pray that you get what you want, and maybe get those enchants in a few hours; or, you can spend months slowly clawing up enough resources to buy something that puts you on equal footing with the dude who has been winning since day 1. Note that this applies almost exclusively to PvP.

    In terms of providing a competitive PvE advantage, about all I can think of is that in Everquest accounts are limited to certain tiers of skill tomes based on what level the account is; Free, Silver, Gold, or Subscriber. Each level of account could still learn the highest level spells, but there were separate tiers like novice, adept, what have you, and the highest tiers were only available to Subscribers. Or maybe Gold too, been a while since I played that game. Might have even been an EQ2 thing, now that I think about it. In any case, thanks to limited skill tiers without spending a decent amount of money your character would be less effective than an equally skilled and geared character of the same class and the only remedy was to open your wallet.

    Those are the only examples I can think of that I would consider P2W, and only because payment is required to obtain a competitive advantage in relation to the current end game.
    If you're too old to play with Legos, you still have some growing up to do.

  4. #4
    Rift Disciple
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    Option 1: "The only winning move is, not to play." http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NHWjlCaIrQo

    Option 2: If you have gained enough loot that you are sure your e-peen is larger than a significant amount of other players, you win.

    Option 3: Did you have fun playing the MMO with friends online?
    Last edited by Lithium1; 12-04-2013 at 03:38 PM.

  5. #5
    Prophet of Telara Meowy's Avatar
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    I would say I already won in any MMO I play... until I 'lose' interest in it.
    Serale@Faeblight

  6. #6
    Prophet of Telara Goodberry's Avatar
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    Default Good question!

    My take is: you win if you manage to have fun while not allowing the game to eat up too much of your life or even your leisure time. You lose if it becomes like an unpaid job and/or an addiction.
    Never give a sword to a man who can't dance (Confucius)

  7. #7
    Rift Master Godgrinder's Avatar
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    I know one other real p2w game that had to change the term p2w into f2p as a general thing on their boards because everyone who touched the game complained.
    Rightfully so if I may add.

    Rift compared to any actual p2w games is just... a dream come true to be honest.

  8. #8
    Ascendant Laeris's Avatar
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    In my opinion, a player "wins" when they become widely recognized.

  9. #9
    Prophet of Telara Goodberry's Avatar
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    Only if being widely recognized is your goal. Surely not mine. :P
    Last edited by Goodberry; 12-09-2013 at 05:36 PM.
    Never give a sword to a man who can't dance (Confucius)

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