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Thread: Dark Souls Sucks

  1. #1
    Plane Touched
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    Default Dark Souls Sucks

    Although I posted a favorable review last week, now late in the game I've discovered that the difficulty of combat, checkpoints, and acquiring loot is not the problem. It's the irreparable damage the game allows you to accomplish whether on accident or intentionally. It's worse than perma-death. It's worse than overwriting your Oblivion save game because you were drunk. It's worse than dating a girl with cats.

    Stay a While and Listen to Me Bleed to Death
    NPCs are a staple of any good RPG. You want to interact with them, talk to them, learn their story and accept their ridiculous quests because they reward you upon return. What you probably don't want to do, assuming they're a crucial part of the story or the only f'ing vendor that sells that one spell in the game is kill them in the face. While there might be some very marginal reward for doing so, like gold or a picture of their newly orphaned children, it's usually not as beneficial as say, letting them give you the dragon sword or slaying the mighty herpes beast. FROM Software has decided this is all crap, and if you happen to, I don't know, set the controller down to refill your scotch and accidentally hit the bumper button in front of the NPC there's a chance you'll upset them, defend yourself, and remove them from the game forever.

    But it gets better.

    While I managed to unintentionally kill someone that was apparently going to leave / die later anyways, it wasn't a huge deal. However, in the game there are a handful of NPCs you essentially rescue (or kill) from various situations. See, some of these NPCs are extremely important. As in, you'll never be able to cast vital spells or purchase story-based required items if you decide to hack open the barrel they're trapped in like a normal person when you're supposed to actually roll into it to break it (seriously).

    I realize there are similar NPC vendors (two or three) throughout the game that sell similar items, but there are some very unique inventories and even if you couldn't get the super fireball from the first guy you slaughtered, the other guy you can buy it from is waiting patiently ... about 25 god damn hours from now in a place that's really hard to reach without the super fireball. Do you see the issue here? If you don't, I'll be happy to email you pictures of the first four controllers I broke with my face.

    Range is Better Than Melee. Almost Always.
    Some of you might remember games like Oblivion, or Morrowind (which I hated), where you could exploit the range attacks quite well. You know, go buy a few thousand "Child's Crayon" arrows and shoot them for two hours into the Lava Dragon Monster Demon Sandwich who wouldn't notice he was getting slowly pelted to death as long as you were more than seven feet from his face.

    You can do the exact same thing in Dark Souls.

    But that's exploitation, and doesn't mean the game sucks because people figured out they could take advantage of dumb AI and mechanics. Besides, those fireballs and arrows are only good for taking a shot or two at Bald Bull as he charges little Mac. Right?

    Wrong.

    Not only is the game incredibly cool about you eating through massive creature's health from range, but if they actually notice you, you're better off strafing and firing lightning bolts and stuff instead of ever pulling out a sword.

    If you think that's an exaggeration, go ahead and look up every boss in the Dark Souls wiki - careful though, a lot of spoilers there. You'll notice 90% (again, seriously) of the "Boss Strategies" involve words like "range" and/or "fireball" and/or "arrows" and/or "seriously, if you don't have spells or 200 dexterity and a crazy bow made out of baby skulls, you're going to die."

    That's kind of a problem if you have a PHD in snapping necks and a minor in Kinding of Shooting Arrows Barely 101 or the closest you come to casting spells is making fun of LARP videos on YouTube.

    Just Go Get the Thing from the Guy and You'll Live Through This
    FROM Software thinks that the more vague something is, the more adventure it provides in the search. For example, if you asked for directions to a landmark while hiking beautiful mountains with a loved one, this is a feasible philosophy. But it's nothing like that. It's more like falling out of an exploding airplane without knowing where to find a parachute.

    There is actually a part in the game, seriously, where an NPC says something like, and I'm paraphrasing, "you'll actually die if you go into (spoiler location) without knowing how to traverse it. There's this guy that knew how to traverse it. You should talk to him. Good luck, a-hole."

    Yep. And guess where this "guy" is? First of all, it's not a guy. It's an object, and second of all, it's in a location totally f'ing unrelated to anything you've done so far. You'd basically have to go exploring in an arbitrary location far away, fight a boss you may or may not be prepared for (and if you're not, clearly you're in the wrong place, right?) kill it, and get the required object.

    I only figured it out because it was a fluke - a total accident. I was so pissed off at the boss I was stuck on I decided to go exploring and killing everything I could. I just kind of stumbled into this and got lucky. I can't imagine how angry I would have been had I found out the hard way.

    But that's not all.

    There are certain parts in the game that require other items - for example one item is absolutely essentially to even hit the monsters in the area while another is required or you'll stumble through pitch black. I know you're probably laughing and saying to yourself "while you're brilliant and attractive, Homebrew, it seems like if it's dark you can just go buy a torch or use a Light spell." Oh really? Who sells torches? Are you sure they exist in the game? Do I have to go attack a tornado and piss on a dragon's face to send him crashing into the roof of the pitch black area so it opens to sunlight? What if I am literally unable to cast spells? Who sells Light? DID I ALREADY F'ING KILL THAT GUY ON ACCIDENT?

    I think you get the point. Pretend you're playing Castlevania 2, but remove any semblance of NPC instruction / dialog and make the things you're required to do slightly more obscure and less obvious.

    It's not only vague, but you could have possibly ruined yourself and you just won't know it until 40+ hours in the game FROM Software gets your mom pregnant and sends death threats to your grandparents. At least that's what it feels like, considering the investment.

    There's Some Grinding Involved
    And I say "some" the way Keith Richards took "some" drugs. I don't care how exceptional your reflexes are. It doesn't matter that you won a Starcraft competition or "intentionally" wrote off dating women to win a Ferrari in a Doom tournament. And even if you play on a 90" TV on your tenth play-through using the Nintendo Power Glove, you're still going to grind your balls off. The game is designed to be reasonable about reaching a boss, but once you get there on occasion you'll have a rude revelation: those monsters on the way to the boss were reasonably easy because you're going to have to kill about five thousand more of them in order to beat the boss.

    For those of you that are experiencing this already, feel free to click here if you want a good, somewhat exploitative way to grind out levels. Yeah, I have no reservations providing this link because FROM Software has pissed me off one too many times.

    The only saving grace here is that the game is insanely beautiful, combat is somewhat fun and the death animations are great, so at least you'll be mildly entertained until about Undead Zombie #47,103 dies to your counter-animation #23,558.

    FFFFUUUUUUUUUUU

    You'll notice that my writing went from structured and informative to sloppy and rant heavy. My sarcasm seemingly went off the charts, and you could probably feel the rage emanating from every other word. There's a reason for that.

    That is exactly how this game feels.

    At first you'll be in awe and wonder, reveling in the beauty and adventure the world provides. You'll notice a few issues here and there, but nothing soul-crushing (no pun intended). There will be moments of mild annoyance and irritation, and when you inadvertently slaughtered that guy you meant to greet you'll assume the consequences are limited.

    Then things will get dirtier. You'll start forgetting where to go, stumble into places you're not sure you're supposed to be, wonder where to buy spells, items, and make stronger weapons. You'll start putting points into stats you're not sure are important, lose a monstrous amount of souls falling off cliffs, and trying to figure out what the hell a covenant actually means and how you gain reputation with one.

    Eventually, all of your seemingly innocent "mistakes" will catch up to you, you'll be inundated with terms, items, and NPCs that make no sense whatsoever and provide little to no explanation. You'll start wandering aimlessly and failing at different locations you may or may not need to be exploring just for a change of fail scenery.

    Then you'll be me. One broken controller, a $240 rug stained with Scotch, a bloody knuckle (not a joke), and neighbors that consider calling the cops every night around 8pm, when you're finally home from work, playing this god damn piece of crap game that you can't seem to stop torturing yourself with.

    Much Love,

    Homebrew

  2. #2
    General of Telara
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    At first you'll be in awe and wonder, reveling in the beauty and adventure the world provides. You'll notice a few issues here and there, but nothing soul-crushing (no pun intended). There will be moments of mild annoyance and irritation, and when you inadvertently slaughtered that guy you meant to greet you'll assume the consequences are limited.

    Then things will get dirtier. You'll start forgetting where to go, stumble into places you're not sure you're supposed to be, wonder where to buy spells, items, and make stronger weapons. You'll start putting points into stats you're not sure are important, lose a monstrous amount of souls falling off cliffs, and trying to figure out what the hell a covenant actually means and how you gain reputation with one.

    Eventually, all of your seemingly innocent "mistakes" will catch up to you, you'll be inundated with terms, items, and NPCs that make no sense whatsoever and provide little to no explanation. You'll start wandering aimlessly and failing at different locations you may or may not need to be exploring just for a change of fail scenery.
    Now that sounds like one very realistic, very annoying rpg.

    If they set out to do that, then they from what you are saying they have succeeded.
    The first game was meant to be very hard to the point a lot gave up, but this is meant to be even more of a challenge. I suppose no matter what, there is no pleasing everybody.

    Now if only there was an mmo company to have the balls to release this as an mmorpg and charge you a monthly subscription, maybe we could get rid of a few of the carebears who like to compare Rift as wow2, but consdering they only ever played wow before, tend to forget that wow wasnt the first mmo, wow copied games before it


    Oh and sorry i forget the obligatory abuse (nice post though, enjoyed reading it)

    You mad brah? ;)
    Last edited by Elgarr; 10-17-2011 at 07:55 AM.

  3. #3
    Soulwalker
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    what I can say is... stop killing NPC ? If you had just ran away instead of killing them, you could have repair the dmg at church area after you kill the gargoyles boss.
    Sun bug (helm item) give lights, or you can just purchase light spell.
    Honestly, if you need game to tell you you shouldn't go around killing npc or you will be handicapped, you are not suited for Dark Souls. Take responsibility for what you did and live through it. At least they gave you an option to repair the dmg if you dont kill them outright. Besides, you can still beat the game even if you kill every npcs =p

    Every boss is beatable with range/melee, you just need to know what attack you can block, what need to be dodged.



    Dark Souls sucks ? I would say this is Game of the Year material. Its hard, but it is also rewarding.

  4. #4
    Ascendant tro44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elgarr View Post
    Now that sounds like one very realistic, very annoying rpg.

    If they set out to do that, then they from what you are saying they have succeeded.
    The first game was meant to be very hard to the point a lot gave up, but this is meant to be even more of a challenge. I suppose no matter what, there is no pleasing everybody.

    Now if only there was an mmo company to have the balls to release this as an mmorpg and charge you a monthly subscription, maybe we could get rid of a few of the carebears who like to compare Rift as wow2, but consdering they only ever played wow before, tend to forget that wow wasnt the first mmo, wow copied games before it


    Oh and sorry i forget the obligatory abuse (nice post though, enjoyed reading it)

    You mad brah? ;)
    how would a MMO Dark Soul, get rid of carebares as you call it?

    they would only attract the players that like all those timesinks. many games are out there like that. they have little effect on MMO like WoW and Rift.

    Lets Go Rift. Hope Archeage can do something next. Lets Save Rift

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  6. #6
    Plane Touched
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassiel of harrow View Post
    Ah man, thank you for that. I cried laughing so hard.

  7. #7
    Ascendant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassiel of harrow View Post
    That might just be one of the funniest things I have seen on the internet. ever.

    had me in stitches

  8. #8
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    Interesting take on things, Homebrew. Eloquent as always.

    I agree with more or less everything you say, yet I love the game all the more for the qualities you have come to detest. It's different, it doesn't try to hold your hand, and I've been slowly and cautiously crawling my way through the title for some time now. I have yet to look at a guide, read a forum post with spoilers, or anything else, and i'm still progressing semi-smoothly, albeit dying semi-often and hand-drawing a couple maps/general references for myself.

    I think the trend of modern games is simply too hand-holdy, giving overmuch guidance and far too descriptive and linear "Go here, perform X task" type gameplay. I can thoroughly appreciate a "Once upon a time, I heard of a way to get through X area..." tactic, because it's far more feasible than "I heard Bobby Joe Questman once knew how to do that, he's in X zone now, here i'll mark him on your map". I'd rather have to seek him out at my own peril through lands unknown, perhaps die on the way a few times, and have to adapt to the adversity awaiting me.

    Thats' just me.

    Still digging Darksouls, just like my original post states.
    (But everything Homebrew has pointed out here is more or less true, so if you're easily frustrated, take heed from his standpoint).
    Asono, Guild Leader / Main Tank of <Chaos Legion>
    4/4 River of Souls / 5/5 Greenscale's Blight / 10/11 Hammerknell

  9. #9
    Soulwalker
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    Default ha ha ha

    thirty years ago i would of loved a game like this beat arkanoid now pfft barely click sigh

  10. #10
    Ascendant tro44's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cassiel of harrow View Post
    DIE LAUGHING!!!


    ****TTTTTT MORE SOUL WALKING!!! YOU B****!!!!! Damnit!!!!

    Lets Go Rift. Hope Archeage can do something next. Lets Save Rift

  11. #11
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    Quote Originally Posted by Asono View Post
    Interesting take on things, Homebrew. Eloquent as always.

    I agree with more or less everything you say, yet I love the game all the more for the qualities you have come to detest. It's different, it doesn't try to hold your hand, and I've been slowly and cautiously crawling my way through the title for some time now. I have yet to look at a guide, read a forum post with spoilers, or anything else, and i'm still progressing semi-smoothly, albeit dying semi-often and hand-drawing a couple maps/general references for myself.

    I think the trend of modern games is simply too hand-holdy, giving overmuch guidance and far too descriptive and linear "Go here, perform X task" type gameplay. I can thoroughly appreciate a "Once upon a time, I heard of a way to get through X area..." tactic, because it's far more feasible than "I heard Bobby Joe Questman once knew how to do that, he's in X zone now, here i'll mark him on your map". I'd rather have to seek him out at my own peril through lands unknown, perhaps die on the way a few times, and have to adapt to the adversity awaiting me.

    Thats' just me.

    Still digging Darksouls, just like my original post states.
    (But everything Homebrew has pointed out here is more or less true, so if you're easily frustrated, take heed from his standpoint).

    I can tell the OP is playing with a PS3, because I remember attacking that powerful elite in the first game's Nexus zone, because I sat my controller down and the weak back buttons activated and swung at him. I was a low level, so I would have to run from him all the time. Until I finally had enough and pushed his *** off the cliff.

    But lefts be honest here.

    you complain about handholding..

    but take away the Harsh DP from Dark Soul,, and what is left over?

    I played Many RPG games, that didnt even have HDP, yet they have more interesting gameplay that didnt really need a HDP. What does Demon Soul/Dark Soul have other than the Death penalty?

    Halo the FPS has many gameplay modes of difficulty, yet the game doesnt use a tacky HDP system.

    seems like the truth of Demon Soul and Dark Soul, is that the gameplay is second to the DP

    Lets Go Rift. Hope Archeage can do something next. Lets Save Rift

  12. #12
    General of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by tro44 View Post
    how would a MMO Dark Soul, get rid of carebares as you call it?

    they would only attract the players that like all those timesinks. many games are out there like that. they have little effect on MMO like WoW and Rift.
    Its quite simple, ever since wow, mmo's have been more main stream and aimed at the more casual, before then with games like Eq, you would never have been able to play that as a casual player, especially as you could have spent your entire time and some, just trying to get your corpse back.

    Trust me, people want easy mode on everything now, Eq and easy mode did not go hand in hand.

    Prime example, could you imagine someone in say wow being expected to camp for 4 days to get one mob to pop for a quest, after killing the Ph every 4 hrs and setting your alarm clock to it, so you would wake up no matter what time just to log in and get ready for the pop?

  13. #13
    Champion of Telara Morituri's Avatar
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    I got the same impression after watching MikeB's BFF Report.

    http://www.youtube.com/user/akamikeb.../3/2wgakIg9wrQ

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elgarr View Post
    Its quite simple, ever since wow, mmo's have been more main stream and aimed at the more casual, before then with games like Eq, you would never have been able to play that as a casual player, especially as you could have spent your entire time and some, just trying to get your corpse back.

    Trust me, people want easy mode on everything now, Eq and easy mode did not go hand in hand.

    Prime example, could you imagine someone in say wow being expected to camp for 4 days to get one mob to pop for a quest, after killing the Ph every 4 hrs and setting your alarm clock to it, so you would wake up no matter what time just to log in and get ready for the pop?
    hello, you seem to forget that there are many hardcore MMO out there. how well are they doing?

    I didnt see them get rid of Casuals. so your argument is moot..

    Lets Go Rift. Hope Archeage can do something next. Lets Save Rift

  15. #15
    Plane Touched
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    Thanks Asono. I'm still playing the game as well, and the only time I read walkthroughs / forums is after I've crushed a boss and just have to know if I did something horribly wrong considering it took me so many attempts. More often than not, the explanation is "... easy if you use a range ..." which never ceases to anger me.

    I agree with you as well regarding the sense of wonder and the "Once upon a time ..." statement you made, but I'll give you an example of why not holding your hand at least a little bit can be frustrating as hell and almost made me walk away from the game more than once.

    Edit: Rant about more issues with the game deleted. I basically said "they should hold your hand a little bit, because I've made huge mistakes due to lack of descriptions, dialog, etc."
    Last edited by Homebrew; 10-18-2011 at 10:19 AM.

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