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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Dev Update Note 03/27 (Ability Lag, Souls, PvP)

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    Director of Community Relations TrionBrasse's Avatar
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    Default Dev Update Note 03/27 (Ability Lag, Souls, PvP)

    Hi folks,

    While there are events, content, and soul-work going on in development for both Live and Prime right now, we wanted to address a handful of priorities after this past weekend’s play experiences. (Yes, we all play, usually anonymously - we may have been in your group!)

    Here’s a quick update on what we’ve got cooking this week.
    We are doing a long restart tomorrow morning (Wednesday 03/28) and pushing the weekly patch update to Thursday (03/29) instead, in order to get more adjustments in as fast as possible. Details will be in the patch notes!


    Let’s talk ability lag, which usually happens when there’s a large zone event going on. This affects both Live and Prime:
    • This may come as a surprise: Some of the zone events on Prime are bigger than even the biggest, record setting events RIFT had during its beta and original launch.
    • Since then, souls and abilities have gotten more numerous, more complicated, and more resource intensive, primarily in their use of server CPU.
    • Even with the newer hardware that the Prime cluster is running on (it’s a beast – the newest in the company), we’ve all experienced that at times it is not always able to keep up with the mass of data.
    • The reason this may affect you even when you’re personally not in a big zone event is because large numbers of people sharing your “player service” are.
    • Last week: We made some adjustments and undertook diagnostics of the causes. While we haven't seen a huge benefit yet, we certainly gained more info to work from as we move forward.
    • This week: We’re dedicating more server cores to player ability processing in this week’s update.
    • After that: we’ll see if we also need to bring even more hardware into the cluster to help.
    • As the more significant, longer term fix, we’ll dive into the specific souls abilities that are the biggest CPU eaters, and the way they’re built internally. This isn’t about rebalancing, it’s about making sure that they perform and respond well.
    • Both Live and Prime will benefit from the work being done here.* More details here as we have them.

    Regarding a handful of abilities that need some extra balance for Prime…
    • Yes, we agree there are many thoughts on abilities that we should take a pass at on Live as well...
    • However, nothing on Live compares to the crazy things that a couple of abilities were doing on Prime. (We're looking at YOU, Elemental Barrage and Wrathful Exuberance!)
    • Prime has a very differently tuned challenge curve for both PCs and NPCs.
    • We do NOT want to impact Live with Prime tweaks. We had to add some new tuning capacity to the ability system to make sure we could do that, and we’ll be rolling out Prime-only changes to these abilities this week.
    • [edited to add...]We’re rolling out Prime-only changes to these abilities this week, and taking a look at a couple of others that are effectively forcing people to play roles in a very specific way.
    • We are definitely sorry we had to leave an ability disabled for longer than a week – but we didn’t want to correct a Prime issue and have it negatively impact Live.
    • Expect Prime-only adjustments to those this week and for the abilities to return shortly following, should all the fixes prove out.

    Regarding high end PvP on Prime specifically:
    • Following this weekend’s play, we came to the same conclusion that a number of you did, now that the higher end PvP ranks are beginning to fill out more.
    • Low end PvP was a blast, mid range is plenty fun.
    • At the high end though, wow, healing is way too much of a thing.
    • We’d have liked to have had a more complete answer for this week’s update, but anything we did on this that quickly would have negative side effects.
    • For now, please know that we’re moving on the best solution for this next.

    There’s a lot more going on in the team right now, in content, in gameplay, and in tech, that will benefit all of RIFT, and we wanted to address some of these high points for you, early.

    Thanks very much for playing!
    - The RIFT Team
    Last edited by TrionBrasse; 03-27-2018 at 04:53 PM.

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    Champion of Telara Stihl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deekayzero View Post
    This may come as a surprise:* Some of the zone events on Prime are bigger than even the biggest, record setting events RIFT had during its beta and original launch.* *


    no. just no.
    When you count the 30 Mystic Archers and the 500 bolts they have spawned onthe ground I can see it.
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    Prophet of Telara aileen's Avatar
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    Well I said this dozen times ability lag occurued mostly when zone events used for farming planarite and abused by players and even suggested that lower completion times for them, since on prime players are actively doing zone events lowering their time to 45minutes from 120minutes are more logical but what's done is done.

    Nice to see you guys decided to make a system to let you tune prime and live indefinitely, hope this stuff will solve some problems but please be hurry.
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    I've heard from someone that seems to believe it's the use of macros that could potentially be the most resource intensive thing causing the input lag.

    Especially when spamming the button - the processing of a macro, being spammed over and over again, from almost everybody, all the time, simultaneously on the one server.

    I don't understand how the end game healing has been so overpowered for so long - it was that way back in Storm Legion too and i made and saw other posts then.

    But if nothing else, thank god for at least finally acknowledging it.

    If nothing else shows you guys are actually serious about making Prime work, acknowledging this major problem with pvp that you guys never have before, shows it.

    Thank you.
    Last edited by whiskiz; 03-27-2018 at 04:40 PM.

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    RIFT Guide Writer Deeew's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrionBrasse View Post
    [*]As the more significant, longer term fix, we’ll dive into the specific souls abilities that are the biggest CPU eaters, and the way they’re built internally. This isn’t about rebalancing, it’s about making sure that they perform and respond well.
    mystic archer arrows are a huge issue, and should be covered under the "hide other players fx" option.

    should also be a way to hide other player pets.

    No one truly enjoys the immersion of 10 MA's and 20 pets all on a mob, forcing us to render all that.

    Ty for your update tho.
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    Ascendant paspinall's Avatar
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    It hasn't just been ability lag those, large numbers of people today say huge spikes of latency that were affecting even the ability to move within the game world at the time larger world events were happening.

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    If you guys have or are developing the tech to make changes to souls just on prime im very excited. I figured it wasn't going to be possible but hopefully the prime game can turn into an experience to keep as many people as long as possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by deekayzero View Post
    This may come as a surprise:* Some of the zone events on Prime are bigger than even the biggest, record setting events RIFT had during its beta and original launch.* *


    no. just no.
    I started Rift in Beta 3.
    I remember the ZE stress testing.
    There were tons of people chain zerging the rifts.
    I remember the mass zerg fest on the rifts when Rift went live.
    That's all we did at first back then.
    Fast forward to Prime.
    The first Prime ZE zerg fest I participated in I though "Holy **** buckets this is a LOT of people." And also, "Dang Prime is popular, this is more zerg people than even Beta and launch."

    Now, I don't have the numbers, but I can tell you I did ZE zerg fests for DAYS worth of play time between Beta and launch. I do not recall a PC density like I saw when I started the zerg fest on Prime.
    Of course some of the PC density I see could be the MA arrows. If they are treated like PC entities then there could be a huge issue there.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Deeew View Post
    mystic archer arrows are a huge issue, and should be covered under the "hide other players fx" option.

    should also be a way to hide other player pets.

    No one truly enjoys the immersion of 10 MA's and 20 pets all on a mob, forcing us to render all that.

    Ty for your update tho.
    As someone who is forced to play MA, I gotta say I wish they would have waited a few expansions to make it available. The arrow mechanic is just terrible. It's annoying enough dealing with your own arrows but being near 10 other MA just becomes eye cancer. I'm almost a bit depressed that it is apparently the top raiding spec atm for mages. Now I have to run around in raid like a moron picking up arrows and am not going to be sure which are my arrows or which are the arrows of the other 5 mages in my raid. Just no. If you don't want to remove the soul, please just dumpster it so it's only viable as a leveler and not touch raid specs. At the very least, please add it to the "other players fx" exclusion. I will still be running around like an idiot, but at least it will be after my own arrows.

    tl;dr get rid of MA, it was a mistake that should have never happened on this server.

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    Default True but a bit misleading

    It's not surprising that they are seeing the most heavily populated events they've ever experienced on prime, but this is more a function of the fact that they have only ONE server. Although they would like to claim that Prime has caused a massive return of their player base, every single prime player is sitting on the same server. Comparing population density on that one server to the population on live servers is misleading.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geph View Post
    It's not surprising that they are seeing the most heavily populated events they've ever experienced on prime, but this is more a function of the fact that they have only ONE server. Although they would like to claim that Prime has caused a massive return of their player base, every single prime player is sitting on the same server. Comparing population density on that one server to the population on live servers is misleading.
    No, it's not. Nobody actually thinks they're saying that there are more people playing on Prime than on every server combined back when it was first released.

    Find something worthwhile to complain about

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    Default Progress is always good. While you're at it... ;)

    I'm glad to see both some fixes, and also the work allowing you to separate Live/Prime. That has to make your lives easier for fixes, and therefore our gaming experience better.

    Awesome work, and thank you.

    I'm hoping that somewhere along the line, you'll also be able to resolve the CTDs. I know they don't effect everyone, but they're fun-killers.

    My example from just now. I turned on the PC, logged in and while still sitting in my main city - without having moved even a single step - I had a CTD.

    So I pressed send report, and turned Rift off. I'll play something else tonight, instead.

    This isn't a tantrum and "I quit!" message, just a note that CTDs will gradually turn me from Eager-Player back to Ex-Player.

    I know they may not be easy to solve. I'm simply hoping that they get solved sooner rather than later.

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    Champion of Telara Kulta's Avatar
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    Sounds to me like prime needs its own server and not be linked to NA, A lot of fixes coming to prime, which is great for prime but I am live
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    Quote Originally Posted by Naialya View Post
    I'm glad to see both some fixes, and also the work allowing you to separate Live/Prime. That has to make your lives easier for fixes, and therefore our gaming experience better.
    I do hope you understand how things work when one team is working on both clients, it does not make things simpler in the least because now they must separately manage the two clients instead of having two replicas that one client uses stripped down

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