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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: UPDATE! Reversed! (was: Change coming to how appearance items are gained!)

  1. #16
    Telaran
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    I'm sorry if you have already answered somewhere else discord etc.

    but for example , if my mage gets a lv 68 BoE plate armor , and i dont have a warrior. Do i have to make a warrior alt , level it to 68 , send the armor to the warrior and equip it so my mage can get the skin?

    same question goes to weapons lockout due to class
    Last edited by Cileriqao; 03-01-2018 at 06:36 PM.
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  2.   Click here to go to the next Rift Team post in this thread.   #17
    Shiny Ball of Doomy Doom Tacitus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aileen View Post
    Oh first post misleading it, so 30 minutes trade period will unlock skins to people when traded then? If yes then no problem (thou I never run that raids but seeing huge amount of people pugging them).
    I do not see anything in the first post that is incorrect. Unless you are referring to the pass it around thing, which was a reference to people that sell skin unlocks via trade chat or through some specialized guilds.

    It doesn't affect people that actually go on a raid because the item drops there are automatically soulbound. They are tradeable due to a special override for a limited time within the raid, but it does not change their bound status. At no time are the BoE items.

    What's happening to transfigured items? Will additional skins still unlock like now or do we need to equip this items?
    I am not clear on what exactly you are wanting to know here. If you are asking if passing around a BoE item that is affected by a transmog bauble will unlock appearances simply by passing it around still, no, that is definitely not going to work anymore. If, on the other hand, you use an old left-over transmog on a BoE item and hand it to someone else, IF that person then equips it, then yes they will get the transmog appearance. Transmogs still work - but the unlocking of the appearance still needs an item to become bound rather than BoE.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cileriqao View Post
    if my mage gets a lv 68 BoE plate armor , and i dont have a warrior. Do i have to make a warrior alt , level it to 68 , send the armor to the warrior and equip it so my mage can get the skin?
    Yes, the BoE item would need to be equipped.
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  3. #18
    Prophet of Telara aileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tacitus View Post
    I do not see anything in the first post that is incorrect. Unless you are referring to the pass it around thing, which was a reference to people that sell skin unlocks via trade chat or through some specialized guilds.
    Well you know even thou drops have 30minutes share period, if person equips it that's removed so that items were like imitating bind on equip state, so it was a bit confusing do people still need to equip or not but you cleared it.

    I am not clear on what exactly you are wanting to know here. If you are asking if passing around a BoE item that is affected by a transmog bauble will unlock appearances simply by passing it around still, no, that is definitely not going to work anymore. If, on the other hand, you use an old left-over transmog on a BoE item and hand it to someone else, IF that person then equips it, then yes they will get the transmog appearance. Transmogs still work - but the unlocking of the appearance still needs an item to become bound rather than BoE.
    Yes that was what I was curious about, even thou I'm not wardrobe collector, I transfigured few skins from my personal runs to people who needed and put it to our guild stash so It was a bit unclear on it since item we transfigured mostly were bind on pickups and I wasn't sure how that system works, does it check bind on equip status of main item or transfigured item but you cleared it too. Thanks for answers but I have one more question

    Since you guys mentioned this is mostly happening for prime and we still need another class to open BoE skin with limited amount of characters we can make on prime, will cosmetics bundles available on prime? I mostly use common skins from open world for my wardrobes on live but all of them are BoE drops, I myself found and I mostly combine wardrobes from all available classes so I'm really curious about this
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  4. #19
    Ral
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    Pretty upset at something else being taken away, one more thing to add to the long list that prevents me from even considering being a patron or spending money on the game.

    I need a clear answer about the low level process of this, probably from a programmer as possibly even a developer or engineer may not know, but is it the process of equipping an item that unlocks the appearance, or exclusively the process of being in inventory (including equipped) and in a bound state.

    The answer on this very specific difference will either expose a bug or an exploit that I don't want to go into, though it is very surprising testers did not realize these cases or you did not cover it.

  5.   Click here to go to the next Rift Team post in this thread.   #20
    Shiny Ball of Doomy Doom Tacitus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aileen View Post
    will cosmetics bundles available on prime?
    Yes!

    Every dungeon boss on PRIME has a (significant) chance to drop a wardrobe bundle. These bundles are BoE. So everyone in the raid can roll on the bundles and the winner can use it or trade it or put it on the AH. The skins inside are all BoP, so opening the bundle effectively "uses" it up and unlocks the contained appearances.
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  6.   Click here to go to the next Rift Team post in this thread.   #21
    Shiny Ball of Doomy Doom Tacitus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ral View Post
    exclusively the process of being in inventory (including equipped) and in a bound state.
    This. Any item enters your inventory in a "bound" state or become bound unlocks the appearance.
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  7. #22
    Prophet of Telara aileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tacitus View Post
    Yes!

    Every dungeon boss on PRIME has a (significant) chance to drop a wardrobe bundle. These bundles are BoE. So everyone in the raid can roll on the bundles and the winner can use it or trade it or put it on the AH. The skins inside are all BoP, so opening the bundle effectively "uses" it up and unlocks the contained appearances.
    Nice to know there is such implementation coming, thanks for all answers
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  8. #23
    Ral
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tacitus View Post
    This. Any item enters your inventory in a "bound" state or become bound unlocks the appearance.
    Then there is a bug, I suggest your testers ensure they have tested all use cases, specifically related to items, as you have failed to cover (at least in this post) all potential item states.

    As the bug does not appear to be in the players favor, it will not be exploitable, at least in the sense I knew. However it may make some appearances unobtainable.

    This leads to another question, what of item appearances that have had the items that grant them removed from the game and may potentially become no longer obtainable with this change?
    Last edited by Ral; 03-01-2018 at 08:00 PM.

  9. #24
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    Default Thank you, <Skins on Farm>!

    Dear Trion,

    This change was unnecessary and is a slap in the face for the EU community. Since 2015 <Skins on Farm> is working together as a community to complete our wardrobe collection. It was the reason we started weekly retro raiding and also achievement runs later on and our project really brought the community together. Our idea was simple - one guild with skins, everyone pays a membership fee and can then unlock all skins we farm together as a community forever. The membership fees were widely used to buy off additional skins from other players or to pay people for their transfiguration baubles. I think at the moment around 300-400 EU players are part of the project and for over 2 years I've got nothing but thankful and positive comments. Together we managed to farm an impressive collection of skins, available to everyone who is part of the project.

    Now, don't get me wrong, we for sure know the system was not intended to use the transfiguration baubles within the new wardrobe system - but they were neither removed, nor was anything changed up to now and the projects were publicly known, including several forum threads. With Prophecy of Ahnket transfiguration was no longer possible and all new premium and event skins were changed to auto consume. This means, for newer skins this is no longer possible anyway.

    With one small hotfix you are now destroying a huge EU community project which brought a big part of the EU community together at the end of Nightmare Tide, when there was barely any content and we made content our own.

    I know my words won't change anything, so I'm giving thanks to all the hundreds of players who participated in SoF in one way or another. What we achieved was not only incredibly large, it was also incredibly fun.

    All the best,
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  10. #25
    General of Telara
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    When i made all my Transmog items i always used weapons that could not be bound. How will they be affected by this change?

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Seshatar View Post
    Dear Trion,

    This change was unnecessary and is a slap in the face for the EU community. Since 2015 <Skins on Farm> is working together as a community to complete our wardrobe collection. It was the reason we started weekly retro raiding and also achievement runs later on and our project really brought the community together. Our idea was simple - one guild with skins, everyone pays a membership fee and can then unlock all skins we farm together as a community forever. The membership fees were widely used to buy off additional skins from other players or to pay people for their transfiguration baubles. I think at the moment around 300-400 EU players are part of the project and for over 2 years I've got nothing but thankful and positive comments. Together we managed to farm an impressive collection of skins, available to everyone who is part of the project.

    Now, don't get me wrong, we for sure know the system was not intended to use the transfiguration baubles within the new wardrobe system - but they were neither removed, nor was anything changed up to now and the projects were publicly known, including several forum threads. With Prophecy of Ahnket transfiguration was no longer possible and all new premium and event skins were changed to auto consume. This means, for newer skins this is no longer possible anyway.

    With one small hotfix you are now destroying a huge EU community project which brought a big part of the EU community together at the end of Nightmare Tide, when there was barely any content and we made content our own.

    I know my words won't change anything, so I'm giving thanks to all the hundreds of players who participated in SoF in one way or another. What we achieved was not only incredibly large, it was also incredibly fun.

    All the best,
    Volt
    This says it all. I for one have paid for a few wardrobe unlocks but mainly from events that will never be repeated like the Razer special items. I rarely even see anyone on the NA shards "selling" loads of wardrobe unlocks. TBPH I think this change is a very bad one and will cause a lot of turmoil. My guild has quite a few rare items we hold in our guild bank for our non raiding casual members should they want the wardrobe unlock. Now we will not be able to share these items with our members because of this change. There are so many other things that need to be "fixed" other than a wardrobe change. You might want to rethink your priorities on what gets fixed. There are a lot of people in your facebook news feed that talk about the reasons they don't return and although some of them are most likely trolls they make a good point. I enjoy this game but just like the reason I left World of Warcraft after 12 years I got tired of them removing things from the game. Please quit removing things for this game for the love of God.

  12. #27
    Ral
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    Quote Originally Posted by Accol View Post
    When i made all my Transmog items i always used weapons that could not be bound. How will they be affected by this change?
    As per Tacitus' explanation, once the change occurs, the item must be in a bound state to grant a wardrobe, so if it is not, one will not be able to acquire any wardrobe from it. Thus it follows if said item cannot reach this state, one cannot acquire a wardrobe from such items and they will forever be removed as items that can grant wardrobe looks as that functionality will be removed from the game.

    I had hoped to make him and the team work to figure this issue out, but I assume they can at least put one and one together from our posts even if they couldn't "make zero" on their own as any good set of testing should.

    Or perhaps they did realize this and just didn't want to mention it or felt it was not relevant, though clearly it is as it potentially removes more things with one change.

    Who knows what other bugs will arise from this largely unwelcome and unnecessary change (unless their is some unmentioned deeper necessity to this), I already know of at least one additional issue that represents a class of issues tangentially related to this.

  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ral View Post
    As per Tacitus' explanation, once the change occurs, the item must be in a bound state to grant a wardrobe, so if it is not, one will not be able to acquire any wardrobe from it. Thus it follows if said item cannot reach this state, one cannot acquire a wardrobe from such items and they will forever be removed as items that can grant wardrobe looks as that functionality will be removed from the game.

    I had hoped to make him and the team work to figure this issue out, but I assume they can at least put one and one together from our posts even if they couldn't "make zero" on their own as any good set of testing should.

    Or perhaps they did realize this and just didn't want to mention it or felt it was not relevant, though clearly it is as it potentially removes more things with one change.

    Who knows what other bugs will arise from this largely unwelcome and unnecessary change (unless their is some unmentioned deeper necessity to this), I already know of at least one additional issue that represents a class of issues tangentially related to this.
    Im sure they can make a quick pass on all items that cannot be bound and change them to boe items. There are very few items like this and the only ones of high value i can think of are the Daglar relics.

    I liked to use common (white) rarity weapons for transmog because people couldnt accidentally bind them and because they stood out in my bags.

  14. #29
    Ral
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    Quick pass it probably underestimating the scope of the problem, I am not sure they can easily target all unbound weapons and armor from among unbound items in general. Additionally I am not sure what wider effects this could have even if they could.

    Half my implications are that this one change is having several potentially unexpected side effects. Making yet more changes to facilitate it could just as likely create even more issues that need to be addressed. Given this one can easily see that what seems like a small change quickly requires a large number of potential cases to be addressed.

    I hadn't even considered Daglar's relics but there is even yet another set of items at least beside the white items you (and I as well) used and Daglar's relics. I am hesitant to mention specifics in general because if I do it is likely they will also be taken away as well, but their existence, which is generally never known nor exposed to the player, would suggest broad or automated changes would not be so simple.

    Essentially what I am saying is that changing one system in something as complex as Rift has wide and varied effects and if I as a player alone can come up with a litany of issues, I can't imagine what the Rift team has to deal with for any seemingly minor change.

  15. #30
    Prophet of Telara Mordrahan's Avatar
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    One more change removing fun things from players... while class balance is not adressed.
    I'm done.
    Do you remember how the wardrobe system was originally? with unfair class restrictions. The current system was made to give same options to everyone, be mage or warrior.
    Now with this change, we come back to class restrictions, and unfair system.
    If you play a mage you will be restricted to cloth, wands and staffs, because this is the only thing you can equip. If you play a warrior, you can equip all armor and almost all weapons. So you will have choice.
    After the many mage nerfs, now a cosmetic nerf.
    Seems TRION wants a game without mages.

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