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Thread: PvP Vengeance doubling as HIT vs. Players

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    Plane Walker Knightcrawler's Avatar
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    Default PvP Vengeance doubling as HIT vs. Players

    As many people know, hit (more-so) and focus (less-so) play a large roll in pvp, this is a major advantage to those who pve as well as pvp, which I don't have an issue with, I myself use pve weapons for pvp. But the fact of the matter is people who only pvp are being punished with terribly low access to hit. IMO this would be a nice 2 birds with 1 stone scenario, vengeance is pretty god awful as it is - but if it were made to also double as hit/focus vs players it would solve a current pvp issue. (low access to hit, and vengeance not being worth much of anything)

    I know this isn't gonna be a prioritized change by trion but from the people I've talked to about this in game and on the forums, they all seem to think it's a good idea.

    Thoughts?
    (_(_)_) -Gambiit- (_(_)_)
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    Ascendant Am0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knightcrawler View Post
    As many people know, hit (more-so) and focus (less-so) play a large roll in pvp, this is a major advantage to those who pve as well as pvp, which I don't have an issue with, I myself use pve weapons for pvp. But the fact of the matter is people who only pvp are being punished with terribly low access to hit. IMO this would be a nice 2 birds with 1 stone scenario, vengeance is pretty god awful as it is - but if it were made to also double as hit/focus vs players it would solve a current pvp issue. (low access to hit, and vengeance not being worth much of anything)

    I know this isn't gonna be a prioritized change by trion but from the people I've talked to about this in game and on the forums, they all seem to think it's a good idea.

    Thoughts?
    CHYEAH!

    /10char
    "You lost me at Balance"

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    Ascendant LOveRH's Avatar
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    +10

    Approved. One of the best ideas offered in a long time by the community that is realistically possible in Trion implementing. It would solve the issue of focus/hit in pvp in a easy and simple way. It would also make vengeance something other then a failed stat and a forgotten dream of Trion to separating Pvp/Pve.
    Last edited by LOveRH; 11-21-2011 at 12:09 PM.

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    Plane Walker Knightcrawler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Am0n View Post
    CHYEAH!

    /10char
    lol whats up scion, never see you around.
    Last edited by Knightcrawler; 11-21-2011 at 12:37 PM.
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    Ascendant Am0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Knightcrawler View Post
    lol whats up scion, never see you around.
    Work I'm there now

    State job though Good money

    Less Rift ='(((((((((((((((((
    Last edited by Am0n; 11-21-2011 at 12:40 PM.
    "You lost me at Balance"

  6. #6
    Plane Walker Knightcrawler's Avatar
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    I really think this should be seriously considered.
    (_(_)_) -Gambiit- (_(_)_)
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    Shadowlander
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    Or as a counter suggestion get rid of valor and vengence to begin with and make regular hit just as effective vs players as NPC , this way any character can pve or pvp with out worrying about "oh is my gear good enough".

    benifts - more plp pvping

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    Plane Walker Sadasius's Avatar
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    +10 here....good idea.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowslice View Post
    Or as a counter suggestion get rid of valor and vengence to begin with and make regular hit just as effective vs players as NPC , this way any character can pve or pvp with out worrying about "oh is my gear good enough".

    benifts - more plp pvping
    huh?

    raiders would then have the best "PvP Gear"
    thats not a good design for those that dont PvE raid.

    Lets Go Rift. Hope Archeage can do something next. Lets Save Rift

  10. #10
    Plane Walker Knightcrawler's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Shadowslice View Post
    Or as a counter suggestion get rid of valor and vengence to begin with and make regular hit just as effective vs players as NPC , this way any character can pve or pvp with out worrying about "oh is my gear good enough".

    benifts - more plp pvping
    Hell no, the thread is not about this. Keep it on the topic.
    (_(_)_) -Gambiit- (_(_)_)
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  11. #11
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    excellent idea, no reason not to be implemented
    Killianx<Addiction> - Gnarlwood
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    Basically what you are asking for is everyone that is rank 8 now and have 75 vengeance is pretty much Focus capped and almost hit capped.. When I say focus and hit capped you only need 50 focus to bypass 100 resist and 100 hit to bypass 20.0% defense stat. This is not a well thought out solution. As powerful as hit/focus are at bypassing key parts of game mechanics and class abilities there should be more of a price to pay if they are going to leave this stat affecting PvP.

    Solution:

    Create New Stat for weapons and wands for PVE only: Accuracy

    Remove Hit/Focus contribution from weapons/wands and place it into the newly created Accuracy stat.
    For pve have hit/focus + Accuracy = your total. Now in pvp if you want to aquire hit or focus there will be harsher penalties but still obtainable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by TheRealKillian View Post
    excellent idea, no reason not to be implemented
    Of course it sounds like a good idea to you when you will at Rank 8 (75 vengeance) already have enough vengeance to bypass all resistance chances and resistance mitigation. If you think this is a good idea I can see this idea working only if vengeance effected hit like it does focus and gave armor penetration the same way focus gives resistance mitigation bypass, that doesn't sound as good to you now does it? Why should magical get a double bonus for focus..
    Last edited by Undrsiege; 12-01-2011 at 12:31 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Knightcrawler View Post
    As many people know, hit (more-so) and focus (less-so) play a large roll in pvp, this is a major advantage to those who pve as well as pvp, which I don't have an issue with, I myself use pve weapons for pvp. But the fact of the matter is people who only pvp are being punished with terribly low access to hit. IMO this would be a nice 2 birds with 1 stone scenario, vengeance is pretty god awful as it is - but if it were made to also double as hit/focus vs players it would solve a current pvp issue. (low access to hit, and vengeance not being worth much of anything)

    I know this isn't gonna be a prioritized change by trion but from the people I've talked to about this in game and on the forums, they all seem to think it's a good idea.

    Thoughts?
    How is vengeance worthless? Vengeance is the SAME thing as AP and SP, but only works against players. The better idea is simply to introduce a PvP only hit stat and make this hit only work againstg players. That way they could put this new hit stat on PvP weapons while not making those weapons BiS for PvE. It solves the problem nicely.

  15. #15
    Rift Disciple
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    Quote Originally Posted by AceinHole View Post
    How is vengeance worthless? Vengeance is the SAME thing as AP and SP, but only works against players. The better idea is simply to introduce a PvP only hit stat and make this hit only work againstg players. That way they could put this new hit stat on PvP weapons while not making those weapons BiS for PvE. It solves the problem nicely.
    Yes, but now there another problem where PvE items are BiS for PvP . Same situation - other direction. And Venegance doubled as PvP +hit/+fous (both at the same time ofc) is a good solution! Or make enchant possible only for PvP weapons with + 40 Hit for One hand ( I think PvErs will be not happy with this)

    And due you on this - please remove selfheal on block completely from PvP - since its only thing that creates unkillable builds.

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