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Thread: Development Team: Communication

  1. #1
    Ascendant Holyroller12's Avatar
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    Default Development Team: Communication

    I'm sure you're sick of hearing about it, but a lot of us are sick of waiting in the dark and have been plenty patient and understanding of the situation at hand that has been the giant acquisition of Trion by Gamigo going on since October. There's quite a few things I want to point out.

    Withholding Information and Updates
    Look, most of us get it. We understand why you guys hold information and have done so since the days of Nightmare Tide when the forums were a particular toxic environment for both Devs and players. I may not agree that it meant you should've shied away from the forums completely, but I understand why.

    Here's the issue. You don't want to release any kind of information or update when it comes to content or just anything in general at this point until you're 110% sure something will be coming roughly within the time that you guys give otherwise people get upset and rake you over the coals for it. The vast majority of the people who took that to inappropriate levels are long gone at this point and continuing this practice only alienates players that much more and causes even more people to leave on top of keeping old players from coming back.

    Get over it and start giving more frequent updates about what you're doing (good or bad). Even if those updates are about what you're doing with all of the server downtime.

    More communication to Community Managers
    This is an extension of this first point, but the CMs can't do their jobs when you guys aren't even relaying any of the information/updates that players need and want to the CMs themselves. I'm sure development, Gamigo and their CMs would like to advertise the game through social media and other platforms, but there's not a whole lot TO advertise/promote in the first place. Lets see, we have no:

    1. No Roadmap after 6 months
    2. Almost all of the updates thus far have been in the pipeline since before Gamigo and was pushed out and stamped as new content.
    3. No class balancing
    4. No new raids or even visible hints at one.
    I'm sure people can and will add to the list, but it's 4:25am for me atm so have at it.

    I'm glad and thankful that Avathar and Eps even talk to us on the community discord when they have time, but outside of that we don't see the old banter between devs and players anymore since the transition which makes the community managers our main and only line of communication when it comes to getting those much needed updates on the development side of things.

    This really needs to be looked at and discussed between Gamigo and the development team so that going forward we're not (on all sides) banging our heads against the wall in the dark void where currently no information/updates exist.

    Pre-Weekend Announcements
    The few times we do manage to get big/semi big announcements... they tend to be a day or 2 before the weeekend so for the love of whatever god/s you believe in, STOP doing that unless you're actually going to answer peoples questions! Cough http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...rd-merges.html

    As it currently stands with our community managers also getting ghosted with the lack of communication, it's hard to even know who to turn to at this point. I hope this makes it to whoever is supposed to be in charge of this. We know you guys have a ton on your plate and probably don't or didn't have all of the necessary resources to deal with everything all at once. We know you guys are working hard on whatever you are managing to do, but at least start telling us about it. The 6 month period is up and we need that roadmap/dev sooner rather than later. Realistically though...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GzU4BkqW9VI

    I'll probably go back and edit this throughout the day as I'm barely able to keep my eyes open right now, but I felt this was important to post before the day gets started after seeing some discussion on the community discord.
    Last edited by Holyroller12; 05-15-2019 at 04:07 AM.

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    Gamigo's Acqisition of Trion Words: Everything we know so far

  2. #2
    Ascendant Seshatar's Avatar
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    Yea, not much to add here. The silence is killing this game and community.
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  3. #3
    Plane Touched Ambrodel's Avatar
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    I'll add a ton of quotes from myself, just to indicate how long this has really been an issue for me. Click to the posts to find out what I replied to, but most of the words really just speak for themselves:

    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    You want me to keep playing? I want to know SOMETHING that will give me any hope of this game not going down the drain. Right now it feels like the bathtub is being drained and this little rubberducky will no longer have any water to swim in.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    And we can't wait to see it. Please show us what 2019 has in store for RIFT, before 2019 actually hits us. Tell us your actual PLANS, tell us what you are actually working on that will make a difference between 2017, 2018 and 2019. Tell us which content the old team was working on that will make it to Live. Tell us if Prime is being shut down. TELL US WHAT IS GOING ON, instead of this nonsense that is literally announcing that you have nothing to announce yet and we should have patience while we wait for more information about what you cannot tell us just yet.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    This is as concise as it can possibly be: TELL US YOUR PLANS FOR RIFT!
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    And that's what they should be more open about. What those plans include. The longer they wait, the less players there will be around to listen and care.
    All of the above are from 2018 only. Then there's 2019...
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    Does that mean you actually HAVE a schedule now?

    If so, WHEN are we going to be informed about the future of this game, if there is any?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    As always, please provide INFORMATION to your customer base so they know what the heck is going on. And please do it up front instead of waiting for someone like me to ask the questions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    And WHEN can we expect to hear about those?
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    But Gamigo has yet to do anything to give even a glimmer of hope that ANYTHING good will happen to this game. All we've had is a bunch of "something is coming, please have patience and wait until we know what we're going to do". They have not done ANYTHING to earn my money yet. They have not said ANYTHING that makes me think they will actively develop new content that can keep this game alive. Until they do, I am not dropping any money in their pockets. I don't know if I will be able to enjoy the digital items for weeks, months or years to come. Without knowing what they have planned, I don't see any reason to support them.

    I will be more than happy to dump money into this game, IF it's worth it to me. Right now, with the Wall Of Silence from Gamigo, it's not.

    To end this wall of quotes, I'll just say this: Gamigo has in the past asked us to post questions on stuff, most of which has never been answered. Gamigo has in the past told us they can't wait to show us what 2019 has in store for us, but we are almost halfway through the year and we've only seen the two "major" things they've been working on, with not even a hint of anything else to come, other than the massive failure they call Server Merges. As long as this wall of silence persists, I see absolutely no reason to remain positive and have patience while they attempt to resolve the issues they have. Patience is not endless, certainly not mine.

    Edit: I totally forgot my favourite post:
    Quote Originally Posted by Zyra View Post
    we just wanted to provide quicker information in the meantime.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ambrodel View Post
    That is good. When will that begin to happen?
    Still no information...
    Last edited by Ambrodel; 05-15-2019 at 09:55 AM.

  4. #4
    Rift Disciple Omerr's Avatar
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    It's good to see peoples are actually complaining about this game for a long time. I asked question about content maybe thousand times but I didn't get a clear answer still not waiting one because clearly gamigo is not giving us any hint or any explanation about what they are doing or what the are planning ( if they have a plan ofc ) The thing I dont understand thats a mmorpg game right when you look at the other titles lotro, everquest, gw2, eso they are giving a roadmap for their playerbase. But the community of rift is all the time happy not even asking real questions doing some jokes on discord mostly. Guys hey hello wake up that's a game okay. We are wasting our money, time for that game. We are a costumer not a clown the make them feel okay or happy. As a community we should push them in to corner to get some serious answer otherwise we will get nothing for sure. I'm so bored of rift already. Wow classic is coming soon too....

    Best Regards..

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  5. #5
    Champion of Telara aileen's Avatar
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    Dude, seriously aren't you late about talking for this particular issue? When we were pointing this all over when even Trion was there, you guys were just like all fine, they talked on discord, they talked on twitch chat bla bla.

    They should done all communications on official forums, official pages even if they make an official discord or w/e place, they should exactly tell same stuff on here and pages, because not everyone uses discord, not everyone is online on there whenever stuff gets mentioned.

    Now I hope you start feeling like how we used to feel because all problems coming from no information and no communication.

    When you guys were thinking people who pointing issues just here to complain, we were actually caring for this game more than any of you, because acting like all is fine and will be fine actually making things worse.

    Since they will start believing people who pointing issues are minority and rest are thinking is everything is fine, so we are doing good job.

    That mentality ruined this game anyway in the end it's "nice" to see you are now acting about issues but it's so late, game is done even active playerbase started to leaving because of recent issues.

    Gamigo just using RIFT for their experiments about GCP/Cloud integration, I believe they didn't do that stuff to Archeage or Trove because they want to see results on RIFT, fix all issues on RIFT and when all start being fine they will start moving Trove and Archeage.

    Anyway it was fun while it lasted but it's so damn late.

    "C'est la vie", everything ends.

    PS: I do not want to quote how many times "we" pointed this issue and "you" guys said opposite ;p but you can find thousands of it on forums by searching easily.
    Last edited by aileen; 05-15-2019 at 07:23 AM.
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  6. #6
    Ascendant Holyroller12's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aileen View Post
    Dude, seriously aren't you late about talking for this particular issue?
    I've posted in most of the previous communication threads when Trion and Brasse was still around so no, but the main concern is that at least back then we had plenty of devs to talk to that would occasionally give us tidbits about upcoming stuff/conent. That certainly wasn't ideal, but now the issue involves not communicating to our CMs which is even more important than the first time around since they're not in the same building, let alone the same country and it seems like outside of the 2 above mentioned devs, we likely won't hear from anyone else on the team which we of course knew was going to happen way back in Oct.

    By all means though, keep patting yourself on the back.

    (70) Holyroller | (70) Kelten | (70) Irohh | (70) Hoehenheim | (70)Avattar@Deepwood

    Gamigo's Acqisition of Trion Words: Everything we know so far

  7. #7
    Telaran
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    Hollyroller is probably the most patient Rift player I know and therefore he hasn't spoken like this before (to my knowledge, I also don't know him know him but seen his various posts in forums.)

    And even the most patient person has to get bored and frustrated at some point. It is Holly's time I guess and he's correct as all you are. We have been complaining and nagging for details and haven't received much at all. Hollyroller has a way of getting through people with his detailed posts and I believe if the devs don't answer then I suppose there truly isn't much hope for the game.

    Long live Oria and his controversial video with revelations of Rift. Like it or not, and sadly many of his predictions are coming true.

  8. #8
    Champion of Telara aileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holyroller12 View Post
    I've posted in most of the previous communication threads when Trion and Brasse was still around so no, but the main concern is that at least back then we had plenty of devs to talk to that would occasionally give us tidbits about upcoming stuff/conent. That certainly wasn't ideal, but now the issue involves not communicating to our CMs which is even more important than the first time around since they're not in the same building, let alone the same country and it seems like outside of the 2 above mentioned devs, we likely won't hear from anyone else on the team which we of course knew was going to happen way back in Oct.

    By all means though, keep patting yourself on the back.
    you still not getting point, you will never get, just keep doing what you are doing be a whitest knight with all coloured forum posts to hide their failures.

    I was talking with RR other day, the wage he was getting on trion was ridiculously low for the position he had compared to same others on SF Bay Area, yet they get rid of such guy and didn't even try to get him back with desirable increase, after talking with him I realized why people who worked on RIFT wanted to switch to other trion games since most likely that people somehow earned more than what RIFT people and then it was easy to realize how things is going, as a businessman, as an employer, I know the results of unhappy workers.

    That's the case of RIFT, that's why I keep pointed it's fault of management but yet I can find many posts you and others kept defending against them.

    Brasse, is one of the reason why RIFT failed, same goes for Ocho as CMs, after Elrar who was public face of RIFT who just get fired cuz of power hungry people wanted to take over CM position (many of you know who they are), RIFT's communication started to downfall, since that time many people pointed communication problems.

    Trion who was perfect example with communication, who was perfect example with game development like huge patches every week, huge content addition almost every month, started to fail after SL.

    So no matter what you say like you were "pointing" that issues before just go search your post history and start to think like yes I was doing wrong stuff.

    Trust me, If gamigo accepted my offer, I was going to make RIFT open source so players who knows what game needs better than management, would do more amazing job than them. Most private game servers for any game points that too.

    While most private servers not run by full-time game designers or engineers, they are run by people who has desire for game but for RIFT sadly no one left with desire to game, people are unhappy, even RR who had lots of desire for game was unhappy.

    I was basically going to donate all free money I made thru bitcoin hype from last year for the sake of game I loved, I made that talk with RR when I was about to leave for going to my office and he asked me why you going to work at 7:30am my time when you have tons of money, it doesn't change the fact I must be the one who should do normal working routine and be a perfect example for my employees.

    I hope you get what I mean and what I'm trying to say.

    Anyway thank you all for ruining such precious game in very short time.

    Now enjoy ghost towns and I'm not the type who pats his back, I rather fall down to do such sh*t.
    Last edited by aileen; 05-15-2019 at 11:25 AM. Reason: typo
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  9. #9
    Shadowlander Olkq's Avatar
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    Best to not communicate if there is nothing worthwhile to communicate imo. And there is no reason to believe that there's something great coming our way, even if you'd like to believe there is. Communication in the past has largely been about keeping up appearances anyway, and it's been terrible to follow.

    In any case, I'll probably log on regularly to make some plat and get some REXes to buy whatever is the next new seasonal store mount. Just in case I might ride it on some character someday maybe, you know. Because that is Rift in 2019.

  10. #10
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    I think we're asking the wrong questions. We've been asking for communication about future plans for years to no avail, I'm not surprised that hasn't changed yet.

    Rather, I am more interested in hearing any dev pop in the forums or the Discord and give an update about how far along they are in learning Rift's design interface. As I recall, some Trion devs said it wasn't super friendly, so knowing if the devs are picking it up quickly or slowly may manage expectations for robust content releases.

    God knows the ****storm that would ensue if a buggy piece of content was released and the devs didn't have a clue how to fix it. Mind of Madness anyone?
    Last edited by LucKeyHoleInOne; 05-15-2019 at 02:17 PM.

  11. #11
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by aileen View Post
    Trust me, If gamigo accepted my offer, I was going to make RIFT open source so players who knows what game needs better than management, would do more amazing job than them. Most private game servers for any game points that too.
    Yeah, just look at torchlight. It has many mods and people still play it because there's always something different. (at least at the time I played it) And I'm now waiting for torchlight frontiers to be released.

    what if you purchase the IPs when gamigo is ready to shut down rift? and by the looks of it it's probably not gonna take long. Then you can gather a team and maybe strip the game of all the crap it has (legendaries, RNG, fragments, eternals, grind, masteries, grind, RNG. Did I mention grind and RNG, and all the possible crap that could be introduced?

    But really, if you are serious, I hope you do obtain the game and really make it a great mmo. At this point I believe gamigo will push simple content like BoS. At the very least I am still here because of the friendships I created over the years and the good times we have on discord while doing a pointless T2 raid

  12. #12
    Plane Touched Ambrodel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Olkq View Post
    Best to not communicate if there is nothing worthwhile to communicate imo. And there is no reason to believe that there's something great coming our way, even if you'd like to believe there is. Communication in the past has largely been about keeping up appearances anyway, and it's been terrible to follow.
    Quote Originally Posted by LucKeyHoleInOne View Post
    I think we're asking the wrong questions. We've been asking for communication about future plans for years to no avail, I'm not surprised that hasn't changed yet.
    What communication, or lack thereof, has been like in the past, is irrelevant now. New company, new ways of doing things. However, it is not too much to ask about the future and expect answers, when the very first post we got from Gamigo tells us they will be doing exactly that. Let's bring up the first post from AnneBonny, the one that got copy/pasta'd to all game forums at the same time.

    Quote Originally Posted by AnneBonny View Post
    Also, the developers will continue providing you with updates through Producer letters, so all of you will have a little look behind the scenes as well.
    We have yet to see a Producer letter for Rift. We know nothing of what goes on behind the scenes, except for somethingsomething about some cloud server thingie project that keeps crashing the EU servers.

    Quote Originally Posted by AnneBonny View Post
    Therefore, we will revisit this in the weeks ahead and keep all of you updated on our progress.
    We have yet to be updated of any revisits. Or anything, really.

    Quote Originally Posted by AnneBonny View Post
    Some more surprises are coming, but we donít want to spoil those quite yet! We still want to give you a small hint: communication, support and entertainment are our three main concerns and you can count on some changes and improvements in this direction.
    We have yet to see any improvements. And as most of us know, Support took a nosedive not long after this post and I'm not sure if they've recovered by now.

    Quote Originally Posted by AnneBonny View Post
    We are all gamers and we understand how important transparency and open-mindedness are, so please feel free to raise your concerns and suggestions, we will do our best to make this community stronger than ever!
    Transparency is good. But closing the door shut in our faces is the exact opposite. No communication, which they claim they want to improve, means no transparency. We have no clue whatsoever what the future holds, because they haven't shown us the roadmap that they supposedly worked out months ago. How is that transparency? How is that improving the community, making it stronger than ever?

    Gamigo has the right to shut up if they do not want to tell us anything. But we are their consumers. They have a product we may or may not wish to purchase. They SHOULD be doing everything in their power to make us WANT to buy their product. I have not seen a single thing yet that makes me WANT to buy any of their products, Rift or otherwise. All because they simply do not communicate wth us on the level they SHOULD be doing, like most other gaming companies do. I do not believe they have the passion required to Make Rift Great Again. Or keep it running in 2020. I can't believe that, because they haven't shown me anything that could potentially change my mind.

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