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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: DEVS- nerf particles for the disabled?

  1. #46
    Plane Touched Sails's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    ZZzzzZ Take what you like out of context, it's easy to do.

    And just because you find something offensive doesn't mean it's against the rules. I find it offensive you misinterpreted everything I said. I found it offensive that I tried to help and you threw it back in my face asking things like "excuse me, are you disabled? Then why are you talking". You could have simply said "this probably won't help".

    But ye, all people with disabilities are lieing, great opening accusation, accusations like that will get you far.


    How Dare I.. seriously, I feel like I'm watching a SJW cringe video.
    Your post is more on point toward people who don't have actual disabilities and just didn't get the mechanism or have a better strategy. Yeah sjws are annoying but azzhats ain't all that great either. I don't think u meant to come off an ***. But there is a difference in trying, putting in effort and no matter what a person does still not being able to complete it.
    Last edited by Sails; 10-10-2018 at 01:18 PM.
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  2. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Holyroller12 View Post
    Sorry you took what I said completely out of context I suppose. I wasn't poking fun at anyone, only pointing out that the topic has been brought up numerous times and relayed what they officially stated the last time it was discussed. Plenty of people with and without disabilities argued for and against alternative paths for it, but there simply aren't any plans for any in the immediate future. Perhaps i should've better clarified, but please read more carefully next time you start throwing out accusations.

    Edit: Mid typing before Brasse's post went up in regard to official dev statements.
    You repeat something that points at undermining the concern of people who've raised the issue. Though you didn't poke fun, it could still be interpreted as leaving the issue unaddressed. Maybe, be a bit more choosy about what you repeat. If you can't really cause it to benefit the current concern, its ok not to respond also. My concern is that its left at what you say instead of the company trying to do better. Is it really your job to go find prior stuff and repost it? Anyway, the response you chose to repost, comes off umempathetic. I mean, ofc if a person with one arm can do it, everyone can. What does an eyesight disability have to do with one arm ? You don't know individual issues nor areas of disability that might impact one person or another. Also, Rift remade this same path though THE ISSUE HAS BEEN RAISED before. What is apparent is that some people with disabilities and some without, CAN NOT DO IT. Could two paths have been created with hardly any mechanism finagling and a more complicated incentivized with an additional reward to those that complete the harder one? Just saying a suggestion could've been raised. If Rift can't form a time frame to change the existing mechanisms, perhaps they can be aware of how they build future ones.
    Last edited by Sails; 10-10-2018 at 01:09 PM.
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  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faeraday View Post
    No, it is not flawed.

    There are plenty of elements that are properly represented in the stages leading up to this one, many of them difficult for the same people in this thread.

    There is not a single mechanic anywhere in current raid content that requires 3D maneuvering. Making an appeal to perhaps someday maybe future content will use this mechanic is more stretching imo.

    It is intended to be a puzzle, and has no significant applicability towards raiding otherwise there would be a similar mechanism in current content - the same content this weapon was designed for.

    Perhaps there is just something about this particular requirement that, no matter how much effort is spent, is simply beyond the ability of others without some kind of assistance.

    We've established nobody knows anybody here, so it is not for me to assume what any given player's ability level might be.

    I also won't try to justify or deny anyone else's pain by sharing any anecdotal experience I may or may not have regarding any condition in particular. Because that kind of information is equally inapplicable - I would never presume to tell anyone who has condition x that I also have condition x and I can do y just fine therefore so can you, because of the previous paragraph.

    Should they risk getting punished/banned or taken advantage of by unscrupulous players just to get past this hurdle, or would it be better for everybody if there was some way to handle the issue in an officially sanctioned way?
    It's totally flawed. There are plenty of aspects of the particle collection quest that do apply to raiding, and they are not disqualified by that distinction alone.

    It's not a puzzle at all. It's practice in avoiding bad stuff and staying in safe areas, emphasizing that getting to safe areas by crossing bad stuff isn't okay. Haven't you seen the way raids often have red areas (that you have to avoid) and safe areas or other objectives to reach? There's a lot of that in TD.

    If part of a video game is beyond someone's ability, they should practice until they surmount it or deal with not finishing it. There are so many possible tasks and so many possible disabilities that expecting anything beyond a colorblindness-friendly interface is an exercise in disappointment.

    The officially sanctioned way of being unable to do a certain thing in a video game is to be unable to do that certain thing in that video game.

  4. #49
    Sword of Telara
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    With Enigma there is even a boss that is quite similar to the requirements in this quest. I think that most players who have problems with the quest would also have problems with Enigma.
    Last edited by Bamul; 10-10-2018 at 01:51 PM.

  5. #50
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    Up there in other post
    Last edited by Sails; 10-10-2018 at 04:02 PM.
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  6. #51
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrionBrasse View Post
    I will bring the question to the Dev team again for consideration.
    In case it is really really really really really really difficult to completely remove the particles part, it would be nice if the amount required could at least be reduced, like previous steps have been. I don't want it down to 5, that would be too easy for most people. But somewhere between 15 and the daily 20 would probably be doable for a lot of people.

  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigerhawkT3 View Post
    It's totally flawed. There are plenty of aspects of the particle collection quest that do apply to raiding, and they are not disqualified by that distinction alone.

    It's not a puzzle at all. It's practice in avoiding bad stuff and staying in safe areas, emphasizing that getting to safe areas by crossing bad stuff isn't okay. Haven't you seen the way raids often have red areas (that you have to avoid) and safe areas or other objectives to reach? There's a lot of that in TD.

    If part of a video game is beyond someone's ability, they should practice until they surmount it or deal with not finishing it. There are so many possible tasks and so many possible disabilities that expecting anything beyond a colorblindness-friendly interface is an exercise in disappointment.

    The officially sanctioned way of being unable to do a certain thing in a video game is to be unable to do that certain thing in that video game.
    It's a puzzle.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faeraday View Post
    It's a puzzle.
    Tetris is a puzzle. Hexcells is a puzzle. Minesweeper is a puzzle. A sliding-tile game is a puzzle. Sudoku is a puzzle.

    Particle collection doesn't have anything to solve. It's an action platformer similar to Joust, intended to introduce (or reintroduce) players to the fact that sometimes there's a place you have to move to while avoiding other stuff.

  9. #54
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    The solution is to collect x number of particles.

    It is a puzzle.

    Thankfully Brasse has already addressed this so we don't need to anymore.

  10. #55
    General of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TrionBrasse View Post
    I am late to this thread.
    I've asked Nomis to take action regarding the snarky, unhelpful posters.

    I am sorry to see anyone mocking those with disabilities, be they visual, physical or mental. NOT IN OUR HOUSE.

    Let me add: advancing age IS a disability - it affects everything from vision to memory to reaction speed. Vertigo is a disability, and the main reason I cannot complete this stage myself. Color blindness is a rather common disability and the most common complaint in gaming. Any of these can impact the completion of this particular quest.

    These disabilities do not necessarily affect people in raids though - that correlation cannot be made.

    While I have trouble with this quest myself, I know others sail through it.
    I will bring the question to the Dev team again for consideration.
    I don't mind if you removed my post as long as other parties were removed too, which they were, but you've left quotes in there of the original post..

    And no age is not a disability, that simply has no factual basis. Just because you're slower or have worse memory does not make you disabled. Those who are lower on the IQ spectrum often have the same traits, harsh to call them disabled would it not. Anyone who's slower than myself is disabled too? Am I disabled to someone who's much quicker than myself? You get the idea.
    Last edited by Refuge; 10-10-2018 at 03:05 PM.
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  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Faeraday View Post
    The solution is to collect x number of particles.

    It is a puzzle.

    Thankfully Brasse has already addressed this so we don't need to anymore.
    And the solution to Mario is to get to the end, so it's a puzzle, right?

    Anyway, yes, Brasse has suggested that we might start seeing manual intervention in the case of disability. I eagerly look forward to availing myself of such a system, assuming it's implemented fairly.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by TigerhawkT3 View Post
    IRotP is a much narrower bottleneck than the particle quest, and you can't complete the upgrade without finishing all the sub-quests, so I'm not sure why the particle quest is even an issue.

    Several people have already made videos, and I made one the last time a thread like this popped up. Highlights: steer with the mouse, go for the highest particles first, use the big jump to get around and the small jump for adjustments, alternate jumps to maintain altitude, plan your route, don't be afraid to take the long way around.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=unBzUYtccBg
    ------------
    ^
    That video reminds me of Tommy Chong.
    -------------
    Long ago I increased the zoom in/zoom out to make the game more playable for me. It was very easy to edit the .cfg file in notepad, 10 seconds.

    Take a look here to see exactly what that looks like:




    So I use the scroll wheel to zoom in or zoom out. It's that easy.
    My .cfg file is found under Program Files (86)>Rift>rift.cfg. Just double click it and it will open in the notepad app and you can edit it.

    My current settings are:

    [Camera]
    distanceScale = 20.000000
    distanceScaleAlt = 17.839996
    maxDistanceScale = 50.000000
    maxDistanceScaleAlt = 20.000000
    pitch = -0.515758
    useAltDistScale = False

    Hope this helps some folks out.
    Peace,
    Last edited by Dizbo; 10-10-2018 at 04:51 PM. Reason: edit

  13. #58
    Telaran
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    Make the quest update for group members so we can help out friends who for whatever reason can't do it ourselves. Sharing account information is not a good idea.

  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sails View Post
    My concern is that its left at what you say instead of the company trying to do better. Is it really your job to go find prior stuff and repost it?
    Again, there are limitations to what any company can do at any given time in regard to making improvements in places. That doesn't mean they shouldn't try or don't want to and as I already pointed out in my initial post, they had every intention to and wanted to, but like everything else, it comes down what their personal list of priorities is what they feel is more realistic in terms of the time and resources they have at any given point. There are times where you simply have to weigh your options - Do you address the lack of PvE content and the 12 months + of no class balancing which affects every aspect of the game or do you spend extra time and resources on something that the vast majority of people (comparatively) already and continue to complete just fine. They're not going out of their way to undermine that people who can't as some would like to believe.

    As far as me reposting and relaying information. Part of why I started doing it is because I spend a lot of time reading the forums, watching (and rewatching) streams and after just playing for so long, I happen to remember a lot of what goes on and can typically dig up info. People open a lot of new threads and ask a lot of the same questions that already have answers, but the vast majority of people don't feel like doing any amount of research themselves to find said answers. This entire thread is no exception. That's not to say that people bringing it up again isn't important (as it lets the team know that it's still an issue for many), but there have been several threads on this topic already filled with lots of discussion. I also just like to help out when I can as it's not that difficult to look things up and reference info as needed.

    Thread One
    http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...deo-guide.html

    Thread Two
    http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...particles.html

    Thread Three
    http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...est-chain.html

    Thread Four
    http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...my-desire.html

    Thread Five
    http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...de-update.html

    Salvatrix's Reply
    http://forums.riftgame.com/general-d...ml#post5337085

    Now, it'd certainly be nice if devs would repost the information that already exists, but like any news and updates, part of the responsibility will always be on players to keep themselves up to date and do some research themselves first before opening up a new thread. Those only took about 5 minutes to find. The only exception to this are live streams as those are more time consuming and difficult to dig through, but I try to post time stamps to those too when I can.
    Last edited by Holyroller12; 10-11-2018 at 02:12 AM.

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  15. #60
    Ascendant Kulta's Avatar
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    They made a change regarding the minion, they can adjust or just remove this part of the quest. It is not right that those who have disabilities are denied the chance to have the fully upgraded item because they are disabled---
    Have you ever wanted to?

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