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Thread: Some deep thoughts about RIFT

  1. #31
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    There isn't any elegant design reason behind them not releasing anything for the last 9+ months. The reason is that Rift Live is no longer one of their lead titles. They have decided not to invest into Rift Live other than to maintain the current expansion. There have been no official announcements of any new content for at least 2 quarters. Trove is their big money maker now along Atlas Reactor and whatever this publishing thing is they are doing. I keep playing Rift because of the people I play with not because of the game we are playing. When Pantheon releases or enough of them quit, I am out.

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balidin View Post
    There isn't any elegant design reason behind them not releasing anything for the last 9+ months. The reason is that Rift Live is no longer one of their lead titles. They have decided not to invest into Rift Live other than to maintain the current expansion. There have been no official announcements of any new content for at least 2 quarters. Trove is their big money maker now along Atlas Reactor and whatever this publishing thing is they are doing. I keep playing Rift because of the people I play with not because of the game we are playing. When Pantheon releases or enough of them quit, I am out.
    When they introduced primalist they gave the most played population, rogue, a reason to fight even more over gear drops. And it filled players with reasons to spite each other. Primalist and rogue share most of the same gear. They upp'ed the drop rate for them and this had impacted every other class detrimentally. This was a no, no.. in every sense of the way.Especially considering that it effected raids which can not continuously be run because of lock outs. Every single class had to deal with that burden. This made them money in the short time but cost them tons in the long run. I can't even count on both hands how many players said each week "and another leather" or primalist two hander in MoM and CoA at the time. Our warriors and mages were the most pissed off toward the end because they put in lots of time and didn't fully gear for the new expansion. Like missing trinkets weapons and shields...

    Cleric was really terrible until they gave them a good legendary to fix almost all their broken dps specs with fervent strike revamp and revamp to icy blow legendary. They made them least viable for healers. There were a massive amount of whales in this community. They had the most couples as well. And they were usually buying all the cosmetics and cutesy stuff. They lost big there.

    This is why you have the population like this. There are scattered other reasons but I honestly think those were the worse mistakes they made. They could have just added 2 new soul for each class and I think it would have made more money, and kept more players intact and focused on balancing classes with changes to classes on the fly and every week like they use to back in early Rift. Right now changes happen to classes slower than an iceberg. This isn't even considered baby steps. Bugs reported 2 years ago still exist in classes.
    Last edited by Flashmemory; 08-15-2018 at 02:32 PM.

  3. #33
    Shadowlander Perisemiotics's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balidin View Post
    There isn't any elegant design reason behind them not releasing anything for the last 9+ months. The reason is that Rift Live is no longer one of their lead titles. They have decided not to invest into Rift Live other than to maintain the current expansion. There have been no official announcements of any new content for at least 2 quarters. Trove is their big money maker now along Atlas Reactor and whatever this publishing thing is they are doing. I keep playing Rift because of the people I play with not because of the game we are playing. When Pantheon releases or enough of them quit, I am out.
    I think their biggest thing right now is the new Defiance. I've been playing Atlas Reactor and the new season that was supposed to start next Tuesday (devs even teased it on the last livestream) has just been postponed, today, by no less than 3 weeks... without any previous notice or communication. That's Trion for you. Now we can speculate why that was so but we'll never know why and they'll never communicate. I play and have fun as I can but I won't waste any time or energy speaking to deaf ears and I definitely won't ever support Trion financially after what they did in SFP.

    Never again.
    Last edited by Perisemiotics; 08-16-2018 at 08:30 AM.
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  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flashmemory View Post
    When they introduced primalist they gave the most played population, rogue, a reason to fight even more over gear drops. And it filled players with reasons to spite each other. Primalist and rogue share most of the same gear. They upp'ed the drop rate for them and this had impacted every other class detrimentally. This was a no, no.. in every sense of the way.Especially considering that it effected raids which can not continuously be run because of lock outs. Every single class had to deal with that burden. This made them money in the short time but cost them tons in the long run. I can't even count on both hands how many players said each week "and another leather" or primalist two hander in MoM and CoA at the time. Our warriors and mages were the most pissed off toward the end because they put in lots of time and didn't fully gear for the new expansion. Like missing trinkets weapons and shields...

    Tuning RNG is not their strong suit.[/COLOR]


    Cleric was really terrible until they gave them a good legendary to fix almost all their broken dps specs with fervent strike revamp and revamp to icy blow legendary. They made them least viable for healers. There were a massive amount of whales in this community. They had the most couples as well. And they were usually buying all the cosmetics and cutesy stuff. They lost big there.

    This is why you have the population like this. There are scattered other reasons but I honestly think those were the worse mistakes they made. They could have just added 2 new soul for each class and I think it would have made more money, and kept more players intact and focused on balancing classes with changes to classes on the fly and every week like they use to back in early Rift. Right now changes happen to classes slower than an iceberg. This isn't even considered baby steps. Bugs reported 2 years ago still exist in classes.
    Why on earth would we need 2 more souls? We cannot get the existing souls scaled properly in the first place. When they get to work on dealing with the rubbish souls or delete those that will not be scaled but never before.
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  5. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMX View Post
    Why on earth would we need 2 more souls? We cannot get the existing souls scaled properly in the first place. When they get to work on dealing with the rubbish souls or delete those that will not be scaled but never before.
    If you have 10 rogues online and you want to do a 10 man that requires you to have 1 mage at least what happens? That is 10 players who can't play because they need 1 mage.. That seems to be the approach they were taking with classes, gear, and the primalist, even the eternal weapons in this expansion. They basically sabotage game and players by doing that.. You may say well then one of the 10 should reroll.. Are you going to give them the 10s of 1000s of plat they need to do that and wait the few months for them to catch up? I didn't think so. A lot of players would quit before then. That is why it feels like maintenance mode and they are going after dimensioneers for profit now. Prime was an effort to maintain some sort of paying playerbase and give them a sort of life line. Maybe they are happy with only a few hundred players logged in rather than 10s of thousands as long as they are able to control players in someway... I guess they are happy with that more so than having a AAA title that would have, could have rivaled the best MMOs of all time instead.

    I would have rather they added the missing souls like the utility of dom and cab for the martial classes. Fixed the supports and added the supports that were missing to other classes than added primalist and its 11 souls that get hardly any play. All it did was add to the incompetence in design. What I don't get is for years they have said class balance is on going and difficult process, there are thousands of soul combos and raid/party make up etc. So why add even more problems that directly make it exponentially more difficult to balance like useless souls and more classes? What is next for them to say? Rift is not a PvP game now its not a raid game? The problem is to the player it seems like adding more waste, killing replay value and not adding new viable content over the years.
    Last edited by Aedynn; 08-26-2018 at 03:28 AM.

  6. #36
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    We haven't seen true situational encounters in more than two expansions.

    Furthermore, if the existing souls were actually scaled properly, by a properly lead team of appropriate membership to maintain this title, we would never have reached the current gloom and doom.

    So, we'll blame the addition of primy cause there aren't enough hands on deck to maintain the game at the wholesale level. Prime was released at a time when maintenance of Live was at an all time low along with zero content delivery. This was done as a desperate cash grab to offset the hemorrhage of players and met with less than stellar results.

    Endgame question, how many viable (Raid Ready) souls exist for each of the 5 classes at this point?
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  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMX View Post
    Endgame question, how many viable (Raid Ready) souls exist for each of the 5 classes at this point?
    Just to get this out of the way - I believe each class has a viable tank soul for BoS. However, I definitely do agree some are better than others.

    Mage: Ele and Pyro/Lock are viable, Archon (of course), Chloro and FK both have situational parts in BoS.

    Rogue: 61 NB or MM, a healing Bard variant for boss 1 still works, Phys in a pinch (I don't prefer it but have used it) for boss 2.

    Cleric: Shaman or Inquisitor - Druid just doesn't seem worth it anymore, Warden/Wardocle, Purifier or Sentinal could be used on boss 2, I guess, I've used both on boss 2 kills but wouldn't recommend.

    Warrior: Riftblade, Reaver, Tempest (probably not optimal), Liberator and Warchanter and WC/WL.

    Primalist: either Fury Blast spamming dps spec (can we kill these finally, please), Farseer and Preserver both work situationally, Mystic "support".

    This is what I could come up with off the top but I'm sure all of the classes have 1-2 more souls that could be considered "viable" with enough gear. However, most of the souls not listed are sub-optimal. This leaves all classes with about half of their souls being frequently used for end game content while the other half serve little purpose.

    I know not all souls for all classes can be viable at the same time but I'll take a quick crack at a list of souls that could use some love/ purpose: basically all AOE dps souls, all support souls not named Archon or Mystic, Harbinger/ Necromancer/ Stormcaller/ Mystic Archer, Runeshaper, Shadeborn/Assassin/Ranger, Warlord/ Paragon, Predator/ Primal Lord(but only if the ability to hybridize it is taken away)/ Maelstrom/ 31 Dervish specs. Not everything on this list is a "bad" soul, but they all suffer from one or more of 3 things: being "OK" but outshined by other souls and are therefore not needed, they truly are underperforming, or they are just simply not necessary for completion of any end game content.
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMX View Post
    Endgame question, how many viable (Raid Ready) souls exist for each of the 5 classes at this point?
    You can have a good raid setup and still carry any other class in mediocre performing soul as long as your raid setup is filled with mostly best in slot classes for that raid encounter. The problem is that the best classes can be mostly one or two classes because they are OP and that creates the opportunity for players to side line other classes just to complete content. Basically even if you can take all of 1 class into a raid and complete it doesn't really matter if you can still take all of another class and complete it with a far better success rate and time. It still leads to alienating players.The success rate and time should be about the same for each class in order to combat alienating any players/classes from any role they want to play.

    Additionally, they should still balance classes and not use force to get a classes value up in raids. For instance, if you nerfed all of Mages other roles they still will be taken for archon but it will still feel wrong and the same like warriors felt with chantions for a long time.
    Last edited by Flashmemory; 08-27-2018 at 03:04 AM.

  9. #39
    General of Telara arus2001's Avatar
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    My interest began to tank long ago when it seemed evident the devs pretty much wanted to prop raiding above everything else in terms of progression.

    Basically, I'm one of those poor souls whose RL doesn't lend itself to the raiding schedule. Instead, depending on how much time I ahead of me, I'd try to do whatever I felt would be the most productive. Sometimes it'd simply be gathering and/or working on crafts. Other times it'd be chasing zone events. Yet, the game eventually hit an iteration where crafted gear would only get you dungeon ready, while the world gear was maybe slightly more powerful with exponentially more grind behind it. I know I'd make posts about this from time to time with silence from the devs, but worse, certain community members would essentially agree with the then current model, lobbing out token lines like, "Well, you don't need better gear for what you do!" or that no one would raid if they actually didn't have to. That last one I find particularly telling since it would infer that raiding isn't so much about the fun/challenge for people, as it is simply being able to continue to grow one's character(s). Of course, the reasons I don't find raiding "fun" go beyond personal scheduling issues, but such is also continuously downplayed and/or dismissed.

    I had a brief glimmer of hope when it came time to launch the Hammerknell IA, but then it hit and it was crap drop rates and pretty mediocre gear for the effort, overall. The collective group of IAs were also not as engaging as chasing zone events, even though I do feel ZEs started going downhill with NT in terms of both accessibility and creativity. It was also pretty evident that the devs weren't happy about players taking advantage of shard hopping to access even more ZEs than prior to the feature, so the grind seemingly increased further without any real bump in quality.

    So, when you start feeling like the digital equivalent of a second class citizen, what real incentive is there to stick around? Obviously, I still poke my head in from time to time hoping that maybe something has changed and the game can occupy for a few months between lulls in other titles or releases, but there's never really been that tug to get back in. Worse since I was pretty much a warrior main and everyone pretty much seemed to agree they were garbage for a long span of time there. Heck, that may even still be the case, as I haven't researched much post-revamp from a bit back. Oh well.

  10. #40
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    Basically, I'm one of those poor souls whose RL doesn't lend itself to the raiding schedule
    you cant keep up with the raiding schedule?

    irotp and bos as thats it pretty much unfortunately.

    so an hour for irotp per week and as BOS is out of the range for you atm then your raiding schedule is now completed for the week

  11. #41
    General of Telara arus2001's Avatar
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    *sees if weird reply errors stop...*

    ...well, had something more drawn out in reply, but I'm guessing I'm getting caught in some auto-filter block or something. Not about to sift through a few paragraphs to find the triggers, either, so nuts to that.
    Last edited by arus2001; 08-28-2018 at 06:55 PM.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flashmemory View Post
    You can have a good raid setup and still carry any other class in mediocre performing soul as long as your raid setup is filled with mostly best in slot classes for that raid encounter. The problem is that the best classes can be mostly one or two classes because they are OP and that creates the opportunity for players to side line other classes just to complete content. Basically even if you can take all of 1 class into a raid and complete it doesn't really matter if you can still take all of another class and complete it with a far better success rate and time. It still leads to alienating players.The success rate and time should be about the same for each class in order to combat alienating any players/classes from any role they want to play.

    Additionally, they should still balance classes and not use force to get a classes value up in raids. For instance, if you nerfed all of Mages other roles they still will be taken for archon but it will still feel wrong and the same like warriors felt with chantions for a long time.
    The fact of the matter remains. There are only a couple choices due to lack of leadership. There is a major issue with class balance never making the scene, ever. That is one of the issues. And yus, a few elitist "God's gift to the game" sorts might still play. (Although, I find that doubtful)


    Frankly, I have no faith in the leadership to direct this and make it right let alone, deliver content in a reasonable fashion.
    Last edited by BMX; 08-29-2018 at 06:33 AM.
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  13. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Skiye View Post


    Now it's kill boss, and get loaner loot...then kill him another 10 times so that you can finish receiving your gear. Oh btw, lockout so wait a few months. Darn it...it's hero suffixed so you'll probably eventually replace it. Guess I'm technically still waiting on my drop.

    It honestly kills the fun.

    Truly unique special items like eternal items I don't mind upgrade paths...but raid loot should come already completed.
    Yes I have to agree, sub par gear that needs another 10 runs to upgrade, you get to that 9th run and get a better subpar item of the same to have to do another 10 runs. That has happened a few times to where, I don't care anymore. They made end game a grind fest that doesn't give any fulfillment as each drop you get from a boss isn't even the best you can get. Why should I be doing 100 of the same raids to get a subpar item?

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