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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Future Plans - questions for Trion

  1. #31
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    Rift devs have done things they said before they had "no plans" for.

    I clearly remember them saying years ago they had no plans for Cliffside Vale / Shi-Ming / Planetouched Wilds to ever be real zones. Well, um, now we have Planetouched Wilds. I do remember smiling when I saw that was a zone, when I came back after being gone for awhile (before I quit primalists and PTW hadn't even been announced).

    So now, with Slipmat claiming CQ is coming back after all the devs saying "no plans" to revive Conquest, I dunno, I guess it's possible...

    And I'm sure there's other things they said they had no plans for that now are in-game. Plans change I guess.
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  2. #32
    Ascendant Laeti's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iphigeneia View Post

    And I'm sure there's other things they said they had no plans for that now are in-game. Plans change I guess.
    Well yeah, like, paying for power, paying for gear slots, and paying for all these things after it's been clearly stated that at least in this expansion you pay once and don't have to pay again, because everyone will be on the same fair field... And yet we have zero comments on the matter, as if it's completely okay to promise something and then do the exact opposite.

    Don't get me wrong, anyone would love a pleasant surprise, like returning of CQ after "CQ will not return" announcement. As for the other examples... I think the least we deserve is some explanations.
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  3. #33
    Rift Chaser Rivkah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Iphigeneia View Post
    Rift devs have done things they said before they had "no plans" for.

    I clearly remember them saying years ago they had no plans for Cliffside Vale / Shi-Ming / Planetouched Wilds to ever be real zones. Well, um, now we have Planetouched Wilds. I do remember smiling when I saw that was a zone, when I came back after being gone for awhile (before I quit primalists and PTW hadn't even been announced).

    So now, with Slipmat claiming CQ is coming back after all the devs saying "no plans" to revive Conquest, I dunno, I guess it's possible...

    And I'm sure there's other things they said they had no plans for that now are in-game. Plans change I guess.
    It just doesn't make a lot of sense to me to have this 'say one thing but do the opposite' approach after a rocky B2P expansion release and a fairly sharp decline in population. I know a ton of people who used to enjoy CQ who quit and probably will never come back because they said they have "no plans" to bring it back. Why mislead people and lose more players?

    Especially after they said that they will never charge for power or access to zones, then charged for those things, distrust is fairly high. Now would be a great time to be more open and transparent to rebuild some trust.

  4. #34
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    The first thing to note is this was said by someone who doesn't work for Trion. Until A trion representitive confirms it then CQ coming back is just hear say. This isn't a slight against Slipmat and I am sure they wouldnt lie like that but until it's confirmed, what can we really say.

    With regards to promises or anythig else, The Trion dev team is understaffed, underfunded and my personal opinion is that Rift is not the flagship game anymore. The CEO of Trion was the original game director of this game and I thought he would want to look after his game but it doesnt look like it. As a consequence of these factors we have buggy systems and content that needed more time in development. We used to have 4 class devs in the day, now we have 1. We have developers with many hats so no wonder they struggle.

    The Trion team has some good people there. Tacitus works bloody hard. We can all see that. He was seemingly at work 24/7 at the expansion launch. Simon logs into the servers in his own time on a sunday to give us some fun chasing him about, thats really cool man. I don't always agree with Brasse but she works hard man, she was doing the Rift CM job plus she is the manager of the CMs of all the other games. She does need to reply to emails though especially when she asks me specifically in a livestream to do so!

    There are other great working people that I see on the team as well but the point is without support and clear direction it doesnt matter how many good people you have. We have stuck by Trion since the start, Trion needs to stick by Rift.
    Last edited by Balidin; 09-13-2017 at 05:21 AM.

  5. #35
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    With the current expansion being incredibly small and raids being relegated to "intrepid", along with many other things, such as PvP being largely abandoned, yes many people have gone on to other games. We find our toon on a random shard upon login every time.

    Yes, there is a very real need to bolster the dev team. Just think what the current team could achieve with a group of people under them to provide the manpower necessary for a reasonably sized expansion. Just think of how nice it would be to have 20 man raids once more!

    What would it be like to have more souls viable again if Keyens had the assistance of two additional team mates working on balancing and tuning of the classes. Poor guy has his hands full trying to solo it. No wonder there are only harb and pyro for mages.
    We could even have hybrids once again (which IS the foundation of Rift.)
    The art department has done an amazing job although, again, manpower to create a large expansion wasn't present. With the current staff running full tilt to maintain the current expansion, it's no wonder CQ is out and PvP is neglected. Simply put, the team had to choose between PvE and PvP since time was available for one or the other and not both.
    Yes, I do believe quality of game and its content could improve greatly with more hands on deck.


    I agree with Holyroller in that Rift is not dead or gonna die, but the population is very low currently.

    If Trion were to bring in a few more people to the dev team and Hartsman were to assign someone to the position of Game Director to which the team leaders would account to, we could see a major improvement in content as well as game experience. The scope of Rift is large enough that there needs to be sufficient staff to create content for the next expansion, let alone maintain what we currently have. Make this happen and promote the game like it deserves.
    Rift is a magnificent franchise. It deserves the personnel necessary to keep it that way or make it even better. Clearly, the current team would be less overwhelmed with a few additional teammates on hand.

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Balidin View Post
    The first thing to note is this was said by someone who doesn't work for Trion. Until A trion representitive confirms it then CQ coming back is just hear say. This isn't a slight against Slipmat and I am sure they wouldnt lie like that but until it's confirmed, what can we really say.
    Like I said we are facing one of biggest paradoxes ever, in that livestream Archonix whois in charge of game as game director thou Seshatar claimed he is Executive Producer, he said there is no future plan for conquest also he said moving npcs of queens foci outside is not in plans too but that happened before that livestream happened and npcs moved on next patch because PAX week patch failed on internal tests or something like this we have been told.

    Now when you watch Seshatar's video you can clearly hear, Archonix said conquest will come back in probably next year.

    Its leaving me in questions either Game Director/Producer has no clue about whats going on which is unlikely or he is just saying stuff we want to hear like they will be actually never gonna happen
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  7. #37
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    Not feeling the pizza analogy. Ordering some food is much more static and transactional, a consumable physical good with a more straightforward set of metrics.

    "You see, I've been eating this pizza for a couple of weeks now and I've found that a complex interaction of toppings lead to the flavor of the primaronis completely overpowering everything else. I mean, it was fine at first, but as people discovered the interaction and shared pizza eating techniques online my own experience was inexorably impacted. My rank on the pizza meters make me consider this continual meal now nearly INEDIBLE, as it's that much harder to get picked up by a pizza party due to my choice of mage crust pizza."

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rivkah View Post
    It just doesn't make a lot of sense to me to have this 'say one thing but do the opposite' approach after a rocky B2P expansion release and a fairly sharp decline in population. I know a ton of people who used to enjoy CQ who quit and probably will never come back because they said they have "no plans" to bring it back. Why mislead people and lose more players?

    Especially after they said that they will never charge for power or access to zones, then charged for those things, distrust is fairly high. Now would be a great time to be more open and transparent to rebuild some trust.
    Yeah, I admit the "buy the expansion" was a bad taste in my mouth, after coming back. Trion went for years insisting that content would always be free, and yet here they were, walking that back for a quick buck. It still bothers me that, after all the feedback given, they heard "we want to buy expansions AND fluff AND then continue to pay for rift rewards!" (or I assume they thought that, I dunno...)

    That's the other thing I was referring to in my previous post, that they said they wouldn't do and then did -- just didn't have the energy to articulate it at the time \

    I do think they're making an effort to improve communication. I for one appreciate Yaviey's tireless bug report responses and Tacitus seems to be right on top of everything that falls under him, so that I appreciate, but I too would like to hear more about the future of the game. All I know anymore is that there's apparently a new raid coming out in fall. And, well, technically fall's gonna be here within like 10 days, so... yeah.

    Another comprehensive producer's letter please?
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  9. #39
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    Default I am with Laeti here...

    The reason I stopped playing this game and took my dollars elsewhere (silver tier) is because of inconsistency and lack of communication. Yes- I still have a guild on the game and I log in to check on it- and I follow the forums to see if problems/suggestions will help my guild- but I stopped actually playing months ago. I miss the old Rift- I miss fresh content- I miss the superior customer driven product Rift used to be. I miss a lot- I would return if I saw improvement. Laeti is right- saying one thing and doing another or complete silence is not a good way to grow a player base. Transparency and consistent communication and explanation is key. Players are not mushrooms- they do not thrive in the dark being fed manure.

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by aileen View Post
    In vanilla we had class dev for each specific class (Ailion for Rogues, Kervik for Mages, Atrius for Warriors, Zinbik for Clerics) after SL launched if i remember correctly on 2.1 Atrius and Zinbik left trion and Ailion was in charge of Rogues and Warriors, Kervik was in charge of Clerics and Mages. I think around sometime in 2.3 or end of 2.2 can't remember correctly Ailion left to his country back and Vladd was in charge of Rogues and Warriors, I didn't play after that much and returned for a short time in 3.0 and afaik Vladd and Kervik was still in charge of this classes I mentioned like till 3.1 or 3.2 Kervik remained class dev and he moved to some other trion project, till this expansion I believe there was still two people in charge of classes.

    So what I'm trying to say, being in charge of classes is not equal with some stuff getting help from other people in team which I believe not is the case, what I believe we should get 2 or 3 classes only for him to work and some other person from team or outside of team should get other 2 or 3 classes remaining.

    Compared to old times there is now 5 classes in game which means more souls to track, more balances to be done even when there was 4 classes around that job splitted between at least two people.

    As players we should be more constructive about balancing too and help him instead of crying over everywhere I play rogue and never played other classes at all but I believe rogues even thou has like few specs which is doing more than other classes except primalists should be tuned down too but I'll say it once again we should compare equivalent geared peoples parses, a guy with less gear crying about other classes doing more than them is not gonna help in fact it would be ridicilious to compare.

    I know I'm going out of topic but I'm trying to say few things depends on our reactions and decisions as players, thou current state of game in all aspects is not satisfying at least for 75% of games population.
    Lol m8 we tried to help. Majority of my advice was ignored after Red Hawk left. Then it got to the point that kirb, a guy who plays all classes would be the only person keyens listened to because "im a good suck up so hopefully if i suck up enough and provide numbers he will listen." Funny thing is kirb was feeding him information directly from me, then kirb would be like honestly why are you asking for my input when you should really just ask munch? I mean he literally made primalist boom for a reason.

    In actuallity i could sit down with keyens and explain to him in 5 minutes how to fix and balance primalist. Heck i even post on the forums the same thing since 4.0 beta. With this information he wouldnt have to figure out wtf is going on and be so stressed, then he could look at data and spreadsheets and literally balance and fix an entire class in 3 hours. But why do that when you can just slap a 50% pvp nerf on Ebeam, destroy all sub soul options with predator and have a legendary added being scything strike which was stated and reported to be a brokenly unbalanced legendary AFTER molten wave was flagged before 4.0 came out. Like wtf?

    Ya, just like deew said, its not that they dont have help, they dont want it.
    Last edited by Gilgad; 09-14-2017 at 09:30 AM.

  11. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by Laeti View Post
    - No ETA on two major issues (IRCs and Fragments), not even a hint of which changes to expect;
    i don't know what is IRC (I belive you don't mean that chat network from nineties), but my opinion fragments aren't a major issue - they works as expected and as intended.

    - Nothing is being done to address the RNG and monetization issues lots of people have been talking about for months - and this is one of the most important things as it relates directly to how well the game could be supported in the future to ensure its development;
    Why RNG and monetization is an issue? OK you don't get loot or get bad one. So what? Sometimes you will get better... It is life that you don't always get what you want. And you don't have to have BiS in all slots... all raids are doable even with little lower gear.

  12. #42
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    Quote Originally Posted by Arzka2 View Post
    i don't know what is IRC (I belive you don't mean that chat network from nineties), but my opinion fragments aren't a major issue - they works as expected and as intended.



    Why RNG and monetization is an issue? OK you don't get loot or get bad one. So what? Sometimes you will get better... It is life that you don't always get what you want. And you don't have to have BiS in all slots... all raids are doable even with little lower gear.
    Since you mentioned you didn't know what IRC are, here's a post that along with the comments sums up what exactly is wrong with them. Prepare for the long read though.

    If the fragments aren't an issue in your opinion, it is absolutely fine. As someone who gave up levelling alts, participating in PVP, or any competitive content for that matter, and frankly just doing anything that requires me to progress, I can confirm that in this case, fragments aren't an issue at all. However there are still people in the game with different play styles, and it is an issue for them. From ridiculous and unnecessary plat sinks (something that was directed at a very small group of people but hit everyone instead) to RNG on every step.

    Speaking of RNG. The fact that just about everything, apart from most direct purchases from the store, is completely random now, is actually a big issue, one that many of us aren't too happy about. While in some cases it does make the experience somewhat fun and helps with the rushing through content issue, overall RNG-controlled game experience is a fail. There's a very fine line between fun and frustrating, especially when it comes to gearing up and grinding. Especially, when a grind is topped by RNG. In my opinion, gearing and progression should not depend on

    - how much money you can spend
    - how RNG lucky you are

    And it definitely should not involve both at the same time. And here we're touching on monetization issue. Some of us here believe that we should not be paying for gear, or in our case, paying for gambling on gear and stats. Both IRCs and Fragments promote this kind of behavior, and judging by the obvious lack of changes, the system proves profitable, otherwise it would have been a prior concern. As for things not related to gear and gameplay, monetization also needs to change in many ways. For example, lock boxes should not be dropping gear pieces and/or fragments. The rewards from said boxes should be valuable and tradeable regardless of how many boxes you've opened. Trading credits and buying them from the store should be more player friendly. Patron should be more attractive and useful in order to make sense in a game with little challenge on max levels. You can read more on that in the topic I linked in my signature, if you're really interested - there's plenty of valid suggestions (granted, some of them are already in the game in some form).




    And, I never said that you have to be BIS or that raids require good gear. That's not even relevant anymore, but even if it was, in the current situation - it would have been much, much worse. You can't really claim p2w right now because there's not much left to "win". If there were... well, direct and indirect paying to gear would be a much bigger issue then, wouldn't it? ;)
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  13. #43
    Rift Chaser Rivkah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gilgad View Post
    Lol m8 we tried to help. Majority of my advice was ignored after Red Hawk left. Then it got to the point that kirb, a guy who plays all classes would be the only person keyens listened to because "im a good suck up so hopefully if i suck up enough and provide numbers he will listen." Funny thing is kirb was feeding him information directly from me, then kirb would be like honestly why are you asking for my input when you should really just ask munch? I mean he literally made primalist boom for a reason.

    In actuallity i could sit down with keyens and explain to him in 5 minutes how to fix and balance primalist. Heck i even post on the forums the same thing since 4.0 beta. With this information he wouldnt have to figure out wtf is going on and be so stressed, then he could look at data and spreadsheets and literally balance and fix an entire class in 3 hours. But why do that when you can just slap a 50% pvp nerf on Ebeam, destroy all sub soul options with predator and have a legendary added being scything strike which was stated and reported to be a brokenly unbalanced legendary AFTER molten wave was flagged before 4.0 came out. Like wtf?

    Ya, just like deew said, its not that they dont have help, they dont want it.
    I could also sit down with Keyens and tell him, in 5 simple steps, how to bring BM up to par with chon and mystic, therefore ending the ongoing joke of a BM rework (seriously, it's the Halflife 3 of Rift) and taking a big, positive step towards improving the game experience. I don't think he's interested. I don't think anyone on the team is interested in hearing my feedback, or anyone elses' unless it's "everything is fine."

    Players have offered literal thousands of hours in unpaid labor, bugtesting, balance testing, and offering constructive feedback only to have it ignored or their forum/discord accounts penalized (back when there was a Discord with devs on it). We have tried, but since we don't have access to the source code, we have to wait for the devs to do something.

  14. #44
    Soulwalker Sosuke Aizen's Avatar
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    Woww they even ignore this thread? still no comments. incredible..

  15. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sosuke Aizen View Post
    Woww they even ignore this thread? still no comments. incredible..
    If it's a bug report or issue with the rift store, it gets a response. If it's filled with constructive criticism for deeper issues with the game, it gets ignored.
    Last edited by Rivkah; 09-14-2017 at 06:31 PM.

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