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Thread: So disappointed that All of Starfall is behind a Paywall!!

  1. #61
    Plane Touched KnightFalz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karok View Post
    Not only was it announced, there was much discussion in the chat channels. Even missing or misunderstanding the announcement how could someone miss all of the in game talk about it?
    I wouldn't have learned of the update from public chat channels as I turn all of those off.

  2. #62
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnightFalz View Post
    I wouldn't have learned of the update from public chat channels as I turn all of those off.
    So you effectively cut yourself off from communication with other players and couldn't understand an announcement and now you want to cry foul over it?


    Edit to add: Sorry, thought I was replying to a different poster.
    Last edited by Karok; 11-19-2016 at 04:49 PM.

  3. #63
    Plane Touched KnightFalz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Karok View Post
    So you effectively cut yourself off from communication with other players and couldn't understand an announcement and now you want to cry foul over it?


    Edit to add: Sorry, thought I was replying to a different poster.
    No worries, it's an easy thing to do with so many posts on the issue right now.

  4. #64
    Plane Walker ArcticGypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orbulis View Post
    So, Trion needs to work for free with no income so, the game won't have any active regular updates, that in the near future Trion should just shut the game down? OK. I get you OP.
    Errm so how is offering the expansion for credits like they did for the other expansions / soul packs going to hurt them? Someone still has to pay them money for either the credits or the rex.

    By doing what they did they are excluding a very large part of the community....something they always said they would never do.

  5. #65
    Shield of Telara Orbulis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArcticGypsy View Post
    Errm so how is offering the expansion for credits like they did for the other expansions / soul packs going to hurt them? Someone still has to pay them money for either the credits or the rex.

    By doing what they did they are excluding a very large part of the community....something they always said they would never do.
    You're new here, so I'll let you in a little secret.

    There was a large posts, back when, that people were demanding an expansion pack that is just a buy-to-play model. Which the posts was long lost in time, nonetheless, it exists - which Trion, even themselves have acknowledged that they were going to make a paid expansion. Then, here we go again, in a cycle of tormented souls, in an outcry to justify that what Trion did was wrong. Figures.

  6. #66
    General of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArcticGypsy View Post
    Errm so how is offering the expansion for credits like they did for the other expansions / soul packs going to hurt them? Someone still has to pay them money for either the credits or the rex.

    By doing what they did they are excluding a very large part of the community....something they always said they would never do.
    I don't believe any of the expansions/soul packs were ever offered for credit sale immediately upon release. If you want to purchase the expansion with credits you will either need to wait (I would assume within 6 months or so it will be available in the RIft store) or jump onto chat and wait for one of the players offering to gift the expansion for credits.REX (I think last offer I saw was for 15 REX).

  7. #67
    Plane Touched KnightFalz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArcticGypsy View Post
    Errm so how is offering the expansion for credits like they did for the other expansions / soul packs going to hurt them? Someone still has to pay them money for either the credits or the rex.

    By doing what they did they are excluding a very large part of the community....something they always said they would never do.
    An amount of $40 makes the expansion about as exclusive as the Wal-Mart Approved Customer list.

    Edit:

    Actually, there are a few people for which this price actually may be exclusionary, such as those who have had a sudden unexpected loss of income, those living on a fixed income due to disability or retirement and the like.

    For those in such a situation I apologize for being dismissive over the possibility that $40 could be an exclusionary value, for in situations such as yours it may well be.

    For those not in such a constrained situation, my original comment stands.
    Last edited by KnightFalz; 11-19-2016 at 09:26 PM.

  8. #68
    Plane Walker ArcticGypsy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnightFalz View Post
    An amount of $40 makes the expansion about as exclusive as the Wal-Mart Approved Customer list.

    Edit:

    Actually, there are a few people for which this price actually may be exclusionary, such as those who have had a sudden unexpected loss of income, those living on a fixed income due to disability or retirement and the like.

    For those in such a situation I apologize for being dismissive over the possibility that $40 could be an exclusionary value, for in situations such as yours it may well be.

    For those not in such a constrained situation, my original comment stands.
    I appreciate that very much. You are right. There are many whose circumstances just wouldn't have it in the budget to buy it. It's those people that I'm fighting to get the expansion up for credits so that they don't have to feel excluded.

    There is still a lot to do without it, but then you go to the map and see that big continent with a padlock on it and it's like a slap in the face. A reminder that there's some exciting new stuff to do but you can't take part. I'm not saying make it free, but put it up for credits for those of us that can't spare the $40. They would still have to work hard to buy enough Rex, but at least it's something to look forward to.
    Last edited by ArcticGypsy; 11-20-2016 at 12:19 AM.

  9. #69
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    Quote Originally Posted by KnightFalz View Post
    No, they didn't switch to b2p system of any type, and certainly not that of GW2.

    The company is retaining a f2p system with optional subscription.

    Free to play means simply that you can play a game without a subscription. Free to play does not mean by necessity free game expansions.

    One can choose to play Rift without a subscription whether they purchase the expansion or not. One can also choose to subscribe regardless of expansion purchase.

    Expansion costs have nothing to do with a game's price model. A little bit of research of various games being offered will show that this is so.
    What you just described is B2P with a Free Trial up to 65. I mean thats pretty simplistic way of putting it. What really happened here was Trion realized there is no possibly way to make the game B2P completely, you can't unring that bell but they have made it clear that the intention going forward is a B2P model. No different than what GW2 has except with the free trial/early F2P. Now its different here because the game was once sub based, then F2P and is now B2P. The devs have even noted this shift in model.

    Expansion costs have alot to do with a game's price model? How do I know this, I was once in this industry. Expansions cost money. If F2P isn't generating enough income to finance future "milestone content" as well as updates, then the model will be tweaked. Not saying this tweak will necessarily yield good results, but thats clearly what is happening here. I mean its pretty obvious, backing off from F2P had to have been a necessity otherwise there is no way they would have done it. There is a ton of risk involved in walking back from F2P even if you are only walking back part of the way.

    Trion direction changed. Management was altered and decisions were made that resulted in a lot of the original developers leaving.
    A new "business model" was adopted and, along with a kick in the teeth for those who had just committed to a 12 month subscription, FTP was announced.
    This is not accurate. Its documented that it wasn't a direction change but some rather heavy layoffs. Alot of this is common in the MMO industry (many devs are "contracted" for a period of time, if the game is not doing exceptionally well they are then let go). The MMO industry is a really tough one. And its only gotten much worse by all accounts since the time I was sort of involved with that. So the layoffs came as a result of financial issues. Some of that probably less to do with Rift then with Trion as a company. I think early on Rift was shouldering alot of the responsibility for carrying the company through development of various other projects. This to is common. However sometime after the launch of Storm Legion there were some key changes in how the game was run, So there was a shift at a certain point but that came later. But realize that a F2P system doesn't just appear. It would have taken at least a year to develop the F2P system Rift has. Things are never what they appear to be on the surface when it comes to MMO's. For kicks Look up Heroes of Telara some time and see when it was first ANNOUNCED. Then figure several years of development before that and you begin to realize how much goes into a MMO.
    Last edited by Khelendross; 11-25-2016 at 09:51 PM.
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  10. #70
    Ascendant Pines's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ArcticGypsy View Post
    snip
    It's unfortunate you didn't play before the game went "F2P", it blew this turd out of the water.
    Last edited by Pines; 11-26-2016 at 03:18 PM. Reason: le snip
    what is this I don't even

  11. #71
    Shield of Telara Necalli's Avatar
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    Here's my two thoughts. Not that anyone asked for them. Payment systems change over time for most MMOs, that's nothing new. Rift has had a bit more of a tumultuous time with their model but it's nothing destructive. When it comes down to paying the company I would much rather pay a company for releasing expansions, souls, zones, callings, and basically anything that isn't player power.

    I absolutely loathe the concept of having to pay a company for armor slots, attunement, or anything else considered player power. Why? Because if you pay a company for player power instead of content they're going to find new ways to make you pay for more power instead of making new content that you'd want to pay for. So while it isn't idealistic to pay for expansions, I would much rather pay for that than pay for earring slots or planewalker:water.

    Problem here is that the team has, instead of removing the paywalls on earrings and attunement, just added SFP to the pile of expenses that a player is going to have to put out for a game that can't even launch without half of the expansion being broken. Rift is one of the most expensive games to get into as a new player now, and the sad thing is that it isn't even worth the money.

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