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  1. #361
    Ascendant Artewig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blakehavok View Post
    You can say im speculating all you want but..Art, I highly suggest you just go watch seatins parody video of primalist, because its literally the best synopsis of primalist I've seen.

    How is less talents in tree more to learn? Like.. less is less. They've designed the souls to do specific things @31 points. Assuming there isn't ridiculous hybrids ~ you have everything you need in those 6 souls.


    Rogues: Tactician, Blade dancer, Assassin, and Ranger are all niche souls that are almost never raid viable due to lolMM. Simple rotation, super simple to do mechanics with ~ and you're good at target switching. MM only works with 61 points.

    ^ No one raids with these specs. 90% of raiders who are in their right mind Play MM, Pyro / Harb (now months into the expansion), Inquisitor / Shaman or Reaver for dps. Each one of these souls are the preferred method of raiding for MOST raiders due to viability and dps checks. You will not meet dps checks for progression if the majority of your raiders are not in this combination of souls. The thing is, most of those souls I just listed in this paragraph ^ are 61 points of fail in raid.
    Can't really comment on the other souls because I don't play them enough, but obviously you don't Rogue enough. I watched Seatin's video when he first posted it. I thought it was hilarious, but I fail to see how it can be called a "synopsis" of Primalist. The video was poking fun at the theme. Not the actual specs themselves. And I never said it having fewer points would mean there's more to learn, but rather that we don't know what is going to be done with those 31 points. We do know that it will be using a focus bar which will be interesting.

    I hate MM, I avoid it as much as I can (in fact, you can melee every single boss -- Izkinra with the breath making healing tougher, but doable and Threngar requiring a hybrid like nb/sin for the ranged phases). Since I'm bad at nb/sin (getting better), I run 61 Assassin on nearly every boss. So you saying it's "not viable" is not at all correct because it parses higher than MM even with disconnects. Plus you have nb/sin making Assassin not useless; tactician for phystact, as said above; Bladedancer for trash or Assdancer. And Ranger, as I said before, just because it's not raid viable doesn't mean it's useless, is useful for soloing stuff.

    Quote Originally Posted by Blakehavok View Post
    90% of raiders who are in their right mind Play MM
    This is wrong.... MM is not the top spec so only those not able to play melee play MM. Not sure what you think constitutes as "right mind", but I'd like to think "right mind" would be bringing their best to the raid and melee surpasses MM by a fair amount.
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  2. #362
    Rift Chaser fatbahmi's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artewig View Post

    I hate MM, I avoid it as much as I can. Since I'm bad at nb/sin (getting better), I run 61 Assassin on nearly every boss.
    same here. i dislike MM, but love sin.

  3. #363
    Rift Disciple Blakehavok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Artewig View Post
    Can't really comment on the other souls because I don't play them enough, but obviously you don't Rogue enough. I watched Seatin's video when he first posted it. I thought it was hilarious, but I fail to see how it can be called a "synopsis" of Primalist. The video was poking fun at the theme. Not the actual specs themselves. And I never said it having fewer points would mean there's more to learn, but rather that we don't know what is going to be done with those 31 points. We do know that it will be using a focus bar which will be interesting.

    I hate MM, I avoid it as much as I can (in fact, you can melee every single boss -- Izkinra with the breath making healing tougher, but doable and Threngar requiring a hybrid like nb/sin for the ranged phases). Since I'm bad at nb/sin (getting better), I run 61 Assassin on nearly every boss. So you saying it's "not viable" is not at all correct because it parses higher than MM even with disconnects. Plus you have nb/sin making Assassin not useless; tactician for phystact, as said above; Bladedancer for trash or Assdancer. And Ranger, as I said before, just because it's not raid viable doesn't mean it's useless, is useful for soloing stuff.



    This is wrong.... MM is not the top spec so only those not able to play melee play MM. Not sure what you think constitutes as "right mind", but I'd like to think "right mind" would be bringing their best to the raid and melee surpasses MM by a fair amount.

    MM has the most viability for raid because some fights just aren't set up for melee. That was the only thing you could say to me after I replied to you? Impressive. The point is that the new souls are designed to work right now. The souls I mentioned that people don't play haven't been touched in a very long time. 61 point viability is the main idea I'm trying to hammer home for people who just can't grasp my logic of why I feel it's absurd. 61 point viability means, can everyone do it? If all rogues in a raid were nb or sin could that be a viable thing or would it become taxing on the raid? I don't feel that's true for souls I mentioned for people in "their right mind".

  4. #364
    Plane Walker InflatablePanda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blakehavok View Post
    MM has the most viability for raid because some fights just aren't set up for melee. That was the only thing you could say to me after I replied to you? Impressive. The point is that the new souls are designed to work right now. The souls I mentioned that people don't play haven't been touched in a very long time. 61 point viability is the main idea I'm trying to hammer home for people who just can't grasp my logic of why I feel it's absurd. 61 point viability means, can everyone do it? If all rogues in a raid were nb or sin could that be a viable thing or would it become taxing on the raid? I don't feel that's true for souls I mentioned for people in "their right mind".
    This is an argument that comes up all the time, and i guess it's a flavour thing? I feel balancing souls on a 61 point basis will always lead to stale play because it takes the creativity out of the soul system. Yea some 61 points should be balanced to be used as 61, but not all should. Also creating flavours of the months honestly isn't always bad, it does force people into specifics constantly. But when that's forcing variety its not as bad as it sounds. I guess that is a lot of opinion rather than fact that i just stated, but i think it is reasonable.

    Also i can't remember the last time a rogue in coriolis used MM over a melee spec :/. Not even joking, crucia may come to mind? But majority of our rogues ran melee anyway. There is no current encounter that MM will beat out NB or NB/Sin.

    To stop derailing this thread though. In all honesty, people do this every time. Why make assumptions about anything? There is almost 0 information about how things are going to be. Let it release, give it at least a week. Really, really test it. Then give your 2 cents, it will then be valued. All of the QQ and dribble at the moment of 'What Primalist Will Be' is kind of silly.

  5. #365
    Ascendant ecru's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blakehavok View Post
    You said you it isn't necessary ~ but paid souls have some advantage over existing f2p souls..

    Oracles out dps bards
    i never get to play the top parsing oracle spec in raid but i'm not so sure this is true anymore. oracle is also a fair bit more complicated to play than bard, for what it's worth. the grass isn't always greener, even if it costs money.
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  6. #366
    Ascendant Artewig's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blakehavok View Post
    MM has the most viability for raid because some fights just aren't set up for melee. That was the only thing you could say to me after I replied to you? Impressive. The point is that the new souls are designed to work right now. The souls I mentioned that people don't play haven't been touched in a very long time. 61 point viability is the main idea I'm trying to hammer home for people who just can't grasp my logic of why I feel it's absurd. 61 point viability means, can everyone do it? If all rogues in a raid were nb or sin could that be a viable thing or would it become taxing on the raid? I don't feel that's true for souls I mentioned for people in "their right mind".
    Not sure what more you really wanted... I refuted all of your points. I guess maybe it's just a difference in opinion of the word "viable". If I can play the spec in a raid and be competitive dps wise, it's viable. The simple fact is that ranged will always be "more viable" (based on how the fight is set up) than melee because you can play ranged in melee range but not melee in ranged. And not sure what you even mean by "set up for melee" because, as I pointed out, there aren't really any fights where you can't play melee. And there are plenty of fights where all of the rogues should be in melee specs. Jinoscoth, triplets, Johan (If you stack), and Guurloth come to mind so I don't see how it would become "taxing on the raid". Not to mention it's beneficial to have a rogue in nb/sin or sin because of Lethal Poison.

    And so that I'm actually contributing to the real thread here (Because Pandehmic is right), people would be so much better off if they waited for information before assuming something about it. So.... Everyone take a break, play Rift, and go watch the livestream on Friday where they will actually give you information rather than creating your own. Sound like a good plan? Good.
    Last edited by Artewig; 08-10-2015 at 01:10 AM.
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  7. #367
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blakehavok View Post
    MM has the most viability for raid because some fights just aren't set up for melee. That was the only thing you could say to me after I replied to you? Impressive. The point is that the new souls are designed to work right now. The souls I mentioned that people don't play haven't been touched in a very long time. 61 point viability is the main idea I'm trying to hammer home for people who just can't grasp my logic of why I feel it's absurd. 61 point viability means, can everyone do it? If all rogues in a raid were nb or sin could that be a viable thing or would it become taxing on the raid? I don't feel that's true for souls I mentioned for people in "their right mind".
    Every single boss can be meleed and in fact thats what we do(nb/sin, 61nb), last time i used mm was HM crucia same for the rest of apo rogues and only because mele spots were limited to bm,lethal poison bot and another mele rogue.

    You clearly have no idea how things work or how to play a rogue, so stop with your bs posts.
    Last edited by N3okorrales; 08-10-2015 at 01:29 AM.

  8. #368
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    Quote Originally Posted by GenjuroK View Post
    That makes no sense whatsoever.
    I talked about this on my livestream last night but I don't think the raid coming in 3.4 is the Lord Arak raid. I think that will be in 3.5. But I could be wrong.
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  9. #369
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    How about instead of introducing new things, you fix what is broken first? Primalist sounds great but let's fix Crifts, which have been out for 3 weeks now.

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  10. #370
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mirt View Post
    How about instead of introducing new things, you fix what is broken first? Primalist sounds great but let's fix Crifts, which have been out for 3 weeks now.
    I've always got a chuckle out of posts like these...they need to continue adding new things to keep players interested, while doing so, they work on fixing old things, it's why in large updates, we also have hotfixes...we even have them inbetween releases of major updates

  11. #371
    Rift Disciple Aksinan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    No, they were picked for theme. The details of how they play are completely different, that's not dictated by elements. Without information you can guess anything, wait and play them during the test. Then if they aren't to your liking you know based on actual information.

    For the record I appreciated the video.
    I'm affraid you missunderstood me! I wasn't talking about how the gameplay would feel or how the skills would work!! I am sure that it will play NOTHING like stormcaller. But at the same time! Why choose the same thing? Water/air aoe spec!

    It's like if you brought out a new warrior melee build that focuses on Fast attacks infused with firey magic! With some cleave and good Single target!

  12. #372
    Plane Touched Mirt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darcnova View Post
    I've always got a chuckle out of posts like these...they need to continue adding new things to keep players interested, while doing so, they work on fixing old things, it's why in large updates, we also have hotfixes...we even have them inbetween releases of major updates
    Yes because they are so good at fixing all old problems. There are zone events from STorm Legion that still don't work right. Of course new things need to be released and of course they fix things as they go along. That's kind of implied. However, having things that are 2-3 years old or things that are touted as being this awesome new thing to the game (Crifts for example), going weeks or years without being fixed is just crud.

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  13. #373
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aksinan View Post
    I'm affraid you missunderstood me! I wasn't talking about how the gameplay would feel or how the skills would work!! I am sure that it will play NOTHING like stormcaller. But at the same time! Why choose the same thing? Water/air aoe spec!

    It's like if you brought out a new warrior melee build that focuses on Fast attacks infused with firey magic! With some cleave and good Single target!
    That doesn't sound like Riftblade at all!
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  14. #374
    Prophet of Telara Valfador's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lethaemis View Post
    That doesn't sound like Riftblade at all!
    You mean it sounds completely like Nightblade
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  15. #375
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    lol, so not only do we have to pay for a calling with half-baked souls, we have to pay for a calling that doesnt even have as many souls as the rest? and then we need to pay again for the rest of the calling later? everything trion is doing lately has been a massive money grab. not sure if anyone has thought about this, but:

    1) Veteran players who already have fully geared toons will mostly be opposed to paying *TWICE* for a new calling that they must spend weeks/months gearing up.

    2) New players who already have accessibility to 4 callings that can play every role will be less inclined to pay for another calling that isn't even finished.

    Of course, collectors and people who are careless with their money will still throw their money at Trion at a moment's notice, but I'm not falling for it, and don't think anyone else should. Trion has lost their creative capacity.

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