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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Trion, are you going to put a limit with rex prices ?

  1. #166
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malificarr View Post
    I don't see the issue. If you're that desperate for some cash shop credit just spend some, you know, actual cash like the rest of us do.
    Why would I do that if I can get trion to cap rex price to 800p or something

  2. #167
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malificarr View Post
    I don't see the issue. If you're that desperate for some cash shop credit just spend some, you know, actual cash like the rest of us do.
    i dont see the issue here, if you're that desperate for plat, just farm some, you know, like the rest of us do.
    Last edited by fatbahmi; 07-07-2015 at 02:22 PM.

  3. #168
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    Quote Originally Posted by fatbahmi View Post
    i dont see the issue here, if you're that desperate for plat, just farm some, you know, like the rest of us do.
    I'm not desperate for plat at all, I can farm all I want in game like any other player. If I get lazy I might consider selling a Rex if I feel the price is good. How's that farming for cash shop credits working out for you?

    Oh wait, you can't. Because it's a cash shop and someone has to spend actual money so Trion Worlds can actually, you know, have a monetary income.

  4. #169
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    Trion can only limit the prices they sell rex for, what the user does is up to them.

    Are people here not familiar with how supply and demand works in a free economy?

  5. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by AsdMike View Post
    There are several reasons why REX prices are high and will continue to rise:

    1) In game currency generation has no limit, only the amount of time it takes to get plat via quests or vendor selling items found in game or killing monsters. (people can also have more characters to get more plat to circumvent daily limit).

    2) Inadequate/wrong gold sinks: all the gold sinks are in crafting materials from the vendor and ah fees. Anything that would be traditionally a good gold sink in an MMO (ie mounts, pets ect) are all easier or exclusively bought with credits. This increases demand for REX and does not take plat out of the economy. I doubt Trion will ever change this as credits are tied to their revenue stream.

    3) Buy Orders skew prices upward since everyone can see the top offer. People will always want to get more than the top offer seen in the AH, thus inflating the price of REX. Also accounting for the ah fee the buyer pays for placing the buy orders also inflates the price of REX further. I would disable this feature of the game just for REX as it is severely messing with free market prices. There will always be fluctuations on the price of items based on time of year or promotions, but one year ago was paying 800p for REX and now its almost doubled since then.

    4) Annoying REX re-sellers. I have noticed more of these players than there was in the past. These guys are not only annoying in chat, but they buy up all the cheap REX and resell them just to make plat. There is one guy in particular who literally sits on Faeblight all day/night long in his robot mount spazzing around in circles just spamming chat on all shards. These guys make it really hard to get a fair price for REX and you probably end up buying from them at the inflated price. Make no mistake these guys inflate REX prices directly. It would be nice if someone sold a REX it was auto consumed or something, we got to get rid of these dirty re-sellers.

    5) Bots: bots are online nearly all hours of the day farming instances or mobs. I see them everyday, and its not hard to find them if you look for 5 minutes. I am not really sure how much plat they generate from killing things or running instances, but the shear number and hours they run can surely add up. They generate plat this way which causes inflation. I know Trion does ban bots, but they keep popping up with new names. Im thinking that these guys should be banned before they hit lvl 50 so they cant really farm anything worth much. Just the other day i seen some guy in foul cascade with 4 other characters...all warriors running Foul cascade for 12+ hours straight. They were on the leader boards for high mob kills. And they kept doing it for days, so obvious botting.

    RIFT is such a great game. But I feel like its a ship without a captain. Sooner or later we will run ashore. I am here till the end, maybe someone will grab the helm before then...
    you say it is not hard to spot a bot. how? i haven't seen anyone that i could actually say with any proof or assurance that they were botting. as for resellers ( those who buy from original buyers to resell) not only do i not know who they are, but i really don't care. they don't affect my game. neither do botters. if they were taking something from me, like mats (sorry mats are everywhere - not in one little spot) or kills (no one has done any steal killing that i can see) or preventing me from selling ( i always find buyers for anything i choose to sell if the market is there) then i really don't care how other people play the game.

    to me, it is their game too, and i refuse to take part in telling them what they can or can't do since i don't consider myself the game police, the ah police or the chat police. i am a player and all i want is for no one to ever interfere in how i play the game. since i don't want any interference, i won't give any.

    to me, it is my game. whether i pay or not, it is my business. how i play, when i play and what i do when i play harms no one, interferes with no one's game, and is only my business.

    if you insist on playing my game for me, ruling it, telling me what i can and can not do and for how much, then maybe you and whoever else wants to play tyrant should pay my sub. then you might- maybe- in some sort of twisted dream - have some say in my game.

    bottom line is, i don't have control issues. but i also am my own person. i don't allow anyone with an overly inflated ego and need to control others to affect or control me.
    Last edited by selyn; 07-07-2015 at 03:41 PM.
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  6. #171
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malificarr View Post
    I don't see the issue. If you're that desperate for some cash shop credit just spend some, you know, actual cash like the rest of us do.
    unfortunately these are people who would rather spend time complaining about how someone else plays a game than go farm such things themselves. and because they don't want to earn anything themselves or buy anything themselves, they come to the forums and call other people names and show their small minded jealousy and envy.
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  7. #172
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chadwix View Post
    Trion can only limit the prices they sell rex for, what the user does is up to them.

    Are people here not familiar with how supply and demand works in a free economy?
    lol if they accepted that, they would have to accept that they can't and shouldn't control other people playing the game. they would rather sit in their huts and call the shots and control how much you sell your rex for
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  8. #173
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    I am not sure why all the extreme arguments - they achieve nothing. Think of the market this way.

    1) Group A - REX buyers - driven by a demand for loyalty & store items and/or plat in game.
    2) Group B - want to buy REX for patron, goodies etc (generally people who like to be pure FTP)
    3) Group C - market speculators mostly in the REX market to re-sell (buy low sell high).

    Group C does not make Trion any real money in the long run, they buy and sell REX for in game plat only, perhaps using the odd couple for patron or whatever.

    Groups A & B are what drive REX demand for real money purchases.

    Therefore if REX can only be resold once by the real money purchaser it only eliminates Group C which don't make Trion any money (in the long run) anyway. Trion does not lose in this scenario. REX prices would reflect the actual current demand and supply as opposed to artifical speculative demand/supply.

    The arguments to allow REX re-selling ad infinitum are similar to those made about real world markets - i.e. they bring additional liquidity to the market. Along with that liquidity comes speculative buying/selling, market manipulation etc.

    It's up to Trion if they see infinite re-selling as a problem. Right now my REX purchases have sllowed to a trickle*, and I am a Group B player (100k or so into orange loyalty on strictly plat-REX transactions, no re-sells). If prices were lower I would be buying more which means Trion selling more for USD. IF prices drop below 1,500pp I will be buying more frequently.

    It really is that simple.

    * I used to buy about 2 a week, and now I am down to one every two weeks or so.
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  9. #174
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    Quote Originally Posted by Linolea View Post
    I am not sure why all the extreme arguments - they achieve nothing. Think of the market this way.

    1) Group A - REX buyers - driven by a demand for loyalty & store items and/or plat in game.
    2) Group B - want to buy REX for patron, goodies etc (generally people who like to be pure FTP)
    3) Group C - market speculators mostly in the REX market to re-sell (buy low sell high).

    Group C does not make Trion any real money in the long run, they buy and sell REX for in game plat only, perhaps using the odd couple for patron or whatever.

    Groups A & B are what drive REX demand for real money purchases.

    Therefore if REX can only be resold once by the real money purchaser it only eliminates Group C which don't make Trion any money (in the long run) anyway. Trion does not lose in this scenario. REX prices would reflect the actual current demand and supply as opposed to artifical speculative demand/supply.

    The arguments to allow REX re-selling ad infinitum are similar to those made about real world markets - i.e. they bring additional liquidity to the market. Along with that liquidity comes speculative buying/selling, market manipulation etc.

    It's up to Trion if they see infinite re-selling as a problem. Right now my REX purchases have sllowed to a trickle*, and I am a Group B player (100k or so into orange loyalty on strictly plat-REX transactions, no re-sells). If prices were lower I would be buying more which means Trion selling more for USD. IF prices drop below 1,500pp I will be buying more frequently.

    It really is that simple.

    * I used to buy about 2 a week, and now I am down to one every two weeks or so.
    your logic would be ok except that you want trion to spend quite a bit of money reprogramming the rex to only be useful to a limited amount of people - the original buyer, and then the first person who gets it from the original buyer,

    first of all, that is asking a lot. they would essentially have to rewrite the programming for the rex - leaving it open to a lot of bugs. as we all know, when you try to fix something in games you end up breaking it.

    second you are demanding that whoever buys the rex from the seller should be the only one to consume it. they wouldn't be able to hand it off to another account they own, or their child's account, or anyone they might be buying it for. so you are assuming a lot here.

    not everyone who passes a rex on is reselling it a second time. and actually, if they are reselling it after buying it from the original seller, who do they really hurt? do you really think the rex would not go up in the natural course of things because of supply and demand?

    yeah the game is a fantasy world, but those who want to control how other people use a product are way out in far far away fantasy land. again it boils down to this.

    in your everyday life, would you be happy if someone told you how you could live, what you could do, and how much you could sell something for?

    suppose you had something you bought and decided you didn't want it. suppose you paid $10 for it. so you put it on ebay for $15. and then the store you bought it from came over and told you to lower your price because only they could decide how much you could sell it for? how happy would that make you?

    you forget that you are dealing with real people who paid real money for something. if they sell it then they want the best value possible for their real money. if someone else resells it, they really don't care because they got what they felt was fair for them.

    you people need to learn to chill. live and let live. stop trying to control every aspect of someone else's life. you don't have the right to impose your values or choices on other people. you only have the right to control one thing- how you live your life. what choices you make. how you play your game. you don't get to decide how other people play their game. what choices they make, or how they live their lives.

    if you don't like how high someone sells something. don't buy it. if you don't like how they play, don't play with them. but don't begrudge them their pursuit of happiness. they have a right to do whatever they want- just as you do. you would not want to be controlled. try treating others the way you want to be treated for a change


    edit: actually your logic is flawed. if you are assuming that the people who buy rex from the people who sell it are the only ones driving the market for buying rex from trion, then you can't simply discount group c. they also drive the buying. after all, if they are buying my rex as fast as i can buy it from trion, then trion should be quite happy. the only money trion actually gets is from me, the first seller.

    when i buy my rex, trion gets paid for it. you or anyone else can spend it, but trion isn't making any money off you. they only made it off me. it doesn't matter how many times the rex changes hands, the only money ever paid for it is that $10 i spent. you spending it in the marketplace doesn't give trion more money. so it should be no skin off their backs how many times it changes hands. it all comes out the same in the end.
    Last edited by selyn; 07-07-2015 at 08:24 PM.
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  10. #175
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    there is a dev who said they are watching this thread. i hope they are. the day a game decides to control what i do with something i buy from them, like how much i can sell my rex for, that is the day i move my sub to another game. hopefully trion values the players who actually pay them money way more than that.
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  11. #176
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    IMO Trion will be extremely foolish to cap the value on rex.

    1. This will obviously reduce the amount of players who purchase Rex. As I mentioned before only reason that a player buy rex directly with cash via rift store, instead of buying credit directly is to exchange rex for goods or plat in-game as purchasing credit directly grants bonus credit and (bonus loyalty).
    eg. 2x $5 credit pack = 1500 credit/6000 loyalty vs 1 rex $10 = 1250 credit/5000 loyalty.
    or 1x $100 credit pack = 18500 credit/74000 loyalty vs 10 rex $100 = 12500 credit/50000 loyalty.
    Purchasing rex with cash is the worst way possible to get credit/loyalty vs dollar spent.

    2. Sure rex plat value will be reduced (forcefully by Trion) but this will also resulting in less rex available. Rex will then be used to purchase ingame goods then the seller has to re-sell the ingame goods for plat in order to get their deserved rex "value" which also creates hassle of having to resell the ingame goods which again discourage cash buyers to purchase rex resulting in yet again less rex available.

    3. Most cash rex purchasers are new players who's in dire need of plat to advance their characters (think of it as a catch up by cash mechanics or to reduce grind which is quite typical in f2p games), which when Trion forcefully reduce the value of rex can result in yet again less rex purchases, and newer players feeling like the cost to play "catch up" might be too high, they are either forced to grind extra or simply leave the game resulting in loss of new player population and yet again reduced availability of Rex.

    edit: Also 4. Players wil simply buy credit packs (at as mentioned discounted price) and be ingame gifters to make their plats... this will **** over all pure f2p people that buy rex with plat to gain not only the credit but also the LOYALTY. Especially when buying rex with cash is further punished by Trion, full f2p people will now really have a hard time getting loyalty when everyone is a gifter only ones dumb enough would slap themselves by purchasing rex with cash which is double punished by Trion (lower return on purchase, and forced lower plat value imposed by Trion).

    tl;dr
    Trion obviously lose money (or make less money) while F2P players not necessary able to covert their plat to Rex at lower cost (since people would try to trade their rex for say 2500 plat worth of mats than 800 plat straight up)... and since the amount of rex is reduced so much that people will probably start to sell their rex for 3000+ plat worth of ingame goods (unless they want to get ripped off by the enforced all time low plat value of their rex).

    Why would Trion tell their cash paying rex buyers to go w/e themselves while reducing their own revenue?

    But who knows Trion might do just that... lol
    Last edited by FateStayNight; 07-07-2015 at 08:54 PM.

  12. #177
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    Quote Originally Posted by FateStayNight View Post
    IMO Trion will be extremely foolish to cap the value on rex.

    1. This will obviously reduce the amount of players who purchase Rex. As I mentioned before only reason that a player buy rex directly with cash via rift store, instead of buying credit directly is to exchange rex for goods or plat in-game as purchasing credit directly grants bonus credit and (bonus loyalty).
    eg. 2x $5 credit pack = 1500 credit/6000 loyalty vs 1 rex $10 = 1250 credit/5000 loyalty.
    or 1x $100 credit pack = 18500 credit/74000 loyalty vs 10 rex $100 = 12500 credit/50000 loyalty.
    Purchasing rex with cash is the worst way possible to get credit/loyalty vs dollar spent.

    2. Sure rex plat value will be reduced (forcefully by Trion) but this will also resulting in less rex available. Rex will then be used to purchase ingame goods then the seller has to re-sell the ingame goods for plat in order to get their deserved rex "value" which also creates hassle of having to resell the ingame goods which again discourage cash buyers to purchase rex resulting in yet again less rex available.

    3. Most cash rex purchasers are new players who's in dire need of plat to advance their characters (think of it as a catch up by cash mechanics or to reduce grind which is quite typical in f2p games), which when Trion forcefully reduce the value of rex can result in yet again less rex purchases, and newer players feeling like the cost to play "catch up" might be too high, they are either forced to grind extra or simply leave the game resulting in loss of new player population and yet again reduced availability of Rex.

    edit: Also 4. Players wil simply buy credit packs (at as mentioned discounted price) and be ingame gifters to make their plats... this will **** over all pure f2p people that buy rex with plat to gain not only the credit but also the LOYALTY. Especially when buying rex with cash is further punished by Trion, full f2p people will now really have a hard time getting loyalty when everyone is a gifter only ones dumb enough would slap themselves by purchasing rex with cash which is double punished by Trion (lower return on purchase, and forced lower plat value imposed by Trion).

    tl;dr
    Trion obviously lose money (or make less money) while F2P players not necessary able to covert their plat to Rex at lower cost (since people would try to trade their rex for say 2500 plat worth of mats than 800 plat straight up)... and since the amount of rex is reduced so much that people will probably start to sell their rex for 3000+ plat worth of ingame goods (unless they want to get ripped off by the enforced all time low plat value of their rex).

    Why would Trion tell their cash paying rex buyers to go w/e themselves while reducing their own revenue?

    But who knows Trion might do just that... lol
    well, if they do try such tactics on us, it won't be the first time a game shot themselves in the foot while trying to appease people who don't pay them anything at all - not even in the marketplace transactions. but i think they would find themselves quite quickly with a major loss of revenue and maybe even a loss of customers.

    people are not really stupid you know. there are always a few who will hang on now matter how much a company seems to despise them. but most people will get the hint when the paying customer is put last behind the demands of a non-paying customer and they will decide that their business is not needed or wanted. when they decide that, then they go looking for someone who really wants their business.

    hopefully trion is too smart to put their paying customers last. but we will see.
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  13. #178
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    I would reply at length Selyn, but your ramble failed the first logic test. Quite a bit of effort? This is no more effort than programming any other item to be BoP.

    Notice how Trion implemented the Strands of Draum right-clicky thing with relative ease? I am sure what I am suggesting is no more difficult. They don't need to know who is involved, but the minute the REX changes hands once it is BoA. Couldn't be bothered to read the rest of your diatribe - probably as illogical as your opening two paragraphs.

    I never advocated a position either ... I was merely stating an option that would remove resellers that add no profit to Trion. Resellers with no intention to consume the REX only provide a temporary surge in profit for Trion. When they try to force prices up (the only logical thing to do as a reseller - buy low, sell high) then genuine buyers slow their purchases, drying up Trion's profits.

    If you don't understand that, then try an Econ 101 course. I have taught plenty, and beyond. I have more than a vague idea of how markets work.
    Last edited by Linolea; 07-07-2015 at 10:21 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by selyn View Post
    y

    first of all, that is asking a lot. they would essentially have to rewrite the programming for the rex - leaving it open to a lot of bugs. as we all know, when you try to fix something in games you end up breaking it.

    second you are demanding that whoever buys the rex from the seller should be the only one to consume it. they wouldn't be able to hand it off to another account they own, or their child's account, or anyone they might be buying it for. so you are assuming a lot here.
    bahhh bad excuses, trion has a great people working in this game people with skills to do that right to change it

    our logic would be ok except that you want trion to spend quite a bit of money reprogramming the rex to only be useful to a limited amount of people - the original buyer, and then the first person who gets it from the original buyer,
    f you insist on playing my game for me, ruling it, telling me what i can and can not do and for how much, then maybe you and whoever else wants to play tyrant should pay my sub. then you might- maybe- in some sort of twisted dream - have some say in my game.
    you are telling you dont want no body controlls you...and you are controlling me when you resell and resell a rex. you are controlling how many hours i have to farm (more every day) to buy a rex because you, who dont even spending real money on rex, just virtual money, are rellesing them and making them more expensive so you rule the market doing that, you decide rex prices..it makes sense people who buy them with real money do that but you...who just speculates with them? no sense at all

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    Quote Originally Posted by psonic View Post
    bahhh bad excuses, trion has a great people working in this game people with skills to do that right to change it





    you are telling you dont want no body controlls you...and you are controlling me when you resell and resell a rex. you are controlling how many hours i have to farm (more every day) to buy a rex because you, who dont even spending real money on rex, just virtual money, are rellesing them and making them more expensive so you rule the market doing that, you decide rex prices..it makes sense people who buy them with real money do that but you...who just speculates with them? no sense at all
    I don't see how this concept is so hard to grasp for anyone with average int...

    If you don't like selyn's rex price, dont buy it from him/her. Find someone else who's willing to sell you their rex for 500p a piece or w/e you willing to pay. Problem solved. What's your problem? why you insist on purchasing rex from selyn then complain about her charging too much yet YOU refuse to buy from anyone else but her?

    Again like you said Trion isn't stupid, they are intelligent people, this is why rex price will not be capped for aforementioned reasons.
    Last edited by FateStayNight; 07-07-2015 at 10:32 PM.

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