+ Reply to Thread
Page 6 of 7 FirstFirst ... 2 3 4 5 6 7 LastLast
Results 76 to 90 of 99
Like Tree83Likes

Thread: Trion, you have cut back too far ! Its TOO MUCH !

  1. #76
    Sword of Telara
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    804

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Seranov View Post
    Good times, good times.
    Yup I miss Shadowbane.
    Asharak@zaviel: 60 Rogue
    Ashorath@zaviel: 60 Warrior
    Pinestone@zaviel: 60 Cleric

  2. #77
    Sword of Telara
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    804

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Credo View Post
    You forgot poor ol' Warhammer! It's okay, I'm sure it was repressed!
    Oh cr** yeah I forgot WH:O, and funnily enough it was what I was playing for years before I came back to play here lol.
    Asharak@zaviel: 60 Rogue
    Ashorath@zaviel: 60 Warrior
    Pinestone@zaviel: 60 Cleric

  3. #78
    Sword of Telara
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    804

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Galibier View Post
    You mentioned games for tweens (clone war..legoland...free realms). Games that never left beta status and launched at all....family guy... an on line racing game (motor city) a text based MMO (legends of future past).... I could go on....are you trying to be sarcastic or do not understand that you need to make apples to apples comparisons? So let me rephrase...how many AAA sub based MMOs that transitioned to f2p.
    They are and were all mmo's regardless of your preferences, they all closed down fully, at least half a dozen of them were big name mmo's at the time they were out (swg, matrix, tabula rasa, shadowbane AC2, LoM2), they were ALL released, some for not very long others like SWG and Matrix for years. I also forgot to list Warhammer Online, that WAS a AAA mmo that got canned after years online. That is what you asked, that is what I replied, nothing more nothing less, you didn't specify F2P, just MMO.
    Last edited by Asharoth; 05-28-2014 at 12:09 AM.
    Asharak@zaviel: 60 Rogue
    Ashorath@zaviel: 60 Warrior
    Pinestone@zaviel: 60 Cleric

  4. #79
    Ascendant Galibier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    10,460

    Default

    You can't compare different sub genres, with different production values and different financial models. What you are doing in masking a strawman argument with an apples v orange comparison. Sorry I though people would compare Ferraris to Ferraris...not bring in a Fiero because it is red, small and sounds Italian. I will not give credit for logic in the future.

    Yes Warhammer counts...I will grant you that. The two games I was think of were that and SWG...SWG really doesn't count though because it closed due to Lucas Arts not renewing the license so EA could launch SWToR. Heck even Vanguard... which was basically a failure since launch (sold around 200k units...had like 40k players by the end of the first year) has lasted 7 years (finally being shut down this year in July.). So in the end you have War hammer....that is about it.

    Add to this that right now Rift is the ONLY revenue stream for Trion. Archeage is NOT going to replace it. AA is basically a 21st century version on Lineage. Once PvE and End Game players (which is really what rift caters to) and people get over the shiny factor and "oooh gliders!!" It will be fighting for the same open world PvP players that Aion, Tera, GW2 etc are wrestling over. It is really not a competitor for Rift. Also Archeage is NOT a Trion Worlds game. All they are doing is publishing it. This means most of the money someone pays for Archeage will be going across the Pacific.

    Because of these dynamics...if Rift closes its doors before say 2017-2018...it will be because Trion closed it's doors. I do not say THIS is impossible. But so long as Trion survives Rift will survive...until they come up with their OWN in house developed and published successor. I say this because there is no way that they can possibly meet the contracted ROIs of their equity investors publishing someone else's games. The margins are just too tight there.
    Last edited by Galibier; 05-28-2014 at 12:31 AM.
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

  5. #80
    Sword of Telara
    Join Date
    Sep 2013
    Posts
    804

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Galibier View Post
    You can't compare different sub genres, with different production values and different financial models. What you are doing in masking a strawman argument with an apples v orange comparison. Sorry I though people would compare Ferraris to Ferraris...not bring in a Fiero because it is red, small and sounds Italian. I will not give credit for logic in the future.

    Yes Warhammer counts...I will grant you that. The two games I was think of were that and SWG...SWG really doesn't count though because it closed due to Lucas Arts not renewing the license so EA could launch SWToR. Heck even Vanguard... which was basically a failure since launch (sold around 200k units...had like 40k players by the end of the first year) has lasted 7 years (finally being shut down this year in July.). So in the end you have War hammer....that is about it.

    Add to this that right now Rift is the ONLY revenue stream for Trion. Archeage is NOT going to replace it. AA is basically a 21st century version on Lineage. Once PvE and End Game players (which is really what rift caters to) and people get over the shiny factor and "oooh gliders!!" It will be fighting for the same open world PvP players that Aion, Tera, GW2 etc are wrestling over. It is really not a competitor for Rift. Also Archeage is NOT a Trion Worlds game. All they are doing is publishing it. This means most of the money someone pays for Archeage will be going across the Pacific.

    Because of these dynamics...if Rift closes its doors before say 2017-2018...it will be because Trion closed it's doors. I do not say THIS is impossible. But so long as Trion survives Rift will survive...until they come up with their OWN in house developed and published successor. I say this because there is no way that they can possibly meet the contracted ROIs of their equity investors publishing someone else's games. The margins are just too tight there.
    Again, it is you with the straw man argument here, trying to add parameters that weren't there in the first place.

    You asked if we remembered the last time an MMO shut down it's servers.

    You made no request for AAA, you made no request for F2P, you made no request for specific genres, you made no request for comparisons.

    I answered your question plainly and factually end of story, I listed the mmo's that I remember shutting down, end of story, it's not my fault you forgot to specify the parameters.
    Last edited by Asharoth; 05-28-2014 at 01:15 AM.
    Asharak@zaviel: 60 Rogue
    Ashorath@zaviel: 60 Warrior
    Pinestone@zaviel: 60 Cleric

  6. #81
    Ascendant
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    1,671

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Galibier View Post

    Add to this that right now Rift is the ONLY revenue stream for Trion. .
    *cough* Defiance *cough*
    Quote Originally Posted by Frailaq View Post

    tl;dr - Trion should do this: Melee = Turret Ranged > Mobile Ranged

  7. #82
    Ascendant Galibier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    10,460

    Default

    Please see the Ferrari vs Ferrari comment.

    Some of us when making arguments assume that people will apply common sense and make apples to apples comparisons.
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

  8. #83
    Ascendant Galibier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    10,460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Gruntled View Post
    *cough* Defiance *cough*
    Defiance is a money pit. Right now it is basically funding it's own existence. Don't get me wrong...it definitely has potential and does some things I see as genuinely new but at launch it had issues across all platforms that caused a lot of angst and lost players. Console players (the bulk of the player base) are not as accustomed to spending money once on line as PC players (an experience that SOE also discovered with DCUO) which further tightens revenue. If the game had a smoother launch I would say it would have had the chance to be moderately profitable BUT the push to have it launch with the TV show meant it was launched too early. Even today they have major server stability issues. During arkfalls people are getting critted out all the time. I am not BSing that it is so bad that people will say (honestly NOT sarcastically) "last night I only got critted out twice but the lag was horrible. That's better than getting critter out every 10-15 minutes so all they have to do is work on the lag. Trust me things are NOT going well with Defiance...which makes me sad because I see A LOT of untapped potential there but the ongoing technical issues chase away far more players than the game attracts.


    So when you look at games that are actually supporting the development of other projects it's really Rift. Defiance is VERY focused on it's revenue getting it's own house in order. If you think Rift has stability issues...go see Defiance....oi.
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

  9. #84
    Prophet of Telara MisterWibble's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2011
    Posts
    1,109

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Galibier View Post
    So when you look at games that are actually supporting the development of other projects it's really Rift.
    Unless it's not, and other projects are actually funded through different means. I've not seen anything claiming either.

  10. #85
    Ascendant Galibier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    10,460

    Default

    I keep track of stuff like this through venture beat and the like. Rift being a Private company raises investment, outside profit, via venture capital investment such Series A, B and C etc. I have not been able to find any such investment since their last report of 85 million at the beginning of 2012 in a series D round.

    Now as a private companies they do not have to give public earnings reports BUT due to tax and other issues they do have to announce these. Add this to the fact that Defiance's separate office was closed and that this is also where the bulk of the 2013 layoffs occurred... are all very good indications of what is going on inside.
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

  11. #86
    Champion
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    554

    Default jelouse?

    Quote Originally Posted by Seranov View Post
    You're not in Norrath anymore. Paying for months-behind equipment is a valid way to catch up to the current tier. Being jealous of people who have better gear than you, regardless of how they got it, is on you.

    They're just shiny pixels. If you are feeling pride based on how shiny your pixels are, you probably need to reconsider exactly what's important to you.
    im not jelouse ur an idiot if u think that
    i just think a person should earn what they
    sure i could use my CC also
    but id rahter learn as i go on so i know what to do raids ect ect to me paying for ger is taken easy way out

  12. #87
    Prophet of Telara Seranov's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    1,045

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by samfluffy View Post
    im not jelouse ur an idiot if u think that
    i just think a person should earn what they
    sure i could use my CC also
    but id rahter learn as i go on so i know what to do raids ect ect to me paying for ger is taken easy way out
    It's not an "easy way out" because having the gear isn't the end goal. It's like saying "I WON'T USE THIS PEN, I'LL CONTINUE TO USE AN INKWELL AND A QUILL, BECAUSE PENS ARE THE EASY WAY OUT." You still need to put in just as much time learning mechanics, rotations and other important things that are actually the bulk of raiding. Gear is just a tool you use to get stuff done. You don't need to earn it the hard way (not that gathering it through raiding is particularly hard, just time consuming) in order to be able to use it well.
    Seranii@Greybriar - 60 Eth Warrior
    | SL: 11/12 T2, 5/8 T3 | NT: X/X T1 |
    < Dirty Casual until 3.0 >
    "One day you'll hang your head as you realize,
    You've heard it all but didn't listen to a word."

  13. #88
    Ascendant Galibier's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    10,460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by samfluffy View Post
    im not jelouse ur an idiot if u think that
    i just think a person should earn what they
    sure i could use my CC also
    but id rahter learn as i go on so i know what to do raids ect ect to me paying for ger is taken easy way out
    And if you read all of Sera's posts he has only ever earned his gear too.

    The point he is making is perspective. There is a difference between Telara and Norrath. In Norrath...new dungeon tier was introduced with new raid tier...not so in Telara. How often do you find guilds starting in tier 1? How often are PUGS not asking for "link achieve" on an FT/EE run.

    This indeed is not Norrath. hell the last time I visited Norrath I was given the option of creating a new character that was automatically max level with 250 PA... if I paid them money. Norrath isn't even Norrath anymore. Sad but it something we either deal with or walk away from.
    Far better is it to dare mighty things, to win glorius triumphs, even though checkered by failure... than to rank with those poor spirits who neither enjoy nor suffer much, because they live in a gray twilight that knows not victory nor defeat.

  14. #89
    Prophet of Telara Haruchai's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    Posts
    1,061

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Seranov View Post
    It's not an "easy way out" because having the gear isn't the end goal. It's like saying "I WON'T USE THIS PEN, I'LL CONTINUE TO USE AN INKWELL AND A QUILL, BECAUSE PENS ARE THE EASY WAY OUT." You still need to put in just as much time learning mechanics, rotations and other important things that are actually the bulk of raiding. Gear is just a tool you use to get stuff done. You don't need to earn it the hard way (not that gathering it through raiding is particularly hard, just time consuming) in order to be able to use it well.
    Not really a good analogy, you have to learn to read/write before you can use either. I think most of us have had to put up with people that have purchased the gear to get into raiding and they suck at everything. But on the flip side I have seen peeps that earn their gear and still suck, experience shows me that people that have earned the marks to buy the gear are generally better. That's just common sense as very few individuals are born with an innate knowledge of how to play classes in Rift. At this point in time this is the way Rift is. My opinion is, it's not the gear that matters, it's the player. If people are silly enough to buy their gear with cash then Trion has more bucks to make Rift better.

  15. #90
    Prophet of Telara Seranov's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2013
    Posts
    1,045

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Haruchai View Post
    Not really a good analogy, you have to learn to read/write before you can use either. I think most of us have had to put up with people that have purchased the gear to get into raiding and they suck at everything. But on the flip side I have seen peeps that earn their gear and still suck, experience shows me that people that have earned the marks to buy the gear are generally better. That's just common sense as very few individuals are born with an innate knowledge of how to play classes in Rift. At this point in time this is the way Rift is. My opinion is, it's not the gear that matters, it's the player. If people are silly enough to buy their gear with cash then Trion has more bucks to make Rift better.
    I'm not disagreeing that people who buy gear aren't generally as skilled as those who haven't, but it's just that: a generalization. I can't give a hard and fast "no, you bought gear, you're bad" because it's just not true for everyone. I'd sooner give everybody a chance than tell them to **** off, but if no one gives them a chance, that's a pool of players that guilds like mine can't pull from.

    The fact of the matter is this: It really doesn't matter where the hell you got your gear, as long as you can play well. As long as you can bring a reasonable level of competence, I don't care if you cashed in your life insurance to afford a full suit of T2. My shiny pixels are in no way cheapened by someone else's shiny pixels.
    Seranii@Greybriar - 60 Eth Warrior
    | SL: 11/12 T2, 5/8 T3 | NT: X/X T1 |
    < Dirty Casual until 3.0 >
    "One day you'll hang your head as you realize,
    You've heard it all but didn't listen to a word."

+ Reply to Thread
Page 6 of 7 FirstFirst ... 2 3 4 5 6 7 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts