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Thread: Insta-Level.

  1. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cheza View Post
    I still don't understand why people would want to turn a fantasy mmorpg (in Rift's case what is left of it) into Counterstrike, that game already exists...
    I don't get why you're playing a game for mindless grind (every MMO's leveling process) instead of the fun gated content (raids, experts, messing around with builds, CQ, warfronts with full skill access).

    But hey, to each their own. You like make-believe. I like playing a game because as a game, not a second job.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seshatar View Post
    The only thing I would accept is that once you max-leveled a class (e. g. cleric) you can create more instant level 60 clerics. But thats the only option which would be ok for me.
    Are you telling me that a vast majority of gamers have over 300+ dollars to spend on raid gear?

    Please tell me these players. Please. I would like to see multiple examples of these types of players that haven't already sunk hundreds of hours into this game.

    Quote Originally Posted by The Real Viz Shady View Post
    We actually had this in DAoC. If you had a max level you could /level other characters on your account. What happened was it killed the game for new people. They had no one to group with, no interaction and no guidance. I think it's the last bone a game will throw their player base. It's almost an admission by Trion that they are just not getting new players, so they'll do what they can to keep the ones they have.
    What part of Rift requires groups at early levels? What part of this game supports actual group interactions at low levels? Why would lower level players seek guidance from other low level players instead of finding level 60s?

    This doesn't make sense at all. Rift's basically a solo game at lvls 1-50. There's very few quests that require an actual group, outside of dungeons and the very rare group quests.

    There's minimal interactions at lower levels as-is in the overworld at low levels for a newbie because of how the game is designed. There's no reason to preserve something outdated such as that when the only thing keeping lower levels alive in the first place was the necessity of level grinding a new character and old world zone events. In fact, the better approach would be making it even faster for new players to level to 50 while making the old zones relevant outside of level grinds, such as putting in new rewards to obtain by actually working together. That would actually increase interaction, not this forced grind.

    Guidance? Why would a low level really ask another low level for guidance in "person"? If they needed guidance, they have the global chat channels. They have guilds they can join.. They have the forums. Heck, they can even join the level 60, cross raids,a nd cross events chat and ask people. Sure, there's the usual ****s, but they'll get some kind person helping them. And none of this needs to be done with the players actually being near each other in-game.

    So yeah, please point me to this precious interaction you're trying to preserve by making alts a PITA.
    Last edited by evantide; 11-03-2013 at 12:45 AM.
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  2. #47
    Sword of Telara Redhead's Avatar
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    If you want a item to insta level you why do you even play the game? The major thing of the game is to level to 60. Yes I think it takes forever but if you can get insta levels you will miss out on a ton of content. You sir or ma'am would have more fun not playing at all
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  3. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acesfool View Post
    You have to remember that gamers are extremely tyrannical about their games. Many gamers get an idea in their heads that a game must be played a certain way and anyone who strays from their method is bad, lazy, entitled, bla bla bla. For the most part they scoff at simply giving people options that they would never take advantage of themselves.
    First of all is the developer thinking about the way "his" game would have to be played, not the gamers. And my advantage to have game-experienced people on board would be the ability to do instances within the needed time and not eternally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Seshatar View Post
    Bad Idea.
    [...]
    The only thing I would accept is that once you max-leveled a class (e. g. cleric) you can create more instant level 60 clerics. But thats the only option which would be ok for me.
    That would be the only exception I could live with and agree.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    I don't get why you're playing a game for mindless grind (every MMO's leveling process) instead of the fun gated content (raids, experts, messing around with builds, CQ, warfronts with full skill access).
    ...says a guy who did most content and world firsts. I bet, your leader would never accept "bought" 60's in his raids, holding the whole raid back while learning.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    But hey, to each their own. You like make-believe. I like playing a game because as a game, not a second job.
    It is what you make out of it. If you see the leveling phase (in Rift easy and short, as many complaints show) as a job, play another game, where you don't have to level up.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    Are you telling me that a vast majority of gamers have over 300+ dollars to spend on raid gear?
    Please tell me these players. Please. I would like to see multiple examples of these types of players that haven't already sunk hundreds of hours into this game.
    You would get big eyes, if you would know, how many players throw big amounts of money into games. 300 $ are not so much. I know players, who spent enough money into game(s) to buy a car instead. I am sure, there are and will be such players in Rift too. Crazy, but true.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    What part of this game supports actual group interactions at low levels? Why would lower level players seek guidance from other low level players instead of finding level 60s?
    Who ever did raids with people without teamspirit, knows how the raidleading goes to be a job. If people reclaim to have less work they expect others to spend more time and effort. So people should learn to play in groups, should learn to ask and to be willing to work on their chars.
    People search for guidance, often enough. Go to Meridian/Sanctum and wait there: You will have enough questions to answer. Not because you are 60 and relic-geared, but because you know answers and give them un-asked.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    This doesn't make sense at all. Rift's basically a solo game at lvls 1-50. There's very few quests that require an actual group, outside of dungeons and the very rare group quests.
    Yes, thats true. But no arguement for skipping the level phase completely and beeing 60 at once you join the game and spend a huge amount of money.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    [...]
    Guidance? Why would a low level really ask another low level for guidance in "person"? If they needed guidance, they have the global chat channels.
    Yes! With mostly stupid answers... because all want to have fun... yeah!

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    They have guilds they can join.. They have the forums. Heck, they can even join the level 60, cross raids,a nd cross events chat and ask people. Sure, there's the usual ****s, but they'll get some kind person helping them. And none of this needs to be done with the players actually being near each other in-game.
    Some kind person... yes. Luckily there are always such kind players. Don't you mean, it will be a huge effort for these kind persons to explain the game to a fresh 60 without a playing history, just jumped in? To answer not only questions like: How can I reset my mentor level? Why can't I join that raid? Where can I get my mount? What are these "crossed swords" on map? What is a quest-hub? How can I go forward to higher leveled mobs? There will be other, more complex questions... and one will follow the other. Kind persons answer, others point to forum and/or guild to join. But in all cases the saved time for the one person needs more time from another person.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    So yeah, please point me to this precious interaction you're trying to preserve by making alts a PITA.
    Don't know, what a PITA is... aside the tasty food. But: With more players in the low level zones there will be more group-playing. If I run around in the low level zones, always others, low level people, join me. Because there is a button: "Join public group". They do, and in many cases they ask for some help at quests or for dungeons... no matter, if I am 60 or mentored down.

    Skipping the level phase would mean: You don't really identifying with your char. Who ever got an account from someone with a high level char he never played before will get the experience, that he will probably play him... but not in all aspects, more the 1-button-playstyle - til he gets familiar with it. That will be - in your opinion - in raids/instances (surely not at the dummy, isn't it?)... at the cost of time of others.

    A clearly NO... (except may be for the sec or third ot whatever same class as alt)! (And no, I have enough alts, leveled up as usual... and enjoyed it.)
    Last edited by Mausea; 11-03-2013 at 03:48 AM.
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  4. #49
    Champion of Telara Acesfool's Avatar
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    Still waiting for a legit reason why this shouldn't happen. Everything I've read so far is simply one group of players who believe everyone should play one way and one way only. The learning the class argument is a complete myth, and the lowbies not having anyone to group with myth gets blown out of the water when you factor in mentoring.

    I'd bet dollars against donuts that if players had this option, and you ended up in a dungeon/raid with a player who simply didn't know how to play their class, it would be 90% likely someone who leveled from 1 to 60 instead of insta leveling.

  5. #50
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    Hahaaaa... yes, it is easy to put others in a pidgean hole by jumping into the mainstream.

    We all know: Nowadays people want all, now and for free, crying like babies when they want to be entertained because they are bored. As one above said: More content, I am bored. Vials/potions for instant level, I am bored. No quests leading to dungeons, I am bored. Ah, yes, and not to forget: All have the right to use the game as they want... and don't want to be forced to do it like intended... who intended? Ah, yes... we, the veteran player, because we are jealous since we were forced to level by our own. Yessss!!!

    Rules? Traditions? Old content of life... not for us, the people of the 21st century, isn't it?

    Omg... what are you doing if you are forced by real life issues to reclaim at exactly those values to survive...?
    Ah, I know: Complaining and remanding.

    /sarcasm
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  6. #51
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    If ever there was an argument for a "dislike" button it would be this thread
    But then I would prolly have Repetitive strain injury by now.

  7. #52
    Champion of Telara The Real Viz Shady's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Acesfool View Post
    Still waiting for a legit reason why this shouldn't happen.
    I'm still waiting for a legit reason this SHOULD happen.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by xanduin246 View Post
    I'm hoping you, or someone else, will be able to answer this. I've asked many people before, but have not gotten a real answer before.

    How does leveling as a Ranger help a Rogue learn to be a better tank at 60? If we made a requirement that you need at least 1 level 60 before you can get free levels, and said you can't use free levels before level 20, would that not be sufficient? Someone who leveled 1-60 as a Ranger who then wanted to tank as a Riftstalker would have to learn all new skills. Almost nothing would translate over, not even primary stats. How is that different from someone (who has experience of Rift basics from their other 60) being handed a level 60 Riftstalker? Same with someone who leveled as an Assassin and went into dungeons as, say, a Marksman.

    It's not that leveling takes long, it's that once you've done it a couple times most people really just don't want to do it again.

    Sounds like u talking about daoc the best game that was made.. there if u got lvl 50 (max level) u could get insta free lvl to 20 on alts on same account

  9. #54
    Shield of Telara Aalnyan's Avatar
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    O so now we want to do like SoE who by the way received so much flak from the "real" player base and lost a good amount of its player base it wasn't funny. SoE started selling whats called Herioc Characters. That is a character instantly leveled to 85 with base set of gear I think (didn't try it) and base spells for it however these characters are so un skilled it isn't even funny. There are litterally hundreds of them running around trying to do content getting into groups and pissing off the standard players because they have no idea how to play. Granted a player who had learned the mechanics of the game and most classes would be different its the new player that is causing the issues.

    Does Trion need this? No they don't Rift isn't hard and leveling isn't hard. Seems people just think MMO's is jump right in to end game content without putting any effort whatsoever into playing. Takes what playing a game is about away doesn't it? Heck lets make Monopoly rules where you own propertys right away and have millions already when you start. That way it only takes 10 mins to win it.

  10. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blauc View Post
    ...there if u got lvl 50 (max level) u could get insta free lvl to 20 on alts on same account
    But being able to do that, wouldn't it screw up the PA leveling gain?
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  11. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mausea View Post
    Hahaaaa... yes, it is easy to put others in a pidgean hole by jumping into the mainstream.

    We all know: Nowadays people want all, now and for free, crying like babies when they want to be entertained because they are bored. As one above said: More content, I am bored. Vials/potions for instant level, I am bored. No quests leading to dungeons, I am bored. Ah, yes, and not to forget: All have the right to use the game as they want... and don't want to be forced to do it like intended... who intended? Ah, yes... we, the veteran player, because we are jealous since we were forced to level by our own. Yessss!!!

    Rules? Traditions? Old content of life... not for us, the people of the 21st century, isn't it?

    Omg... what are you doing if you are forced by real life issues to reclaim at exactly those values to survive...?
    Ah, I know: Complaining and remanding.

    /sarcasm
    I'm not sure how wanting more from a product that we pay for pertains to what we do to survive outside of a game. I work six (sometimes seven) days per week and I take care of two family members with disabilities. If wanting a faster way to level alts means I'm lazy, or whatever, then so be it.

  12. #57
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Real Viz Shady View Post
    I'm still waiting for a legit reason this SHOULD happen.
    Because leveling alts through the same 60 levels you've already leveled through once or twice is boring. If there was one shred of difference between the classes when it comes to the leveling experience then it might make some sense not to have it.

  13. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Real Viz Shady View Post
    I'm still waiting for a legit reason this SHOULD happen.
    Because not a single thing you learn at 1-59 on any alt actually applies at 60 that can't be learned at level 60 itself.

    Not a single damn thing.
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  14. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Redhead View Post
    If you want a item to insta level you why do you even play the game? The major thing of the game is to level to 60. Yes I think it takes forever but if you can get insta levels you will miss out on a ton of content. You sir or ma'am would have more fun not playing at all
    Because obviously for some people leveling isn't fun.
    I find leveling fun. So do you. Very well.
    But I wouldn't enforce my idea of fun onto others.

    Seriously, I do not find any slightest reason of leveling in Rift other than "because it existed in WoW." In other words, the leveling system is merely inheritance from other games without any serious thoughts or creativity given into its existence.

    Making things worse, leveling isn't the only way to get fun in Rift, yet it is enforced onto all players.
    Some people find raiding fun. I don't any more, and thus I don't raid. Pretty clean.
    However, people who don't find leveling fun cannot avoid leveling under the current system.


    By the way, your argument about "missing content" isn't quite right. One can do low level contents at level 60.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Acesfool View Post
    Because leveling alts through the same 60 levels you've already leveled through once or twice is boring. If there was one shred of difference between the classes when it comes to the leveling experience then it might make some sense not to have it.
    Simple question:
    Why alts if you don't want to level them?

    Professions? You can have up to 9 professions at 1 char - enough.
    More space? You can buy slots and buy or craft bigger bags.
    ...?

    Surely not because of game experience, I guess. To get the message "...reached lvl 60"? For what that archievement?

    Ok, I think, we have to look more carefully at players/skills, if we invite pugs to runs... and if there will be an Item in shop, where one can buy levels... that will be my last day in Rift.
    Last edited by Mausea; 11-04-2013 at 02:01 AM.
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