NO DPS or Threat Meters

[Plus1]

How is playing computer games slacking while reading trashy fantasy novels or painting Warhammer miniatures not? Free time is free time, trying to label some hobbies as worthless and others as acceptable is ******ed.

Most hobbies are just as ultimately pointless. I believe that unless something tangible(This includes Noteworthy Concepts such as the Theory of Relativity) is ultimately created then any activity is Mindless Self Indulgence(good band as well). Most hobbies are just passing time to pass time without actually accomplishing anything.

This is slacking.

According to Wikipedia "The term "slacker" is used to refer to a person who avoids work." so really the only gamers who aren't slackers are the gold sellers because it really is work for them.

[Kidomi]

No matter how you define "slacking", I like to perform my best in games and I ask for the same from my teamates.
That is, actually, what keeps human people from evoluting, as a group of human being tends to expect best contribution to the group.

If you like to "slack", go ahead and play the game without meters, but don't hate it nor protest against meters.

That doesn't mean it's a productive activity. You're just more intense slacker. Like I said, dress it us however you like, gaming is slacking. If you don't want to be counted among slackers do something IRL, build something, read something to expand personal knowledge, do anything other than chat with other slackers in front of flashing pretty pictures. We're slackers.

In fact, by beng here, on the forums we are the worst slackers. We are the slackers who spend the time when we're not slacking, discussing what the best way to slack is.

[Dinadass]

Most hobbies are just as ultimately pointless. I believe that unless something tangible(This includes Noteworthy Concepts such as the Theory of Relativity) is ultimately created then any activity is Mindless Self Indulgence(good band as well). Most hobbies are just passing time to pass time without actually accomplishing anything.

This is slacking.

According to Wikipedia "The term "slacker" is used to refer to a person who avoids work." so really the only gamers who aren't slackers are the gold sellers because it really is work for them.

Building social connections/relationships is part of MMOs, and that is "accomplishing something." Your point might work better if we were discussing someone playing single-player Snake or Pong or something.

[Corwynn_Maelstrom]

That is, actually, what keeps human people from evoluting, as a group of human being tends to expect best contribution to the group.

What is going to keep humans from evolving is that when the zombiepocalypse comes most of us are going to die because we can't manage to do anything without machines and computers anymore.

[Plus1]

Building social connections/relationships is part of MMOs, and that is "accomplishing something." Your point might work better if we were discussing someone playing single-player Snake or Pong or something.

I don't define, meeting other people to slack with, as work.

[Lucklez]

The game adjust the gamers of the game.
In wow, you do not get a challenge until you find new content that none has done at all.
In EQ you got a new challenge in each fight as the fight was alive. The screen didnt tell you what happened next.
In EQ you got challenged from the beginning through quests and the game mechanics itself, where it pressured you to use your brain at level 1. Aswell to interact with the community alot more.
Nothing will change my opinion when it comes to 1 thing, The best EQ players finds less challenge in WoW than what they had in EQ.

A game gotta have a variable in it, it got to have life. By breaking down everything and allowing sharing of information, the challenge itself gets easier. You cant fight the internet, but you could simply remove the addons that removes the challenge.
Perhaps award lesser rewards to those that wont do the event the hard way.

In games its all about learned the scripts. EQ had a bigger variable in it, WoW doesnt have that.
WoW is more like a simulator game now, and that makes me personally belive that there is opening up a sub-genre in mmorpgs.

The scripts in wow is more complex than many other games, but its only available for the first few ppl there, and even them have tons of tools that breaks down the challenge for them. The tools killed WoW. Now its just a piss easy game.

Stop giving out so much information about the game mechanics, stop allowing adjustments that leaves the player doing less and less. Implement a learning curve from the beginning, so you can avoid the faceplant of so many ppl when they are doing the content when they are at max level.

Meters and parsers removes makes games easier, so the OP should rather ask if ppl want the game to be piss easy, easy or undetermined.

[Dinadass]

In EQ you got a new challenge in each fight as the fight was alive. The screen didnt tell you what happened next.
In EQ you got challenged from the beginning through quests and the game mechanics itself, where it pressured you to use your brain at level 1.

What? No, you did not have a new challenge in each fight in EQ. You most certainly were not challenged from the beginning. Walking up to a mob and hitting auto attack and hoping it dies before you do is not challenge.

In games its all about learned the scripts. EQ had a bigger variable in it, WoW doesnt have that.
WoW is more like a simulator game now, and that makes me personally belive that there is opening up a sub-genre in mmorpgs.

EQ had a bigger variable in scripts than WoW? Hahahah, what? Virtually every EQ fight for the first 3 years was "Attack the main tank, cast an AE fear, maybe some sort of AE DD." You're honestly trying to claim that EQ fights had more variables than WoW fights?

EQ being more difficult is debatable, but claiming that EQ fights were more varied is just false.

[ag0nizing]

The game adjust the gamers of the game.
In wow, you do not get a challenge until you find new content that none has done at all.
In EQ you got a new challenge in each fight as the fight was alive. The screen didnt tell you what happened next.
In EQ you got challenged from the beginning through quests and the game mechanics itself, where it pressured you to use your brain at level 1. Aswell to interact with the community alot more.
Nothing will change my opinion when it comes to 1 thing, The best EQ players finds less challenge in WoW than what they had in EQ.

A game gotta have a variable in it, it got to have life. By breaking down everything and allowing sharing of information, the challenge itself gets easier. You cant fight the internet, but you could simply remove the addons that removes the challenge.
Perhaps award lesser rewards to those that wont do the event the hard way.

In games its all about learned the scripts. EQ had a bigger variable in it, WoW doesnt have that.
WoW is more like a simulator game now, and that makes me personally belive that there is opening up a sub-genre in mmorpgs.

The scripts in wow is more complex than many other games, but its only available for the first few ppl there, and even them have tons of tools that breaks down the challenge for them. The tools killed WoW. Now its just a piss easy game.

Stop giving out so much information about the game mechanics, stop allowing adjustments that leaves the player doing less and less. Implement a learning curve from the beginning, so you can avoid the faceplant of so many ppl when they are doing the content when they are at max level.

Meters and parsers removes makes games easier, so the OP should rather ask if ppl want the game to be piss easy, easy or undetermined.

Are you insane?

[Corwynn_Maelstrom]

Are you insane?

He's pretty much obviously non-native. I personally just ignore his posts because I can't tell what he's saying.

[Taemek]

What? No, you did not have a new challenge in each fight in EQ. You most certainly were not challenged from the beginning. Walking up to a mob and hitting auto attack and hoping it dies before you do is not challenge.



EQ had a bigger variable in scripts than WoW? Hahahah, what? Virtually every EQ fight for the first 3 years was "Attack the main tank, cast an AE fear, maybe some sort of AE DD." You're honestly trying to claim that EQ fights had more variables than WoW fights?

EQ being more difficult is debatable, but claiming that EQ fights were more varied is just false.

At the start, yes EQ fights were pretty standard run of the mill, but MMORPG's were also in thier infintile state.

Before WoW was released, the stratergies required to beat these mobs came to be the way we see the MMORPG industry shaped today from the help of EQ raid encounters. Alot of encounters in WoW are almost identical scripts to some EQ raid bosses OR have some aspect of Raid bosses from EQ in them. Velious, Luclin and PoP expasions was the turning points in the game were stratergies evolved during thoses releases and went down the path of needing to pay attention, rather then:

Tank = Kick, bash, taunt, kick, bash, taunt until dead.
DPS = Auto attack/Cast spell every x amount of seconds and watch Television
Healer = HoT/Small/Full heal rotation and watch Television.

So, yes, he is right and EQ fights were much more difficult then WoW fights in the end and is where WoW got alot of thier scripts from to begin with.

[Lucklez]

****s hit the fan in wow = restart
****s hit the fan in EQ = go on.

[ag0nizing]

What?
10char

[Dinadass]

Tank = Kick, bash, taunt, kick, bash, taunt until dead.

You obviously do not know how tanking worked in EQ.

Taunting while you had aggro = bad tank.

Kick/Bash while tanking = bad because it gave miniscule DPS/aggro increases but meant you were more likely to eat a riposte and go down between Cheals.

[Taemek]

You obviously do not know how tanking worked in EQ.

Taunting while you had aggro = bad tank.

Kick/Bash while tanking = bad because it gave miniscule DPS/aggro increases but meant you were more likely to eat a riposte and go down between Cheals.

That is why Taunt was at the end of the kick, bash rotation in the event you lost agro......and yes, I had a level 80 Gnome Warrior, nice try on trying to feel smart.

[Dinadass]

That is why Taunt was at the end of the kick, bash rotation in the event you lost agro......and yes, I had a level 80 Gnome Warrior, nice try on trying to feel smart.

What? First off, if you lost aggro, it makes more sense to Taunt and then to kick/bash. Kicking and then getting a successful taunt means that aggro the kick generated was completely wasted.

If you had aggro, you didn't taunt or kick or bash, you just sat there getting ready to turn auto attack off when the mob enraged.

Also, you claimed that WoW got a lot of their scripts from EQ. The majority of the fights in MC/BWL had mechanics and gimmicks that no EQ fight had up to that point, and indeed had a lot of stuff that simply wasn't possible in the EQ engine. Please explain how WoW stole them from EQ then?