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Thread: *Cleric Inquisitor/PvP*

  1. #1
    Shield of Telara Dizbo's Avatar
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    Default *Cleric Inquisitor/PvP*

    Quote Originally Posted by Flashmemory View Post
    Martial classes have explosive damage with very little setup to burst.. and since many of their abilities are OGCD they can make them 1 spam and burst macro. They are built differently from mages which have somewhat of a setup but also can be quite easy to play but clerics take much more effort. The time to burst are all pretty short with martial classes and the frequencies are very fast to burst in comparison.

    Warlock is very hard countered by panacea but they are very hard to find so people just craft some healing pots and use that as they run away.. it has saved me a bunch of times. I don't really complain too much about them. If it were a martial class I wouldn't be able to run away and drink, pot or etc. They would do all that dot damage over 15 secs in one gcd. Basically they will kill shot you so their damage can't be read consistently since they will kill you in a short period of time. Warlock dots are sustained so you get to see it register for a long period of time on multiple players.

    Yes, War Fragments make a big difference. Take a primalist who can basically hit for 49K+ crit with decent CP to level 15 fragments with 7500-8000 CP and 30+% Crit rate and they hit for 75K+ incredibly frequent.

    Keep in mind that off handers can also socket a crit power rune where caster can't. There is so much working against casters that the devs have implemented in PoA from the design level to itemization. When the new dungeon was released with the new CP runes some players bought it up but I think it was ignored or didn't get enough attention, unfortunately.. So it is far more easier for rogues and warriors to get closer to crit cap in PvP than it is for caster classes where the totem can't have a CP rune socketed to it.
    -----
    The above post is a great platform to open up a conversation on Cleric's Inquisitor in PvP, thank you Flashmemory.

    1) Toolkit
    My toolkit also includes Panacea (to cleanse Warlock dots), but pretty expensive to craft, I'm not CP capped and have not obtained any of the new runes.

    2) EU PvP
    I also pvp on the EU server (where I have better frags) and have had the pleasure of being repeatedly smashed by Euclave, who is Guelone's (Warrior) cleric. While I will never reach the level of Guelone, I am still learning, which is a good thing.

    3) Current Inquisitor PvP Guide
    Thought I would share
    Euclave's Inquisitor PvP Guide:



    4) Playstyle Comments
    • You must be always be moving, except for dot application [plus Spiritual Deficiency] - for this spec to work [no bolt of retribution].
    • You must maintain the Fervent Strike buff on yourself and Mental Resiliance.
    • I admit I am still bad with the rune of return [with a 30s cd], but if you can execute it properly it is basically a get out of jail free card. Can anyone offer some tips?
    • The other option is the old cabalist offsoul with dark passage.

    5) Positioning
    My positioning still needs work - I need to remember: "Learn to lick walls/pilar/everything you found or be at 35meters (against nightblade/paragon for example) because you will not be able to compete in burst in a no man's land situation."

    If I forgot something, let me know. I'd like to hear your thoughts and discussion!
    Last edited by Dizbo; 10-07-2019 at 07:55 AM. Reason: just fixing stuff

  2. #2
    Rift Disciple
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    Ty for the mention.

    Some of the specs are outdated in the link (the one with legendary faerie healer).
    You can choose instead of 4 druid if you want and with 62 mastery Benevolent presence (3%more life and armor+5% crit):
    - 4 oracle : boon of vitality, inspiration of battle (you have to cast insignia of blood to activate it so it's situational)
    - 4 sentinel : bolt of light, heroic resolve (disconnect and log again if you can't activate it)

  3. #3
    Shield of Telara Dizbo's Avatar
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    And here he/she is! ^

    I may ask too much - but - could you sometime share a warfront video of Euclave?
    It could encourage people to play cleric more often?
    Nice to see you and thank you very much, merci, for the updates .
    Last edited by Dizbo; 10-07-2019 at 01:19 PM.

  4. #4
    Ascendant Kronos v's Avatar
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    WARNING: UNSOLICITED RANT AHEAD

    Quote Originally Posted by Dizbo View Post
    My positioning still needs work - I need to remember: "Learn to lick walls/pilar/everything you found or be at 35meters (against nightblade/paragon for example) because you will not be able to compete in burst in a no man's land situation."
    imo, this is exactly what is wrong with current rift pvp.
    with you - and every single other ranged dps - all trying to hide behind each others skirts at the very extremes of your range, you leave your healers and everyone else else out in the cold to die while you pick off cheap kill steals. (note: not "you" specifically, but "you" generally as in all wall humping rdps).

    there is no pushing forward in this scenario. only a cowardly retreat as you all take turns ducking behind the other rdps who ducked behind you.

    this might be fine in the pvp kiddie pool of arena style pvp, but it is a recipe for failure in rifts warfronts and bespeaks of a pve style attitude of min/maxing damage over other requirements such as survivability, utility, and mobility. this would be fine if you queued as part of a premade where other party members have those covered, much like a pve group with the holey trinity (plus support) for a boss fight. but not in rifts warfronts. in warfronts you need to be able to stand on your own two feet, not cower behind everyone else, because to win you must be able to act apart from the herd so as to achieve multiple objectives.

    in the current state of rift pvp, melee is not your front line. YOU are ALL the front line, melee and ranged, together. if you arent taking your place with the rest of the team at the front, YOU are committing your team to certain failure for no better reason than personal cowardice.. in a video game!

    there is no glory in losing your way to a high KB count at the expense of your team.

    /rant
    Last edited by Kronos v; 10-07-2019 at 02:00 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    Or to put it more simply, it doesn't matter if you're topping the charts if you're killing the wrong people.

  5. #5
    Shield of Telara Dizbo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kronos v View Post
    WARNING: UNSOLICITED RANT AHEAD
    I'll lick you like a TOOTSIE POP. [Rant Off]. Good post though.
    Last edited by Dizbo; 10-07-2019 at 03:19 PM.

  6. #6
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    I haven't PvP'ed on my cleric in years but I remember my weapon had to be reequipped every match so the power stone can register. I'm not sure if it still happens or they fixed it. It should be pretty much the first thing you write about clerics in PvP. Guides are great but most clerics don't even know how to play inquisitor properly in raids let alone PvP.. let alone the top clerics who did play inq barely even used druid which was worse playability than inq in PvE. Yet it is getting rebuffed with very very little QoL changes. Last raid I went into we had 3 clerics fighting for who can melee the last boss since none of them knew how to play inquisitor and the one who tried to play it said he could not interrupt it was pretty bad and we just didn't clear the last boss. Devs just need to warn players not to choose cleric in my opinion until they can go all the way and fix it. It really doesn't matter if YOU personally do well with it in PvP. You can look at the average cleric performance.. As a whole the cleric community is almost 40% behind or more in performance in Raids. And that is when you don't include all the clerics but the top 70 when you include top 100 its even worse..and that is PvE where nothing really changes about fights..
    Last edited by Aedynn; 10-07-2019 at 07:38 PM.

  7. #7
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    Cleric is not 40% behind you are living in a sad fantasy... shaman is near top dps now, defiler puts up awesome healing, and greatly benefits the raid in debuff and buff assistance if you have 3 cleric fighting over 3 shaman spots on titan you have 3 bad clerics half the time i go defiler to provide better raid buffs faster purging and free up a melee spot, to say nothing of the load it takes off the tank healer during the add phases.


    /edit every single raid in the top 50 this week has at least 1 cleric if they were 40% behind no one would take any of them.
    Last edited by beefy1212; 10-07-2019 at 09:30 PM.

  8. #8
    Ascendant Flashmemory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beefy1212 View Post
    Cleric is not 40% behind you are living in a sad fantasy... shaman is near top dps now, defiler puts up awesome healing, and greatly benefits the raid in debuff and buff assistance if you have 3 cleric fighting over 3 shaman spots on titan you have 3 bad clerics half the time i go defiler to provide better raid buffs faster purging and free up a melee spot, to say nothing of the load it takes off the tank healer during the add phases.


    /edit every single raid in the top 50 this week has at least 1 cleric if they were 40% behind no one would take any of them.
    https://rift-stats.s3.eu-central-1.a...s.com/dps.html This is a good reference. They are quite behind in BoS.. Yes, technically the average of cleric is still 40% behind rogues on one boss(commander) but Titan X is probably the only boss that really matters because it is the closest to a dummy parse as it gets. That is still 20% behind so literally don't know where you are getting your statistics from. Average for entire phases are lower but if you were just to count the ST it is 29%.. I assume Aedynn is just using that statistic. Other things those stats don't consider are AE which if you did include AE + ST.. I would think it would be far worse behind rogues :P Just uninstall older simple meter you don't want to see those numbers lol.

    Shaman isn't too good in PvP. Get pulled in by primalist/warriors and just imploded by all their burst. Inquisitor is okay in PvP but most don't know how to use them well which is why you rarely see clerics in PvP that do well. One thing that helped was the reduction to RC. What does well is if you use Legendary SH x 2 on different targets and dot them up every RC.. can pad your dps numbers as long as the targets don't have stuff like cleanse souls or panacea available. LSH ticks hit pretty hard in PvP.

    Also, clerics top DPS spec in this expansion was mostly druid.. http://forums.riftgame.com/game-disc...-61-druid.html. It was nerfed and rebuffed recently but not to the same dps that it was before the nerfs happen. Druid was 1.8+Million dps on dummy at one point.. Winford and maybe 1 other EU cleric was probably the only successful cleric to parse well with it on Azranel. Outside of actual playability Shaman is better than druid now only because there is a bug with FM where the dev said he will fix next patch.
    Last edited by Flashmemory; 10-08-2019 at 12:05 AM.

  9. #9
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    I'm talking about inquisitor NOT shaman. This entire thread is about Inq NOT shaman and AS INQ yes they are close to 40% behind rogue top dps. When I mean CLERIC DPS I should have said Cleric inquisitor DPS since people can't understand implications on a thread dealing specifically with inquisitor DPS and NOT shaman. Grats on winning the straw man.. Yes, I do use that reference but I was particularly referring to inquisitor dps vs. Rogues FOTY. And btw even if you use that reference.. look at top 100 even on Titan https://rift-stats.s3.eu-central-1.a.../top100_4.html Scroll down to average dps of cleric(100%) vs. rogue(140%)+40% for rogue. Commander is +53% for rogue.
    Last edited by Aedynn; 10-08-2019 at 01:02 AM.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flashmemory View Post
    The issue is most people are not using prancing turtle, and couldn't care less, also classes are not their top 10 unicorns.

    case in point i am not on that list, and neither is anyone in my normal raid group and we would be near top in almost every class

    but even then cleric is in line with everything but the top 25 or so rogues and primalist.

  11. #11
    Shadowlander
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aedynn View Post
    I'm talking about inquisitor NOT shaman.
    then maybe you shouldn't have ranted about your 3 shaman fighting over melee spots on titan, to be honest i barely read your post, there are only so many ways you can read the same person cry about cleric dps and that the dev should tell people not to play cleric, for months on end.

    honestly if you want to complain about pvp performance, how complaining about something useful like the fact primalist and warriors are 2-3 button instata killing everyone and the matches are turning into almost nothing but threshers maw primalist.
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails *Cleric Inquisitor/PvP*-balanced.jpg  
    Last edited by beefy1212; 10-09-2019 at 01:00 AM.

  12. #12
    Shield of Telara Dizbo's Avatar
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    Could be characters named with the letter "A" are op.
    Seriously though, I was hoping to keep this on track a little more.

  13. #13
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    I personally feel inq is in a good place in pvp. Let me premise this by saying I think the issue is a handful of outlier souls are overly powerful is the actual problem. Not to derail anything, but until we can fix the issue causing souls to go into crazy-mode whether its gear or certain specs + gear the root cause needs found. Until any form of balancing attempts happen, 80% (just a guessed number but Im sure its not far off) of souls/hybrid builds will be subpar in pvp.

    Normally people want to buff the lackluster souls, but there are way too many to do this, hence why it would be easier to fix things like threshers maw, rift burst, poison damage, etc.., just look at a meter youll see the abilities doing 30-70% of a single soulís damage, sometimes these are also procs or basic attacks which is even crazier.

    At any rate, I probably know inq in pvp fairly well, having had to learn it since heals tanked on cleric. Despite this, I keep trying to make a decent healing build and/or dps/heal, which Im pretty sure Ive maxed its potential. If anything, Id rather get the heals buffed on cleric vs its dps side for pvp.

    Ill try to make another post later about how I play my inq, and what Ive learned on how to fight certain souls, even ones that directly trump you. My cleric is Shendrith.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrastion View Post
    Ill try to make another post later about how I play my inq, and what Ive learned on how to fight certain souls, even ones that directly trump you. My cleric is Shendrith.
    ./facepalm

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Phantomsiege View Post
    ./facepalm
    So far I’ve learned the extent of your intelligence ends with /facepalm. I’ve concluded you’re a test monkey who got a hold of a scientist’s laptop and learned to repeat one thing.

    When you’re ready to move to step two of the experiment you can contribute something to the actual conversation in an intelligent, rational manner. Until then you'll remain a test monkey.
    Last edited by Wrastion; 10-09-2019 at 09:10 PM.

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