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Thread: Programs in place to prevent cheating?

  1. #16
    Ascendant Flashmemory's Avatar
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    PvP fragments are THAT big of a difference. Don't even consider PvP if you won't invest in them and you don't need top tier fragments. You have to realize that damage is greatly reduced in PvP. Having AP/SP and Main Stat are way less important as a result. It is similar to the old days where CP and Crit chance were the only things that mattered in PvP to be honest. You may find having life, endurance, CP main stat and Crit chance is better than aiming for pure DPS secondaries. People don't realize this and throw away those good fragments. Others do and they end up with 300K+ life as a dps and have explosive burst and crit chance while giving up a few 100 dps of sustained damage from investing in main stat and AP/SP fragments.

    With all the disconnects in PvP I get I would say something is up but since they disabled sending reports after the crashes I just assume they gave up on trying to fix the problems in PvP. What could look like an exploit could just be that. For instance, I would disconnect riding on my mount to codex and when I log back in game I will be rolled back to where I was 10-15 secs. ago. This can be percieved as a teleport hack when really it isn't. Other than that only thing I can assume some people can send something to crash you specifically out of game which sucks if that is what is happening.
    Last edited by Flashmemory; 09-22-2019 at 09:29 PM.

  2. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sails View Post
    Well dude I'm sure you are happy you got Farseer nerfed. And I highly wonder about hacking concerns b/c those Farseers that were Op don't even play wfs anymore since the nerf. If they were hacking surely they could use their "programs" to be somewhat op. With the reduction, its hardly worth it to cover teams.

    Now could you turn up your squeaky wheel complaining about getting all the dps turned down also so other classes can be balanced? Could u be instrumental in asking devs or whoever is here, to at least eliminate some of the stupid ccs that prevent greatly reduced Farseer and other heal souls from even being viable, when activated specifically on heals. Its as if some players want heals removed period.

    Players are on wfs eating food again to make up for nerfs that weren't needed. Just b/c someone got upset that they couldn't perform as well as someone else. Its so annoying that those who know what they are doing aren't behind the wheel. B/c this should be about balance not individual or personal issues. And ofc ensuring that hacking isn't taking place. Some of us get angry that we're snatched up by a number of dps specs, that are completely out of control. Does it matter so much? I mean as long as a few can pew pew their way through things and are happy, who cares, right? Why does it always come down to effecting healers when dps has an issue?

    Could you also rile up your squeaky wheel to get them to fix the horrid team matching-making system that NEVER distributes players evenly? Something so simple, expressed by a few unhappy players can impact the game overall. There is likely some hacking issues. But I think people have to be careful what they ask for. The game is in a vulnerable state and changes can be made in the wrong direction.
    Most of the people I taked to knew what would happen when they nerfed Farseer heals all it did was turn everyone off healing at all and handing the game over to the few hard hitting dpser's out there that can run thru people like a pride of lions eating their way thru a herd of gazelles.
    I still play my healer but hardly seems the point since its so hard to heal myself let alone anyone else so why bother. Also nerfing us hasnt seemed enough for some people judging from the tells, some people want us gone altogether which seems harsh as why cant we play what we want while other outrageous specs are allowed to play freely.
    I still think they should stop messing with heals put it back the way it was and up other healing souls. Or nerf all dps and forbid wf healing totally. Or for all the whiners out there hand out pillows and let the fun begin where we can just fluff each other to death.
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  3. #18
    Ascendant Flashmemory's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Purrr View Post
    Most of the people I taked to knew what would happen when they nerfed Farseer heals all it did was turn everyone off healing at all and handing the game over to the few hard hitting dpser's out there that can run thru people like a pride of lions eating their way thru a herd of gazelles.
    I still play my healer but hardly seems the point since its so hard to heal myself let alone anyone else so why bother. Also nerfing us hasnt seemed enough for some people judging from the tells, some people want us gone altogether which seems harsh as why cant we play what we want while other outrageous specs are allowed to play freely.
    I still think they should stop messing with heals put it back the way it was and up other healing souls. Or nerf all dps and forbid wf healing totally. Or for all the whiners out there hand out pillows and let the fun begin where we can just fluff each other to death.
    It is all about PvP fragments. Do you have +life +endurance fragments? Take a look at the other good farseer life.. and their alts who do well in PvP they all are topping 320K life in PvP. It is important for healers to have high life. Set your icons to view by life. You can tell a good dps with fragments for pvp by doing this. Those who won't invest in PvP fragments will sit below 250K as a dps. Most others are 270K to close to 300K. Those are the ones worth healing because they won't get one shot and probably will have reliq and pots.

    Main problem in PvP is fragments. With the way, Trion encourages PvP is through being carried by geared players.. Fresh 70s and most under 70 are terrible in PvP and don't stand chance. The way the game chooses to balance sides is also terrible sometimes. For instance, this week I was forced into a lot of noob warfronts. Two or three sub-70s in a 7 vs 7 with players literally feeding the other side. The other side had stacked players who always win and one of them can solo half our team alone. I could do nothing to carry them no matter what, I even switched to 4 different playstyles in one match. We got close to beating them only 1 time with all the effort I put in. I just logged out and when I log out I go on an alt account and find out some other player like yourself gets stuck in the same position usually vs. the same group. It feels massively rigged at times and more so lately than before. I wonder if the dev actually did something to matchmaking or simply there is just a lot of newbies recently.
    Last edited by Flashmemory; 09-22-2019 at 10:17 PM.

  4. #19
    Telaran Purrr's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Flashmemory View Post
    It is all about PvP fragments. Do you have +life +endurance fragments? Take a look at the better farseer life.. and their alts who do well in PvP they all are topping 320K life in PvP. It is important for healers to have high life. Set your icons to view by life. You can tell a good dps with fragments for pvp by doing this. Those who won't invest in PvP fragments will sit below 250K as a dps. Most others are 270K to close to 300K. Those are the ones worth healing because they won't get one shot and probably will have reliq and pots. The other players will just get one shot because they don't use consumables and proper fragments. Really, you can't blame the state of healers in PvP if most people won't gear correctly or use consumables. In this case, healing sucks because other players refuse to use pots, drinks, reliq, and defensive skill properly. Main problem in PvP is fragments. With the way Trion encourage PvP is through being carried by geared players.. really don't stand much of a chance PvP as a newbie. The way the game chooses to balance sides is also terrible sometimes. For instance, this week I was forced into a lot of noob warfronts. Two or three sub 70s in a 6-7 vs 7 and the other side had stacked players who always win. I could do nothing to carry them no matter what so I just log out and when I log out I go on an alt account and find out some other player like yourself gets stuck in the same position I was vs. the same players who happen to be group together mostly every warfront even though they are not even in a premade. Sometimes it feels rigged.
    I agree with you totally the matchmaking of warfronts atm is terrible and yes I do often see one side stacked and the other side mainly new players and its luck of the draw which side you get. I am fully geared and have very good frags on my farseer but nothng helps when your whole team doesnt seem to want heals and does nothing to help protect you or constantly jumps behind you so your always put out front.
    Unfortunately battle pass has only exasperated the problem lately with many players not even aware of what they are supposed to do in a wf let alone how to actually play as a team to win.
    I also dont think people are aware that some of the high hitter peeps are not fresh and new but players that have undergone a name and shard change making them appear as if they just started pvping.
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  5. #20
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    I got to play a little bit this weekend for the first time in a while. I did not see anything crazy or out of the ordinary. I saw some speed hacks (but hack as in builds, not hack as in code manipulation). I saw a couple of WF's with 19-21K in damage by a couple of folks (one was BD and one was Warlock). Its a little disheartening because there are no heals to counter that.

    Frags do make a difference - wish i had them, LOL. Someone mentioned in an earlier post about what stats make a difference - I still think CP means a lot. As I am gearing my toon, it has made the most difference for me. Still have a ways to go, yet, though - so i could be wrong on that.

    As far as healing - its pretty useless. However, its been that way since the middle of NMT - when i left the game at that time. You should be able to 1v1 an AoE healer (Farseer, Chloro) but you should not be able to on a ST healer (at least not in a short amount of time). This has been my biggest gripe since they nerfed healing in NMT. It took out the Trinity which is what Rift PVP was built on.

    Overall, nothing out of the ordinary as far as WF's go. The guild i am in made a WF run on Saturday night for BP stuff - they are a PVE guild. Most of them did not have PVP gear (not a full set, anyway) and they still competed fairly well and had fun.
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  6. #21
    Plane Touched AVGVSTVS's Avatar
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    There's barely any spec creation in rift pvp.. the difference between specs like 61 paragon, 61 rifblade, 61 bladedancer or 61 assassin to any other spec is disproportionate. So when a gear'd player running a these specs goes up against a newer player without a proper spec its a ****show and seems as disproportionate to them as it seems to me.

    you will do well ungear'd with a 61 bladedancer or 61 paragon.

    Its really sad that you cant create a spec that works anymore you can't say oh well im fine with doing a little less damage in trade of survivability. its gone.

    I have 3x 70 warriors one full blown gear'd with integrated and the other who is now fully geared but i still was ripping through ppl with ranged paragon.

    Same goes for bladedancer whom doesn't need frags because it caps the stats in wf's.

    Theres no cheats in this game unless you hacked a server which aint nobody here doing that.
    Last edited by AVGVSTVS; 09-23-2019 at 11:26 AM.

  7. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by AVGVSTVS View Post
    Same goes for bladedancer whom doesn't need frags because it caps the stats in wf's.
    PvP fragments are not capped. A PvE fragment that grants 400+ CP main stat will grant very little to nothing in PvP while a war fragment will grant full 400+ CP. That is a HUGE difference. PvE fragments are absolute garbage in pvp. You are better off just investing 1K-2K on crappy fragments and getting them all to level 9 than coming in with full-blown level 15 PvE fragments.

    BD is now overrated due to the changes to DPS. Harb, RB, para, sin are too strong with kite and range and dodge+ damage reduction. Harb, in particular, has way too much survival. Maybe BD is okay against range primas if they surprise them or they don't know how to move to kite correctly. Keep in mind most range prima have pulls. The shaman has more survival and mobility than BD does now with an incredible burst. Paragon is underrated on survivability. They get immunity to knockback and pulls and have superior range. The only thing making BD even worth playing is buffed hundred blades spam. Take that away and they literally will never be used in PvP. BTW, what makes healers feel useless is the AE from warlock, bd, and MA AE. Combined it is like raid wipe but without them that warchanter, FS, and fk/chloros and even those puri users are strong especially the ones who use that one skill and spec for mobility very hard to catch and kill. Since they will just run away and have a powerful heal up every 20+ secs. That basically full heals them. Reduce AE and those heals will feel great again. If team doesn't have those specs heals feel great still as long as you don't expect to stay alive vs. 3 dps on you which honestly puri and warchanter can do.

    There is also race bias in PvP.. Having the ability to double or triple port away with a race and explosive spec vs. one where the other class has literally just one way to get on top of player and their trait is removed in PvP is absolutely terrible foundation mechanic. Like with RB tempest that can go from being in the frontline to being practically in their base with elude, leap and rift travel...
    Last edited by Aedynn; 09-24-2019 at 08:30 PM.

  8. #23
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    It sounds like the popular opinion is that the issues Im seeing aren't hacks but the pvp fragments, which is fine if the issue can be pinpointed. I really dont care which. I still view the kill ability Im seeing on certain people as remarkably fast, to the point no one should be able to achieve that in damage in just a couple seconds.

    I want to clarify, Im not under geared Im full geared on several toons and get killed in 3-4 globals, consistently, by certain players. I am not speaking about the mass majority of players, even good ones, at all. Its not a learn to play better situation, or gear issue. If you die in 3-4 globals you get one CC which will be ignored due to macroed break frees, then your dead. Unless of course you can kill them in 3-4 globals yourself there is no options or skills. Most the ones killing in this short timeframe also run faster then all the souls, so kiting is out. Perhaps its just a perfect storm of great frags, exploitable abilities, and OP souls. Whatever the case, the game seems completely unbalanced when these select few play. As someone mentioned, one such player can solo half a team of newer players. The gear disparity should never get that ridiculous.

    I know of really good players that log for a while when these players show up its no longer a “challenging wf” its usually a one sided annihilation. This is one reason speaking of matchmaking wont help because you have to first fix these crazy outliers.

    Overall my goal is to get pvp to a better state, which I believe it was in prior times. What, then, would everyone say they would want the dev to work on, if anything and in which order of priority. Ill list mine as an example.

    1. Lowering dps overall would help struggling heals, tanks, and souls that utilize more cc and utility, thus hybrids would become slightly more viable.
    2. Removing or capping pvp frags would place players on equal ground and skill would play a bigger part. They could just be buyable with pvp currency. It would also give transparency with gear.
    3. Fixing heals after lowering dps would enable tons of unplayed healing souls and not make them unbalancing. You would have to first fix any unnerfed pvp healing on these souls before buffing their overall heals though.

    Thats my general list.

  9. #24
    Telaran Purrr's Avatar
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    I like what saying Wrastion but I dont hold much hope of them fixing anything without stuffing it up more but in saying that my list is as follows.

    1.Un nerf every nerf that has been made and every damage/heal reduction and take us back to the start before Trion meddled and started this slide to hell by chopping souls without serious thought to the repercussions. Then take a good overall look at what is wrong and fix it one by one and not just do blanket nerfs.
    2. I like fragments but I think the rng needs to be improved and upgrades more affordable, because people have spent money upgrading them already I dont think its fair to remove them. They angered the population by removing pvp gear years ago after people had worked so hard for it. I also think no PvE gear should work in PvP.
    3. Balance the matchmaking more because that is seriously broken. Having a stacked side against a below average side isnt any fun for anyone.
    4. Address the exploits in the various wf's, climbing walls and poofing across the map holding a flag really isnt sporting or spawn camping in a enemys spawn thats not fair for newer players who die fast anyway and then get shot up in their own base trying to rejoin the match.
    I will say only a few players do these exploits but they should be removed.

    Having PvPed for years on this game I remember when it was fun, it wasn't broken, yes there were some good players but they wernt doing ridiculous things like they are now. I believe things started going downhill when certain devs were listening to certain players and hence the start of the nerfs, and look whats happened and the state of PvP now.
    Whatever happens I been playing near 9 years and will prob still be here in 9 more if the game doesnt die and really hope this new company makes improvements and keeps us going.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrastion View Post
    It sounds like the popular opinion is that the issues Im seeing aren't hacks but the pvp fragments, which is fine if the issue can be pinpointed.
    It is more like bugs not hacks. Even some heal specs are being exploited but not many do it because healing isn't something people gear for. Healers with 300K+ life because of saving the life, endurance fragments and using tank like paly or vk buff.. Most other players probably recycled and now are screwed over for not knowing their value. There is also the PvE items like the shields..For instance, warrior can enable guard and pop the PvE shield proc and boost their life. Devs forgot to add a healing output reduction to warrior so they get guard which is like 7-8% damage reduction ALL the time + all the innate abilities that reduce damage from the healing souls.. on top of absorbs and very fast healing and in some cases the ability to exploit the level 65 proc in pvp. Puri is pretty strong as well with .. damage reflection from several abilities.. But not alot of people know about that so they don't use it. You don't necessarily have to tank hybrid with puri to be effective. You can use support puri, cc puri, warden reflect puri etc. I think these are the two most abusive healing specs now and they feel like exploits when played right but YOU will need good fragments to push you to the level where it feels overtuned vs. dps who overtuned their damage with fragments. Farseer and FK/Chloro are still good as long as they have the proper fragments.Honestly, I think the only rogue heals feel weak even with proper fragments.

    I have probably spent like 100K+ on all my fragments on my toons and I don't mind they try to fix them at least in PvP. It feels inevitable that the game will not last if the devs don't even bring up fixing them since how greatly they imbalance the classes and cause players to quit content. If they have a standard set of fragments for pvp that can be earned/upgraded through PvP and only work in PvP it would actually encourage gameplay and be much easier to balance from a gear perspective..the way they have it set up is close to PTW since you can always sell rex for plat and upgrade fragments with stats that offer abusive behavior to souls. I mean if you can run around with 100% dodge or immortal in pvp all day you can single handily ruin the game for most people.
    Last edited by Aedynn; 09-25-2019 at 05:49 AM.

  11. #26
    Rift Disciple hmmpvp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrastion View Post
    Oh I could care less about top dps. I believe killing in the least amount of damage possible is skill, not overall damage.
    Something iv been preaching forever. People wonder why i dont top dmg like i used too, well this is why. It's funny how many people in this game judge you off how much dmg you do in wfs compared to kb's.
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  12. #27
    Rift Disciple hmmpvp's Avatar
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    I could make a list of the players i think are hacking, and im pretty sure we all know who is on this list on NA. It's so noticeable for a veteran to see.
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  13. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by hmmpvp View Post
    I could make a list of the players i think are hacking, and im pretty sure we all know who is on this list on NA. It's so noticeable for a veteran to see.
    Same. I agree most players know who they are, and Im a veteran player. Ive seen souls that run rampant, but everyone playing them can run rampant at about the same pace so its equal output. This is not the case now. Now its really good veteran players that can top charts like they've normally done, then theres those specified few that somehow are on a whole new tier killing players in 3-4 globals, in a pretty consistent manner. This eliminated things like oh they had a lot of utility buffs from this soul or that and crit constantly and the once in a blue moon thing happened.

    Never saw this before where I really couldnt explain how, mathematically, they're doing this. We arent talking a long string of hits and buff setups. Were talking 3-4 buttons and done. Sure when the /15 second CD is up they take 6-7 gcd to kill the next person, but then its back to a 3-4 kill.

    Ive also posted a ton in the past. Never before did I make a thread about hacking, because I never felt like players in general were, until now. That says something when Ive been around for the games entirety, bugs and all.

    This brings me to the unknown-frags. While I have a hard time believing frags get souls to literally 3-4 global people, I cannot fully discount them. If frags were made transparent or equalized, it would let us actually see without a doubt if certain players were cheating or not. It is of interest to note that this fixing would scare any potential cheaters because we could all then see what mathematically is possible and what is just blatantly a hack.

    Massive corporations get hacked, and large entities with stated impossible to defeat securities in place get bypassed. Why would I not believe a non-policed very aging security system that 0 people are monitoring couldnt get something by. After all, whose even left to get an alert if something was detected? If you factually saw someone doing the impossible who could you even tell and be assured you'll get a response? Just some things to think about.

    Its also interesting the first people to defend any questioning of hacks are the very same ones I suspect of hacking. No one has responded yet that plays these characters with a “Hey man, its the frags that got me here and this is how Im globaling people.” Its just usually a defense-style response of learn to play with no actual meat to counter your questions or even explanations of how theyre doing it. Normally by now there would be a guide or one guy helping others understand how to gear up themselves properly and the macros, but nope. Not one explanation.

    Fix frags and well all find out soon enough.
    Last edited by Wrastion; 09-30-2019 at 06:24 PM.

  14. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrastion View Post
    Massive corporations get hacked, and large entities with stated impossible to defeat securities in place get bypassed. Why would I not believe a non-policed very aging security system that 0 people are monitoring couldnt get something by. After all, whose even left to get an alert if something was detected? If you factually saw someone doing the impossible who could you even tell and be assured you'll get a response? Just some things to think about.
    Client hacks for Rift are theoretically possible, but I doubt a server hack, especially since the server structure has changed with the move to the google cloud (so it would have to be a relatively new hack). I just can't imagine that a person with the necessary skills and intelligence would waste time creating such a hack and takes the risk of prosecution just for the personal benefit in an insignificant game, especially in view of the current population and popularity of Rift.

    Have you ever tried one of the hacks you can find on the internet? Would be at least a proof for it or against that these old client hacks still work.

    Collect some of these in your opinion impossible kills (Combatlog) and publish them without names. Maybe this will help the community explain these discontinuities or may reveal an exploit.
    Last edited by Bamul; 10-01-2019 at 06:29 AM.

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bamul View Post
    Client hacks for Rift are theoretically possible, but I doubt a server hack, especially since the server structure has changed with the move to the google cloud (so it would have to be a relatively new hack). I just can't imagine that a person with the necessary skills and intelligence would waste time creating such a hack and takes the risk of prosecution just for the personal benefit in an insignificant game, especially in view of the current population and popularity of Rift.

    Have you ever tried one of the hacks you can find on the internet? Would be at least a proof for it or against that these old client hacks still work.

    Collect some of these in your opinion impossible kills (Combatlog) and publish them without names. Maybe this will help the community explain these discontinuities or may reveal an exploit.
    Ive not tried one of the hacks, though Ive been tempted just so I can see yay or nay to be honest. Im just not willing to risk a keylogger or trojan which are usually attached to hacks, real or not. If I had a burner computer so to speak Id give it a shot, but I dont.

    Ill see if I get the chance in the next few weeks to post some screenshots Ive taken of hard to explain hits. Ive not taken a lot mind you I usually just continue playing without thinking about it. Im sure others have some shots as well. Its not hard to tell when you were 3-4 shotted you know it happens and check your combat log and go, ok yea no one else was hitting me and I literally died that fast.

    Hacks aside it sounds like frags are contributing to a large imbalance and I wish they'd get looked at. Who knows, maybe if they fixed them like simply made a pvp set to attain wed see the playing field equalized and can gauge then if they are the problem or not. If frags allow someone to kill someone else who is pvp max geared in 3-4 globals I personally see this as way too powerful, especially considering the disparity between other souls making for huge power gaps between souls. Im sure someone can do the math on the % gain from one frag focus (spell power/attack power/crit power etc..,) to the next.

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