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Thread: Nerf Bladedancer....

  1. #151
    Prophet of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lulutala View Post
    There are no rogues in this game left that have put as much time, money and effort maximising bladedancer for pvp than balls. It was over a year ago i showed him how dumb the spec was and he's been working on it i imagine every day since so ofcourse he's going to steamroll everyone lol.
    There's a lack of logic in your response, unless you're just reiterating my point. Correct me if I'm wrong but you're suggesting more time = more damage like it's some kind of proportional relationship.

    That's simply not the case, it's not a linear scale, it's a curve that flattens off. That is if we're talking about minor tweaks and perfections. Minor is the key word.

    Now, if you're suggesting there is something major that he's doing differently, that will create more of a rise in the relationship, then this proves my point exactly. He's doing something major that other rogues aren't and I think it's about time that major change was shared so we can all understand why these problems are occurring.

    Interesting how you said Money though. I've never personally found money affects me in PvP considering you can't buy PvP fragments.
    Last edited by Refuge; 07-05-2018 at 10:50 PM.
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  2. #152
    Rift Disciple Lulutala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    There's a lack of logic in your response, unless you're just reiterating my point. Correct me if I'm wrong but you're suggesting more time = more damage like it's some kind of proportional relationship.

    That's simply not the case, it's not a linear scale, it's a curve that flattens off. That is if we're talking about minor tweaks and perfections. Minor is the key word.

    Now, if you're suggesting there is something major that he's doing differently, that will create more of a rise in the relationship, then this proves my point exactly. He's doing something major that other rogues aren't and I think it's about time that major change was shared so we can all understand why these problems are occurring.

    Interesting how you said Money though. I've never personally found money affects me in PvP considering you can't buy PvP fragments.
    More time = more knowledge of the specs ins and outs, who's going to be a threat in a wf, when to play aggressive and when not to etc. The spec also allows him to win wfs that maybe if he was a different spec/class he wouldn't, which means he's getting more pvp fragments which allows him to get stronger.

    Fragments make up a huge chunk of peoples stats, even when i was 69 which was considered op due to the bolstering, his stats were significantly better than mine and that was last year, i wouldn't be surprised if the gap was even bigger now. A gap that players nowadays cannot bridge because the pvp population isn't there to make it possible.

    If we were using the old gearing system before frags, people would be at the same tier as everyone else and see they hit just as hard as he does, but we don't, half our gear stats are hidden and tied to random luck and people assume because someone hits harder than they do it must be hacks/cheats.
    Harrisonford

  3. #153
    Prophet of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lulutala View Post
    More time = more knowledge of the specs ins and outs, who's going to be a threat in a wf, when to play aggressive and when not to etc. The spec also allows him to win wfs that maybe if he was a different spec/class he wouldn't, which means he's getting more pvp fragments which allows him to get stronger.

    Fragments make up a huge chunk of peoples stats, even when i was 69 which was considered op due to the bolstering, his stats were significantly better than mine and that was last year, i wouldn't be surprised if the gap was even bigger now. A gap that players nowadays cannot bridge because the pvp population isn't there to make it possible.

    If we were using the old gearing system before frags, people would be at the same tier as everyone else and see they hit just as hard as he does, but we don't, half our gear stats are hidden and tied to random luck and people assume because someone hits harder than they do it must be hacks/cheats.
    At first I thought you were just not getting my point. Particularly when you were referring to when to play aggressive etc. As a bladedancer than forks out that much damage per second you are always aggressive.. It's got absolutely nothing to do with his play style, that's just a given. Sure you might vanish when you're about to die after 10 people stack up on you. That's not rocket science.

    But then you moved onto fragments. I'm very skeptical about this one, it's basically impossible to get fragments above lvl 3, I don't even know if they exist in game, and if they do, they wouldn't be epic. If he has acquired some, then we're talking 1 or 2, it's like winning a small lottery. Lvl 3-4 on the other hand aren't too hard, and I would say most strong bladedancers already have these maxed out. At this point your Crit Power is more or less sorted.

    Once again, a slight change in stats would not explain the huge difference. It is definitely due to spec/abilities/choice of rotations.
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  4. #154
    Rift Disciple Lulutala's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post

    Once again, a slight change in stats would not explain the huge difference. It is definitely due to spec/abilities/choice of rotations.
    There is no hidden rotation or abuse of mechanics he's just a good player in a game where there are next to none left. It's as simple as that.
    Last edited by Lulutala; 07-07-2018 at 03:51 AM.
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  5. #155
    Rift Disciple hmmpvp's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    I'm very skeptical about this one, it's basically impossible to get fragments above lvl 3, I don't even know if they exist in game, and if they do, they wouldn't be epic. If he has acquired some, then we're talking 1 or 2, it's like winning a small lottery. Lvl 3-4 on the other hand aren't too hard, and I would say most strong bladedancers already have these maxed out.
    To be honest it is not really that heavy of a grind to acquire the 2 tier 2s from fire. Also there is no tier 1 pvp fragments. They might not be all the right main stats but still worth using. From what balls showed me his fragments was not the best, he even claimed I had better fragments than him.

    HF has a valid point, it has more to do with the player base is just not what it use to be when it comes down to good players.
    Last edited by hmmpvp; 07-07-2018 at 09:37 AM.
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  6. #156
    Champion of Telara Kajib's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    Once again, a slight change in stats would not explain the huge difference. It is definitely due to spec/abilities/choice of rotations.
    Noticed, almost every single good player has these on,

    runes and dream orbs on Nightmade tide's shoulders, cape , trinket, necklace and use current PvE earrings.
    More info
    Quote Originally Posted by Maltie View Post
    I cant find Musclepigs post on this, but heres what it included

    Head : Slayers gear + bis dream orb
    Cape : COA cape + rune + dream orb
    Shoulder : COA armor + rune + dream orb
    Chest : 988 main stat (upgrade from 914 gear in wf box)
    Gloves : Slayers
    Belt : Slayers + Dream Orb
    Legs : 988 main stat (upgrade from 914 in wf box) + rune
    Foot : Slayers
    Earrings : Overlord PvE earrings (from intel cache)
    Neck : Nightmare Tide neck (Doesn't matter which) + rune + dream orb.
    Trinkets : Warmonger Trinket (You can get all 3, swap to which is necessary)
    Rings : 621 stats from Reapers Box
    Seal : Agile Slayers Seal (From Rift Store) + Rune
    Weapons : Slayers Dirk/Skullcracker + Bow + Prophetic Runes.
    Focus : Challengers Focus of Assault + All pvp 495 main stat essences with CP as tertiary stat.

    pve fragments are bolstered to infusion level 6 (or 7), so use those until you can replace them with War fragments of equal quality(


    Even if your fragments are somewhat good but you can't afford those, you're well at disadvantage.

    For example this, and whats even better lvl 61 bd ability (Fated Blades) scales well with more attack power.
    Nerf Bladedancer....-scinpt.png

    That's straight up unfair, pve2win and old contents2win.
    Some players have already best fragments you can think of except for t1 which are very few and best gear possible.And for those who exploited pts fragments stats preview gg.
    Theoretically items i have mentioned above adds around 2 - 3 k more ap depending on spec. that's not slight at all.

    Speaking of rotation, BD has one of the easiest rotation. Its about spamming builders and finishers.Just make sure hard hitting builders are the one consuming Deadly Dance stacks which is easy, utilities like twin cleave and EB can be used once a player has 5 combo points before a finisher or mid of builder rotation.

  7. #157
    Champion of Telara Kajib's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lulutala View Post
    There is no hidden rotation or abuse of mechanics he's just a good player in a game where there are next to none left. It's as simple as that.
    Haha except hidden abuse of Alt F4 when things gets tough

  8. #158
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kajib View Post
    Earrings : Overlord PvE earrings (from intel cache)
    I think it's worth noting that this doesn't work for caster classes.
    Last edited by Lokken`; 07-07-2018 at 12:02 PM.
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  9. #159
    RIFT Guide Writer Maltie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kajib View Post
    Speaking of rotation, BD has one of the easiest rotation. Its about spamming builders and finishers.Just make sure hard hitting builders are the one consuming Deadly Dance stacks which is easy, utilities like twin cleave and EB can be used once a player has 5 combo points before a finisher or mid of builder rotation.
    Empyrean Bolt doesn't consume Deadly Dance stacks because its ranged, so you can use it at any point in the rotation

    But I agree Bladedancer is one of the most boring specs now, it got ruined. Bring back NMT BD.
    Last edited by Maltie; 07-07-2018 at 10:10 PM.
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  10. #160
    Prophet of Telara Refuge's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lulutala View Post
    There is no hidden rotation or abuse of mechanics he's just a good player in a game where there are next to none left. It's as simple as that.
    Hmmm, I mean you might just be right. The player base is honestly lacking a lot.

    I personally play Inquisitor, I do not consider myself in anyway a very good player, but at least above average. Other friends of mine would absolutely slaughter me at mechanics & game knowledge, they've shown that in WoW or league of legends.

    But here I feel absolutely dominant. I haven't met an Inquisitor who can come close to 1vs1'ing me. And the only class I fear in a 1vs1 is bladedancer, possibly assassin when played by a very good player. From what I've heard I'm the one with a dam skull above my head.

    So you might be right, there's just no players out there who've invested the same amount of time to perfect their gear, spec and mechanics.

    I still find it very odd when I see a very good player (A) vs. someone on the level of balls (B). And I see B absolutely annihilate A. Both bladedancers, and it's completely 1 sided. I can't comprehend why the outcome is so heavily weighted to one side.


    On a side note, the rings really need to be fixed. I didn't realise the stat difference was that large. Incredibly frustrating when it doesn't affect the weakest classes as well (cleric and mage). Another infuriating advantage not needed. We need to report this. I mean at least this would be an easy fix, and a first step to balance lol..
    Last edited by Refuge; 07-08-2018 at 01:23 AM.
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  11. #161
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    Hmmm, I mean you might just be right. The player base is honestly lacking a lot.

    I personally play Inquisitor, I do not consider myself in anyway a very good player, but at least above average. Other friends of mine would absolutely slaughter me at mechanics & game knowledge, they've shown that in WoW or league of legends.

    But here I feel absolutely dominant. I haven't met an Inquisitor who can come close to 1vs1'ing me. And the only class I fear in a 1vs1 is bladedancer, possibly assassin when played by a very good player. From what I've heard I'm the one with a dam skull above my head.

    So you might be right, there's just no players out there who've invested the same amount of time to perfect their gear, spec and mechanics.

    I still find it very odd when I see a very good player (A) vs. someone on the level of balls (B). And I see B absolutely annihilate A. Both bladedancers, and it's completely 1 sided. I can't comprehend why the outcome is so heavily weighted to one side.


    On a side note, the rings really need to be fixed. I didn't realise the stat difference was that large. Incredibly frustrating when it doesn't affect the weakest classes as well (cleric and mage). Another infuriating advantage not needed. We need to report this. I mean at least this would be an easy fix, and a first step to balance lol..
    To be honest, no one really cares anyone. Pvp is as good as dead at the moment. The past few Days, there was barely a wf going and when there was one that did pop up, only 6 people on each team were playing.

  12. #162
    Champion of Telara Kajib's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    I still find it very odd when I see a very good player (A) vs. someone on the level of balls (B). And I see B absolutely annihilate A. Both bladedancers, and it's completely 1 sided. I can't comprehend why the outcome is so heavily weighted to one side.
    Vs any other BD with similar power/gear, dps doesn't matter much as long it almost the same.

    It's all about how the fight is being executed.
    A Bd that starts a fight with 5 combo points has an increased chance to win mainly due to Deadly dance stacks which can be triggered by an ogcd finisher then proceed with a charge.

    Use of Cc, Break Frees and potions all of these plays an important role missing one of them is a huge disadvantage. For a fight that extends over 30s+ whoever uses the next CC first will mostly like win cause by that time both of players have run out of Break Free.

    Also it's possible to create a distance and range your enemy with 100% blades for a while and even avoid his Cc with Dancing steel.

    Put simply
    have a good start
    shutdown your opponent
    heal, heal heal a lot with potions
    and avoid taking damage while doing damage (sounds crazy but possible)

    Bd is very tricky on 1v1.




    Quote Originally Posted by Maltie View Post
    Empyrean Bolt doesn't consume Deadly Dance stacks because its ranged, so you can use it at any point in the rotation

    But I agree Bladedancer is one of the most boring specs now, it got ruined. Bring back NMT BD.
    My bad am always drunk
    Dw Rift Prime will catch up to NMT BD if they keep up their word about progression and stuffs.


    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    On a side note, the rings really need to be fixed. I didn't realise the stat difference was that large. Incredibly frustrating when it doesn't affect the weakest classes as well (cleric and mage). Another infuriating advantage not needed. We need to report this. I mean at least this would be an easy fix, and a first step to balance lol..
    it has been pointed out a million times but never addressed.
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  13. #163
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    Quote Originally Posted by Refuge View Post
    But here I feel absolutely dominant. .
    You somehow pull amazing dps in raids with 1.4m+ ST inquisitor and carry your team and are super dominant at PvP with cleric when all data points the other way for your class for majority of everyone else.

    Before BD we had to deal with one shot paras and high TTK warlords. We had to deal with mage locks doing 70K dps on 3 targets and reavers in the early part of this expansion. Even before this we had to deal with mostly one button ranger/sab with diffuse which allowed rogues to take no damage for 10 secs and wondering why we got JP nerfed, one button burst ele/pyro with reclaim elements which was a full life cd at the time and we had the parachanters who were basically 1v2 and coming out full health with no pots used.

    Your reputation must precede you for being able to accomplish so much as a cleric through all of this to the point people fear you. The only reason we mark clerics is because they are free favor and easiest to kill besides mages who don't spec FK. And yes the gear imbalance has been stated many many times. So has the imbalance with bolstering for some classes yet through all of that you are somehow slaughter everyone and top dps over everyone, lol.
    Last edited by Aedynn; 07-09-2018 at 10:33 AM.

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    Telaran Slaybae's Avatar
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    You somehow pull amazing dps in raids with 1.4m+ ST inquisitor and carry your team and are super dominant at PvP with cleric when all data points the other way for your class for majority of everyone else
    What ''data'' are you referring to? clerics have been in a quite of agood spot in comparrison to idk, warriors? They have shamans, inqusitior, druid, still a good tank spec and two good healing specs which are all viable as of now (although im not entirely sure about druid but i've seen it pull nice numbers )


    Before BD we had to deal with one shot paras and high TTK warlords. We had to deal with mage locks doing 70K dps on 3 targets and reavers in the early part of this expansion. Even before this we had to deal with mostly one button ranger/sab with diffuse which allowed rogues to take no damage for 10 secs and wondering why we got JP nerfed, one button burst ele/pyro with reclaim elements which was a full life cd at the time and we had the parachanters who were basically 1v2 and coming out full health with no pots used.
    Your Point?

    Your reputation must precede you for being able to accomplish so much as a cleric through all of this to the point people fear you. The only reason we mark clerics is because they are free favor and easiest to kill besides mages who don't spec FK. And yes the gear imbalance has been stated many many times. So has the imbalance with bolstering for some classes yet through all of that you are somehow slaughter everyone and top dps over everyone, lol.
    Putting aside the potential saltiness or jealousy you have over this player, just no...….
    we dont mark clerics in pvp because they are ''easier'' to kill, we mark people who we know needs to die first (may that be a cleric, Frostkeeper farseer and so on).With the current pvp bugs, i wouldn't doubt if clerics could que up and slaughter everyone in pvp, in particular because of one of their souls they have (i will not reveal openly what can make them OP in pvp so i dont start dwindling the playerbase even more).
    Last edited by Slaybae; 07-09-2018 at 03:03 PM.

  15. #165
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    Quote Originally Posted by Slaybae View Post
    What ''data'' are you referring to? clerics have been in a quite of agood spot in comparrison to idk, warriors? They have shamans, inqusitior, druid, still a good tank spec and two good healing specs which are all viable as of now (although im not entirely sure about druid but i've seen it pull nice numbers )
    You don't know much. Let me see you pull 20-30 KBs in a single game with cleric then we can talk about secret OP specs. Make sure you show all the people you killed in that match so I can see it is not your friend or a bot feeding you kills. And yes we been marking clerics for the LONGEST time. Even cleric tanks are easiest to kill.

    And warriors are fantastic in PvP. Nothing really challenges them except a good BD. However, who knows now with the recent changes. As for live Chantion is OP. If cleric had a healer that can dps and hit over 1 million dps I bet you would hear no complaints from them at all. Only warrior complain about this because warrior doesn't want to heal. They want back 1 shot paragons and broken reavers and 1.5 million dps tempest and super man warlords who can fly across the screen and have high ttk and killing power.
    Last edited by Aedynn; 07-11-2018 at 10:37 PM.

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