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Thread: another great WF.....

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    Ascendant butkus's Avatar
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    Default another great WF.....

    this is the state of rifts pvp includes trolling-**** talking-team not even trying for objectives classic grouping.i dont think players know how to look at the stat board to see whos healing and whos doing what. this all took place after i failed trying to get my team to attack the efc for some reason they choose to attack random players on the other side of the map.


    https://youtu.be/kk_ZWlzDRYM
    Last edited by butkus; 02-18-2016 at 05:39 PM.
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    Soulwalker Gretzel's Avatar
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    You don't get to complain about 'trolling' and ****ty WFs when you stand there acting passive-aggressive and refuse to play while your team fights around you. You are part of the problem.
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    Ascendant butkus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gretzel View Post
    You don't get to complain about 'trolling' and ****ty WFs when you stand there acting passive-aggressive and refuse to play while your team fights around you. You are part of the problem.
    did you not read my comment?how can i be the problem when im the ONLY one trying to get my team to play right.getting trolled by potatoes for telling them to attack the marked player/efc,yeah seems right blame me. do you really think standing on the opposite side of the map from the efc is going to win you the match?if you cant see the problems in this wf then your one of them!

    fyi-i pulled more dps then my entire team even after being afk for the last 3 mins, good team right?
    Last edited by butkus; 02-18-2016 at 05:44 PM.
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    Telaran Trieu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gretzel View Post
    You don't get to complain about 'trolling' and ****ty WFs when you stand there acting passive-aggressive and refuse to play while your team fights around you. You are part of the problem.
    Actually yes he does. I somehow end up on teams with Butkus often and must say that he is right to complain about these horrible players. Despite some very loud and at times very descriptive direction these potatoes refuse to do anything productive. Trust me he is not the problem...
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    Soulwalker Gretzel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by butkus View Post
    did you not read my comment?how can i be the problem when im the ONLY one trying to get my team to play right.do you really think standing on the opposite side of the map from the efc is going to win you the match?if you cant see the problems in this wf then your one of them!

    fyi-i pulled more dps then my entire team even after being afk for the last 3 mins, good team right?
    I played WoW from wotlk to mop so I've dealt with a hundred of you. If you want to get your 'team to play right' you'll need a premade, no ifs or buts about it. Going into a match with a bunch of pugs and throwing a fit and fighting with them in the chat will do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. I have done it myself more times than I could count.

    Pulling the highest dps on your team means nothing when the match is objective-based and your team is filled with ******s. You can brag about pulling the highest dps when you have a great team that can handle their ****.

    Instead you stood in the middle of the battle and went back and forth with some other kid and then you came here on the forums with a high and mighty attitude like you are so much better than they are when you were pulling the same ****. I'm not even quite sure what you were trying to prove by recording the video at the point where you gave up and started yelling at this guy; because if what you said were true and you were actually playing until the moment you started recording, the audience sure as hell doesn't see any of it.

    I'm telling you from experience because I dealt with this exact same issue for years and was just as angry (if not much more so) than you are about it. Standing there and fighting with them while refusing to play does absolutely nothing. I had the fortune of being in the top PVP guild on my server and ran premades with the best players I could, so I never had to deal with this **** past that except during the hours when guildees weren't on, and I ****ing hated every second of it because I was often the only person in the BGs who knew how to play; not just his class but also the map. I'd often just not queue at all or sooner leave if it looked that bad.
    Last edited by Gretzel; 02-18-2016 at 05:56 PM.
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    Telaran WarMonkey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trieu View Post
    Actually yes he does. I somehow end up on teams with Butkus often and must say that he is right to complain about these horrible players. Despite some very loud and at times very descriptive direction these potatoes refuse to do anything productive. Trust me he is not the problem...

    Yes. Engaging in swearing and insults is both productive and constructive. Let's add inspirational, as well.

    Part of the problem. Sorry. It goes both ways. The toxicity in PVP is not just from rotting potatoes.

    Caveat: I recognize/respect Butkus as a force who knows what he's doing in PVP, and has for a long time, so don't go there if you are considering it...

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    Ascendant Xclvsive's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Gretzel View Post
    I played WoW from wotlk to mop so I've dealt with a hundred of you. If you want to get your 'team to play right' you'll need a premade, no ifs or buts about it. Going into a match with a bunch of pugs and throwing a fit and fighting with them in the chat will do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. I have done it myself more times than I could count.

    Pulling the highest dps on your team means nothing when the match is objective-based and your team is filled with ******s. You can brag about pulling the highest dps when you have a great team that can handle their ****.

    Instead you stood in the middle of the battle and went back and forth with some other kid and then you came here on the forums with a high and mighty attitude like you are so much better than they are when you were pulling the same ****. I'm not even quite sure what you were trying to prove by recording the video at the point where you gave up and started yelling at this guy; because if what you said were true and you were actually playing until the moment you started recording, the audience sure as hell doesn't see any of it.

    I'm telling you from experience because I dealt with this exact same issue for years and was just as angry (if not much more so) than you are about it. Standing there and fighting with them while refusing to play does absolutely nothing. I had the fortune of being in the top PVP guild on my server and ran premades with the best players I could, so I never had to deal with this **** past that except during the hours when guildees weren't on, and I ****ing hated every second of it because I was often the only person in the BGs who knew how to play; not just his class but also the map. I'd often just not queue at all or sooner leave if it looked that bad.
    Actually, dps does win games. W/o dps you can't kill the enemy team. W/o killing the enemy team you can't pve. If you can't pve in pvp then you can't win.

    And I think the only one acting high and mighty here is you tbh. Bringing up your past and **** on other games, like *****, no one asked...
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    Telaran xXxUnKnownxXx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by butkus View Post
    potatoes
    Does anyone else get the "small Potatoes" theme song stuck in their heads when this amusing word gets thrown around?


  9. #9
    Rift Disciple
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    I must be old, i have no idea what a potato is, legit.
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    Plane Touched Xibitz's Avatar
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    It's amazing how this happens even at 65, you'd expect that from lower brackets and stuff.

    I don't even care anymore if I'm with a team such as this, people will do whatever they feel like. If they listen and reorganize great, if not, whatever, I just go for kills.
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    Ascendant Linolea's Avatar
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    Old enough to remember when it was spelled "potatoe"

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    Soulwalker Gretzel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xclusivee View Post
    Actually, dps does win games. W/o dps you can't kill the enemy team. W/o killing the enemy team you can't pve. If you can't pve in pvp then you can't win.

    And I think the only one acting high and mighty here is you tbh. Bringing up your past and **** on other games, like *****, no one asked...
    Very high quality misinterpretation you've got going there, mister. I brought up my past with the game that Rift directly copies to prove that I know what I'm talking about when it comes to this specific matter, because I've dealt with the exact same thing OP is acting up over many many many many many times.
    DPS HELPS win games, it does not do jack **** when applied improperly. If you sit there bursting the tank when two healers are standing nearby (one holding the objective), your DPS is absolutely meaningless. DPS is not the end all be all that you claim it is, unless Rift had a pure deathmatch mode.
    Last edited by Gretzel; 02-18-2016 at 09:22 PM.
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    Soulwalker Gretzel's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by WarMonkey View Post
    Caveat: I recognize/respect Butkus as a force who knows what he's doing in PVP, and has for a long time, so don't go there if you are considering it...
    I'll admit that I don't know who OP is and am not familiar with his name (I probably have seen him before, but am horrific at remembering names. I do a lot of WFs), but his video is a bit out of context and paints him in a bad light to those who are unfamiliar with him; beginning right as he stops fighting and starts going back and forth with his team.
    Last edited by Gretzel; 02-18-2016 at 09:23 PM.
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    Plane Walker
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    Getting frustrated and venting at your team rarely works, if ever.
    Polite and clear requests via /rw will sometimes have a positive effect.. But If they dont work then i just accept that the majority in the wf have either given up or just dont care. It happens a lot and getting upset about it just ruins your own fun even more.

    Its the 'quitter attitude' that i hate more than cluelessness tbh.
    The crap players can improve hopefully, some of them are probably fairly young kids who just may not be very good, but the abusive/quitters are just unpleasant ppl whose attitudes are a disgrace.

    Ooh im getting a bit ranty..
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    Quote Originally Posted by Trieu View Post
    Actually yes he does. I somehow end up on teams with Butkus often and must say that he is right to complain about these horrible players. Despite some very loud and at times very descriptive direction these potatoes refuse to do anything productive. Trust me he is not the problem...
    In that video, he is the problem, or at least a big part of the problem.

    (And I'm writing a wall of text here because there seem to be a common misconception about these situations). TL : DR at the end.

    In that video, he's not pulling his weight ( hard to do when you're AFK ).
    And before someone replies with "what? He was top DPS!!!" : you can be "not pulling your weight" even if you're the top DPS on your team.

    Ok here's a PSA on matchmaking :
    Teams are balanced to have similar average ELO, which is basically a mix of gear+skill.

    If you are a geared skilled player and everyone else on your team are potatoes, it means that the other team also probably only has 1 geared skilled player and a bunch of potatoes.
    Or if they have TWO geared/skilled players, then their potatoes are probably even more potato-y then yours.

    The potatoes pulled their weight in this warfronts.
    But they were hitting random targets and completely ignoring the healer, while dealing only half his DPS!
    Yup. That's what potatoes do! I assure you, that's what the potatoes on the other team were doing the exact same thing. Your healer was 5th (out of 10) for damage taken, he wasn't getting focused hard either.

    Good players/geared players have to do more. It's expected of them, they are able to do so, and the matchmaker mechanics REQUIRE them to do so. Because if they don't ( and their clone on the enemy team does ) then they lose, because the rest of the potatoes pretty much counter each others by doing meaningless things or tab targetting randomly and pulling **** DPS.

    Just because you're top DPS doesn't mean you're doing enough.
    If you're the best player on your team you're expected to do a hell of a lot more DPS than the rest of the team, because the top DPS on the enemy team will do it. So if you don't, you're the one not pulling your weight on your team, even if you're the top DPS on your team.

    Pulling your weight basically means 'pulling your ELO'. If whatever teams the ELO matched against one another, the top player on the team can have to deal (just an example here) 2m damage to 'do his job'. And if he does 1m damage while the rest of his team play their best and deal 250k each, HE is to blame with his 1m, not his team with the 250k.
    Because the ELO match expects them to deal 250k and him 2m, that's why he put them together, because that's about what the other team will also be doing.
    (It's a bit more complicated than that because it's more than just damage, but you get the point).

    And that being said, when you started AFK'ing it was a still a close game and one guy on your team carried twice. It was still in reach.

    But then the top DPS stops playing so of course it's a roll.

    You seem to do that **** so often ( afk in a game when things seem to go badly ), but don't you think that some of these games could've been turned around?

    What were your odds to win this game if you keep playing? Maybe not 50%, but what if you had say 30%? Isn't that worth playing?

    Yeah, your players aren't geared, they don't deal much damage, they hit targets randomly... That's why they were matched with you. Because on the other team it was likely a similar pattern, a good or a few good players and a bunch of bads.

    When good players don't do much and bad players don't do much, the good players are to blame for the loss. The bad players CAN'T do more than that. Even if they try really hard, there's a limit to what they can do : They're bad.

    But the good player has a much higher limit on what he can do, yet if he choose not to do it, the loss is on him.

    /my two cents

    TL ; DR : Potatoes on both teams are usually pretty equal. It's up to the good/geared players to make the difference and lead by example. You can't expect bad players to do more than "bad". They were likely as bad on the enemy team. And that's another thing that people seem to miss a lot; We often get stuff like "OMG I was 25-0 but we lost, how freaking bad was the rest of our team?". Well, they were probably just as bad as the players who just went 0-25 against you.

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