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  Click here to go to the first Rift Team post in this thread.   Thread: Conquest Testing April 8, 3:00 PM Pacific

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    Rift Team Ocho's Avatar
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    Default Conquest Testing April 8, 3:00 PM Pacific

    Hey folks,
    At 3:00 PM Pacific on Wednesday, April 8, well be testing some upcoming changes to Conquest on the Test Server. Were hoping to get a big turnout, and would love to see you all there! To learn more about how to install the Test client, please check here. Once in game, please feel free to coordinate any teaming or testing in the 65 chat channel.

    There are two main changes that wed like to test, the first of which is limiting the ability to join the queue with more than 5 people. This change is a test of the functionality and how it impacts player experience long term. Raid sized premades have been a subject of significant discussion amongst the community for some time, and were going to roll out this limitation to live servers either with Echoes of Madness or shortly afterwards. This limitation does not signal a change in our overall philosophy of enabling RIFT players to play together as they choose, however we would like to see how this impacts overall participation in Conquest. Once this change goes live well be keeping the eye on the results, and will discuss this limitation with the community after about a month or so of it being in place on the Live Servers.

    The other change that were making is that we are going to prevent joining Conquest once the 5 minute timer starts. This is another experimental change, this time to curb behavior of those who do not participate in CQ but who try to get lucky and end up on the winning team. Obviously this is not the intention of CQ, so were going to test this change and see how it works out.

    Thanks, and we look forward to seeing you folks on the Test Server!

  2. #2
    Ascendant spaceboots's Avatar
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    It will be interesting to see how it impacts precipitation. History has shown players just like to pug stomp.

    Edit: oh wow saw the removal of joining at the end. LOL

    You're gonna have to nerf the weekly quests reqs. I don't have time to actually play every damn CQ ever, especially in the chaos of people trying to make postmades if that will even happen.

    I think the two changes are way to much to try and get good observations at the same time. They both affect each other too much.
    Last edited by spaceboots; 04-06-2015 at 06:53 PM.

  3. #3
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    Just saying, all my incentive to CQ is gone now, especially since I have more Hearts than I know what to do with. I only joined CQ for 3 reasons:

    1) Being in a PM cause someone asked me to join.

    2) Timer loot PA Exp.

    3) Timer Kills.

    I don't even need or want Hearts any more.

    So yeah, that's one less person at least and I'm probably not the only person sharing the same sentiments.


    EDIT: To clarify, CQ is not rewarding at all unless you're in a group that will actually listen to leads. Nor is it fun to run around for days ganking small groups waiting for timer to trickle. It is most definitely not fun for me when There's only an abundance of kills at Timer instead of throughout due to how spread out the maps are.
    Last edited by evantide; 04-06-2015 at 06:03 PM.
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    Ascendant Ianto Jones's Avatar
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    The thing is... you're making two changes that will impact participation, but you're only making one of these tentative. Participation is going to be negatively affected by being unable to join at timer. You can't then turn around and conclude that lower participation is because of 20-man premades. You're modifying two variables and are going to attribute changes to only one of those changes.

    It's almost standard Trion policy to do this... and that's what worries me. You're going to get the wrong conclusion and then reverse the change in a month, and we'll be stuck with 20-man premades forever. Ugh.

    Quote Originally Posted by evantide View Post
    Just saying, all my incentive to CQ is gone now, especially since I have more Hearts than I know what to do with. I only joined CQ for 3 reasons:

    1) Being in a PM cause someone asked me to join.

    2) Timer loot PA Exp.

    3) Timer Kills.

    I don't even need or want Hearts any more.

    So yeah, that's one less person at least and I'm probably not the only person sharing the same sentiments.
    Welp I've yet to get a single Heart so I'll take your spot.

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    Typical of Trion. trying to solve an issue without actually addressing the problem causing it.

    I'm usually pretty supportive of stuff but we have told them time and time again why Conquest is bad and why it is working the way it is. Stopping people from joining at the countdown will just make conquests shrink. The real reason people join late is cause there is no benefit or incentive to playing the whole match. THAT is what needs to be addressed. You need to change fundamentally thew way Conquest rewards players. Until you do that, you will never be able to even begin fixing Conquest.
    Last edited by Khelendross; 04-06-2015 at 07:02 PM.
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    This is not good news
    I need to speak of stuff that I fear is a maddd bad thing looming on the horizon,
    Everyone speaks of conquest PMs going away and only allowing 5 mans to form and enter together. To the pvp community this would be the same as only allowing raid guilds to form with 5 people and Q into a 20 man raid and hope the other groups can work together. The majority of the community are crossing their fingers its a rumor. Sadly in this post it isnt.

    I fear this would seriously kill conquest. . There is only so much taking away that can be done before my friends list stops lighting up . Then ill have to go back to farming crafting mats and making plat or even >gasp >>dungeons<

    I read the forums, most of the people complaining about cq PMS are raiders who arent all that great at pvp, people who are mad they didn't get in on said PM, or people who want an easy ride and I killed them :c.

    They do not complain when there is a PM on their faction. They follow orders and we kill as usual. But their poor planning (which is to join a massive pvp instance alone and with no plan on how to win) shouldn't punish people who have played in cq since 2011. That shouldn't change a play style that has been around for for nearly as long as the game has been live.. If it was such an issue it should have been addressed years ago. But our community was promised that PM's would not be taken away by Trion staff. PM's are the whole point of it.

    Invent a Queuing system as an option for those who are single joining. Don't make it mandatory because alot of people LIKE to solo in and sneak around and snipe. Or give them Steppes. Make that a 5 man Q only. It might make it popular again (I personally like it when there are people, but there just isnt.)

    Just my 2 cents...
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    Rift Master Grrrrl's Avatar
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    Conquest Testing April 8, 3:00 PM Pacific-.png
    Might I mention I hate dungeons...

    But the timer thing... I am indifferent i am usually playing the duration.
    Last edited by Grrrrl; 04-06-2015 at 07:15 PM.
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    Timer change is pretty dumb, now you will just see 100 kills left join now

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    Actually, i just thought of something. Late night CQs will be even worse now if one team gets organized first. Have everyone rush timer and bam, GG no re to everyone else.
    Meciel - Mage - Defer Death - Greybriar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grrrrl View Post
    Everyone speaks of conquest PMs going away and only allowing 5 mans to form and enter together. To the pvp community this would be the same as only allowing raid guilds to form with 5 people and Q into a 20 man raid and hope the other groups can work together. The majority of the community are crossing their fingers its a rumor. Sadly in this post it isnt.
    As opposed to the current system where the PVE equivalent would be allowing 20 people to queue into normal mode Iron Tomb.

    Not saying these changes are good or bad, just saying that analogy is pretty flawed since the current way that CQ works is not really similar to how a 20 man pve raid works currently.

  11. #11
    Rift Master Grrrrl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amshala View Post
    As opposed to the current system where the PVE equivalent would be allowing 20 people to queue into normal mode Iron Tomb.

    Not saying these changes are good or bad, just saying that analogy is pretty flawed since the current way that CQ works is not really similar to how a 20 man pve raid works currently.
    So raiding guilds do not preform their raids to go clear zones? That was my point. You get your healers, your tank/ or tanks, your support, and dps..
    CQ is a zone that can accommodate a hundred or so people per faction, to limit how many Q into CQ to 5 is a handicap.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Grrrrl View Post
    So raiding guilds do not preform their raids to go clear zones? That was my point. You get your healers, your tank/ or tanks, your support, and dps..
    CQ is a zone that can accommodate a hundred or so people per faction, to limit how many Q into CQ to 5 is a handicap.
    My point is that people do not preform 20 players to go clear normal iron tomb, which is about on par with how difficult it is to play conquest currently in a PM unless the other teams all have 20 man PMs as well.

    LImiting CQ to 5 is a handicap for those that want to queue 20 yeah, it's also a handicap to solo players to allow 20 man organized raids to queue into CQ. Trion isnt' going to make both solo players and premade players happy unless they split the queue, which probably isn't a good idea anyway, might be worth trying or w/e but I think it would just lead to excessive queue times for premades unless they use a totally broken matchmaker. If you look at how the CQ matchmaker currently works, it just plops an entire 20 man premade onto one team, likely the one with the least amount of players. IF they segragated queues and only one premade queued up, does the matchmaker start a 20v0 match? What if no one else queues, free loots for the 20 players in ~10 minutes? Would those that like to queue premade be ok with that? If so, maybe that woudl work afterall since those that solo queue would have they're premade free CQ. If those that premade actually want to play "PVP" in CQ, the matchmaker would have to wait till another premade queues, which during the off-hours could take a long long time.

    Just look at League for example, they recognized this issue and segregated queues, solo queue is generally fine over there (even though they allow duo-queueing). At least tha't how it was when I last played League which was some time ago. THey even had a ELO handicap in place for people that duo-queued which would make them face opponents that had a higher ELO to account for them having a pre-formed group. People that come from these types of games (MOBAs in general) have expectations that they aren't just going to be fodder for organized groups that formed before queueing and there certainly is going to be a lot of people that try out Rift that have past experience playing a MOBA due to the popularity of them.
    Last edited by Amshala; 04-06-2015 at 10:06 PM.

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    Ascendant Slipmat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    .
    The other change that were making is that we are going to prevent joining Conquest once the 5 minute timer starts
    Sounds good and a long overdue change to Conquest, pre-mades i don't really care about, at least here in Europe most "pre-mades" are literally formed in 65 chat 15 minutes before the next match begins.

    Starts with 'LFG Conquest', if it's a "pro PvP'er" you might get asked to link 5/5 MS to gain entry to this most exclusive club but usually it's just the first 19 to write + or other such nonsense in chat.

    The difference between this "pre-made" and a random first 20 to queue into Conquest? absolutely none but for whatever reason the mentality of "we're a pre-made" kicks in and suddenly they're an organized flock of sheep with a shepherd as opposed to a random flock.

    The joining at 5 minutes though was probably one of the banes of anyone that actually did want to play Conquest as intended, everyone is guilty of it, myself included but to be fair, all it did was promote laziness and opportunistic behavior, before anyone jumps in and thinks "there's Slip jumping on the bandwagon again" i've been one of the more vocal advocates of dropping this joining at 5 mins thing.

    I've probably been suggesting this change since Conquest began, certainly have been suggesting it change for months now in any Thread that pops up regarding ways to change Conquest. Hopefully it's a start to get Conquest into a state where people want to do it and not just jump in for 5 minutes and hope to get onto the "winning" team without actually contributing anything to deserve getting onto the winning team.

    The journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step

  14. #14
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    I vote.... no chance at hearts if you join at timer! /hateinc.....

    But you can still get your VS and CQ win. LOL.

  15. #15
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    unless youre locking raid groups the number of players joining as a premade doesnt matter, they will just form the desired groups after entering CQ.
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