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Thread: Suggestion: Damage/Healing Effected By Range

  1. #1
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    Default Suggestion: Damage/Healing Effected By Range

    I had a passing thought on how to balance the current range-heavy meta of our current warfronts, and decided to flesh it out a bit for feedback. this thought was spurred by Snap's comment in the warrior forums that ranged DPS needs to be nerfed. Rather than nerf ranged souls, why no nerf range itself.

    So my suggestion: make it so that damage is reduced by 1%-1.5% for every meter separating the target from the caster. So a Pyro attacking a Paragon from 5 meters away would be applying 92-95% of his 'maximum' damage (and the Paragon applying 92-95% of his 'maximum' damage as well), but a Pyro attacking the Paragon from 35 meters away would only be applying 47-65% of his 'maximum' damage.

    The same mechanic would be applied to healers as well, forcing healers to position themselves closer to their intended targets in order to maximize the healing they can provide for their allies.

    The benefits of such a dynamic:
    - The front lines would no longer be thirty meters apart. DPS would have to move closer to deal better damage, and closer still to unload their burst at maximum damage potential.
    - Melee would be far more viable than it currently is: melee would take less damage from those rooting and sniping from maximum distance, and could more easily approach enemies without being blown up in transit.
    - Assuming the front lines get closer to each other, melee would once again be able to engage and disengage with allied healers and support close by.
    - Allies would have to cluster closer to their healers for better heals, making them prime targets for AoE and AoE CC. Healers would also need to position themselves closer to their allies on the front line in order to effectively heal them. No longer would healers be able to stand 50 meters away from the enemy while providing effective healing.
    - Cross-healing is weakened as scattered healers would heal each other for less, unless those healers choose to cluster together to maximize cross-healing (in which case they would be making themselves prime targets for AoE/CC/Doms). Meanwhile self-healing is improved for those healers who know how to kite and maintain a safer distance from opposing DPS. Chloro's would benefit from this dynamic while other healers would have to adjust to being in range of enemy fire more often.
    - Tank pulls would be significantly stronger, as they pull their hapless victims closer to opposing DPS (more damage received) and further away from their healers (less healing received).
    - Kicks/Knockback takes on a new strategic element: Kicking a healer 10 meters further from his allies suddenly acts like a 10-15% healing debuff.
    - PvP (possibly) becomes more interesting as range takes on a completely different element and becomes one of the primary calculations to weigh during battles.

    Cons:
    - We may very well end up with warfronts full of numpties firing away from 35 meters at 47% damage as the PvP/PvE population fails to adjust to the new mechanics. Healing stalemates ensue with even the worst of healing happening.


    This may be a terrible idea, and perhaps even too difficult/troublesome to code. At this point it is merely a thought, but one that was entertaining to run with.

  2. #2
    Plane Touched Rikalus's Avatar
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    I can't find a reason in there why anyone who plays a ranged class be it dps, heals, cc or whatever would queue for this. I know I wouldn't.

    I play ranged classes for exactly that reason. The range.
    Rikalus. Retired lvl 60 P76 Noob Mage. Bloodiron *Blue Team*
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rikalus View Post
    I can't find a reason in there why anyone who plays a ranged class be it dps, heals, cc or whatever would queue for this. I know I wouldn't.

    I play ranged classes for exactly that reason. The range.
    You still have the range, but just as fire-arms get less accurate the further you are from the target, so would spells and ranged physical abilities.

    Obviously there are a lot of people who would be opposed to this change - especially those who play ranged DPS and healers. Firstly, significant change is naturally resisted. And secondly, this is a nerf to range and a correction to the meta that makes melee unviable for PvP.

    I don't expect the PvP community to like this suggestion, especially those who can't look past their own playstyles to consider the overall balance of the game. That said, there are probably other significant pitfalls to this suggestion that I have not considered. So, meh.
    Last edited by Nefelia; 04-02-2015 at 07:10 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nefelia View Post
    You still have the range, but just as fire-arms get less accurate the further you are from the target, so would spells and ranged physical abilities.

    Obviously there are a lot of people who would be opposed to this change - especially those who play ranged DPS and healers. Firstly, significant change is naturally resisted. And secondly, this is a nerf to range and a correction to the meta that makes melee unviable for PvP.

    I don't expect the PvP community to like this suggestion, especially those who can't look past their own playstyles to consider the overall balance of the game. That said, there are probably other significant pitfalls to this suggestion that I have not considered. So, meh.
    So kind of like the fall off on damage in eve Online?

  5. #5
    Rift Disciple Mukoswave's Avatar
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    Default Great Idea

    I'm really liking this idea, hope the devs utilize it
    Last edited by Mukoswave; 04-02-2015 at 08:47 AM.
    Quote Originally Posted by Violacea View Post
    I admit, even I am not genius enough to design a game with PvP, that gets filled with players who hate dislike PvP engaging in it, and ruin the PvP for the people who want to PvP. I mean, let's hand it. That is pretty insane genius. I am thinking of the potential I could have in life if I mastered this. If I could design something and get people who don't even want to do it, flooding my gates doing it on their own will.

  6. #6
    Rift Master Sezex's Avatar
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    will never happen

  7. #7
    Rift Disciple
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    Sure and make melee do less dmg in melee but more at range...

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    Ascendant Zehne's Avatar
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    And then the Game devolves into one giant snorefest because the only ability you can use after debilitate wears off is your own aoe debilitate.


    Just saying, that is exactly what would happen if said changes occurred.

  9. #9
    Ascendant spaceboots's Avatar
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    I think it's backwards if anything.

  10. #10
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    I am not against the idea, I just think it needs to be developed more. There are other factors to consider like movement. First and foremost, I would like to know how anyone could run at full speed and accurately hit ranged targets, they should miss more than they hit. For magical casters, how do they do all their invocations while running? Oh that's right, everything worth using is instant cast.I think if they made some changes to instant cast, like get rid of it for anything but melee and physical range, it would help big time. Ranged would have to play smart, no more jousting while still dealing full dps. Look, if melee jousts, their dps drops to zero, so why does range get to joust and still deal damage?
    Quote Originally Posted by Hailolyergory View Post
    All, Please nerf paper it is too strong, but leave scissors alone they are fine.
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    Ascendant Bliter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by query View Post
    Sure and make melee do less dmg in melee but more at range...
    Their damage should drop with their health. How does someone at 1% health still have the juice to swing like he is perfectly fine?
    Quote Originally Posted by Hailolyergory View Post
    All, Please nerf paper it is too strong, but leave scissors alone they are fine.
    Yours Truly,
    Rock.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Cenii View Post
    So kind of like the fall off on damage in eve Online?
    Healers without range? They may as well just try to heal naked. They would never survive.

  13. #13
    Plane Touched Rikalus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nefelia View Post
    You still have the range, but just as fire-arms get less accurate the further you are from the target, so would spells and ranged physical abilities.
    I guess they could reduce melee attack speed at close range in line with the weapon equiped, Two handers are useless for in your face close combat. If melee classes had to maintain an optimal distance in relation to weapon type I think it would be an interesting change.
    Rikalus. Retired lvl 60 P76 Noob Mage. Bloodiron *Blue Team*
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  14. #14
    Plane Touched zasen's Avatar
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    i thought about this for a while but never got around to posting it but i think a good start would be to reduce range in pvp

    35m used to a mm thing then as the game progressed it became an everybody thing.

    bring back 30m in pvp as a start to controlling the range fest.

  15. #15
    Plane Touched BigTerj's Avatar
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    Cool idea to add a little bit a realism to the game. Unfortunately, people playing ranged like playing the game in easy mode and will not be happy when you neft them simply because they are doing what their spec was designed to do.

    Consider a howitzer, it doesn't care how far the munition goes, it still explodes with the same force. BUT, the accuracy does in fact decrease significantly with increased range, so I like that aspect of your argument. There should be an accuracy or "hit" degradation for long distance. I would say that something like 100% damage up to 25m, then they are degraded by a X% every meter beyond that. That might encourage some closer game play without forcing the ranged players into melee range because that is simply unfair. In warfare you would never put your ranged assets near the front line to get obliterated.
    Bigterj - <Grievance> - Wolfsbane

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