+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 23
Like Tree1Likes

Thread: How complicated is it to fix PVP?

  1. #1
    Plane Touched Liandell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    282

    Default How complicated is it to fix PVP?

    So after 5 months since 3.0, last week a dev finally posted about fixing pvp gearing on the forums and the result is an extra 800 raid marks a week.

    Somehow the countless players who have spent these last months providing the devs, through these forums, with countless solutions to pvp gearing have not been understood.

    PvP gearing is broken because raid gear is better. Giving an incremental increase to raid marks doesn't fix that because raid weapons and accessories and essences are not available through pvp and the debolster system only effects relic raid gear.

    It's rather unfathomable this simple point is not understood by the devs, can we get real solutions now?

  2. #2
    Ascendant Kronos v's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    7,232

    Default

    what did you think the faeblight debacle event was for?

    also, the gearing is not the biggest problem with pvp. the queue system is, and it was introduced mid SL.

    I'm not saying that the gear issue is not a problem, just that it isn't the biggest one, and there has been attempts made to mitigate it. (I'm also of the opinion that the sparkle debacle actually made the problem worse, rather than better - raiders got even more raid gear, while casuals were left with a couple of pieces of tank gear they'll never use).

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    Or to put it more simply, it doesn't matter if you're topping the charts if you're killing the wrong people.

  3. #3
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Riane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    5,612

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kronos v View Post
    I'm also of the opinion that the sparkle debacle actually made the problem worse, rather than better - raiders got even more raid gear, while casuals were left with a couple of pieces of tank gear they'll never use.
    Eh, honestly I am gonna disagree there. Majority of the people raiding already (that have been for awhile) pretty much have had a lot of raid pieces already sans some accessories or maybe a BIS drop (instead of mark piece.)

    I have seen A LOT of non-raiders that have either an epic weapon or the relic variant, a lot w/ really good accessories.. It's honestly a huge mixed bag. I have a lot of friends that raid that got duplicate items (that they earned from raids) or tank items.. An even smaller handful that lucked out w/ a weapon. Don't know anyone that got a trinket tho.

  4. #4
    Rift Chaser
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    334

    Default

    The changes they made really only affected latecomers, like myself who took a break. Or maybe people that want to mix up their offstats with different gear. So for me, I can upgrade to Ephemeral quicker, which is nice and I think a positive change for fresh faces.

    But I don't think its their goal to make any of it as effective as dungeon and raid acquired gear in the end.. And that's pretty sad. I suspect PVP gear will always be a tier lower than PVE.

    However, if they buff plane breaker gear a bit, shorten it's upgrade cost slightly, that would be another good step IMO. Also getting them to adjust the greater essences, and the supposedly weak weapon procs would be nice. I think getting anything more than that though is unlikely.

  5. #5
    Ascendant Kronos v's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    7,232

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Riane View Post
    Eh, honestly I am gonna disagree there. Majority of the people raiding already (that have been for awhile) pretty much have had a lot of raid pieces already sans some accessories or maybe a BIS drop (instead of mark piece.)

    I have seen A LOT of non-raiders that have either an epic weapon or the relic variant, a lot w/ really good accessories.. It's honestly a huge mixed bag. I have a lot of friends that raid that got duplicate items (that they earned from raids) or tank items.. An even smaller handful that lucked out w/ a weapon. Don't know anyone that got a trinket tho.
    someone disagreed with me on the interwebs! call the cyber police!


    raiders getting duplicate items from the sparkle quest is rifts version of what the kids call "First world problems".
    more that the actual drops (which were generally bad all round) it is the raiders who were more in a position to grind out the quest every week, while the casuals (those the quest was intended to help) needed two weeks to finish the quest once. those already ahead in gear got twice as much from the quest as those being left behind.
    the sparkle quest was rifts version of trickle down economics, and about as effective.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    Or to put it more simply, it doesn't matter if you're topping the charts if you're killing the wrong people.

  6. #6
    Ascendant Rheven's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    1,934

    Default

    How complicated? Seems well beyond current resources.
    Seastone (All Defiant; All the Time)
    [Seven Sisters] Guera, 70/100 Eth Rogue; Perlita, 70/100 Kelari Magician; Gitana 70 Eth Drugs/Outfits/Rings
    Carmelita 70/100 Eth Rogue Guns/Armor/Runes; Preciosa 70/76 Eth Magician; Chula 70/100 Kelari Rogue Survival

  7. #7
    RIFT Fan Site Operator Riane's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2011
    Posts
    5,612

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Kronos v View Post
    it is the raiders who were more in a position to grind out the quest every week, while the casuals (those the quest was intended to help) needed two weeks to finish the quest once. those already ahead in gear got twice as much from the quest as those being left behind.
    the sparkle quest was rifts version of trickle down economics, and about as effective.
    Casuals taking "two weeks" to finish it doesn't make any sense because "raiders" and "casuals" have the same "path" required to finish the quest. I was "casual" with finishing my quest every week. With that I mean I passively earned a large majority of mine from PVPing. I didn't go out of my way and spend x amount of time farming zone events.

    I think 1/5 quests I had finished "early" and the others I pretty much finished on Tuesday night.

    tl;dr it's the individual--not raider vs casual. Casuals can be hardcore and raiders can be hardcore. Casuals can be 'lazy' and raiders can be lazy.

  8. #8
    Rift Chaser Xnats's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    323

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rheven View Post
    How complicated? Seems well beyond current resources.
    I have to concur with that statement.
    Corinze@Wolfsbane

  9. #9
    Plane Touched Liandell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    282

    Default

    No one is even asking for new pvp content, it isn't even contemplated by the remaining player base that proper warfronts or conquest maps or even pvp world events will be added.

    All that's being asked for now is a gearing path through pvp that is equivalent to the best gear in pvp. There are two simple options, the devs can lower the ceiling on gear in pvp to include only "expert gear" since that's as high as pvp gear can be upgraded too or pvp gear can be buffed to be the equivalent of raid gear and accessories/weapons can be made available for marks that equal ones from raids.

    This is such a basic request that should have been included in 3.0 when it was released.

  10. #10
    Telaran
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    87

    Default Weapon Vendor?

    [QUOTE=Liandell;4989790]No one is even asking for new pvp content, it isn't even contemplated by the remaining player base that proper warfronts or conquest maps or even pvp world events will be added.

    All that's being asked for now is a gearing path through pvp that is equivalent to the best gear in pvp. There are two simple options, the devs can lower the ceiling on gear in pvp to include only "expert gear" since that's as high as pvp gear can be upgraded too or pvp gear can be buffed to be the equivalent of raid gear and accessories/weapons can be made available for marks that equal ones from raids.

    This is such a basic request that should have been included in 3.0 when it was released.

    Maybe its just me, but I liked it when I could click on a vendor and see the Weapon that i wanted to grind for, work for, play for, ..what ever, the point is..
    I could see that thing, and i would set a goal to get it.
    now with all the RNG and , only a path through PVE for BIS weapons, trinkets, etc..,all that is gone....
    As Kronos said so well..what I am going to do with 6 pairs of shoes?
    who thought that was a good deal?

  11. #11
    Champion of Telara
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    1,331

    Default

    I've been in one T1 Raid one time since NT released and nothing dropped, yet I have had no problem keeping up a decent level of gear.

  12. #12
    Ascendant Violacea's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2011
    Posts
    12,128

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Liandell View Post

    It's rather unfathomable this simple point is not understood by the devs, can we get real solutions now?
    I reached this conclusion like 3 weeks before 3.0. I am sorry more are feeling it now. But yes, it is unfathomable what they did to PvP.

    If they served up anything with an A+, it was the destruction of their games PvP. I've stopped trying to wrap my mind around this decision making and written it off as a moving forward desire to make PvE content a main game focus, and PvP more of a side game/activity, not a main avenue of gameplay.
    Last edited by Violacea; 01-16-2015 at 10:39 AM.
    New round up of some high rank matches
    Chun-Li*E.Honda*Evil Ryu
    Abel*Ibuki*Dhalsim
    Gouken*Zangief*Ryu

  13. #13
    Champion of Telara
    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Posts
    1,331

    Default

    PvP is hardly any different at all than it was before 3.0.

  14. #14
    Plane Touched Liandell's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Posts
    282

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Caeus View Post
    PvP is hardly any different at all than it was before 3.0.
    Yes because no new major pvp content has been released since steppes for CQ ("pvp"). They added 2 warfronts and only just fixed them to be somewhat fun.

    Any number of us could go on at lengths about pvp problems: class balance, broken elo system, premades v pugs, lag in conquest, no open world pvp, barely a fraction of new pvp content compared to pve. The list just doesn't end.

    But instead the most basic element of a mmo, gear progression, has been broken for players who focus on pvp and trion has offered no reasonable means to fix it.

  15. #15
    Plane Touched Fusscle's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2014
    Posts
    273

    Default

    Having a Dev dedicated to pvp would be a good place to start. Right now the mindset is towards Raiding > than everything else. This is wrong. If the next expansion moves the downbolster up further, it would be a terrible move. And that's just the most basic element as Liandel pointed out.

    Quote Originally Posted by Liandell View Post
    Any number of us could go on at lengths about pvp problems: class balance, broken elo system, premades v pugs, lag in conquest, no open world pvp, barely a fraction of new pvp content compared to pve. The list just doesn't end.

    But instead the most basic element of a mmo, gear progression, has been broken for players who focus on pvp and trion has offered no reasonable means to fix it.
    Fusscle of Cheat Engine

+ Reply to Thread
Page 1 of 2 1 2 LastLast

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts