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Thread: Suggested Library of the Runemasters Changes--Incentive for DPS to pick up runes?

  1. #1
    Ascendant ecru's Avatar
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    Default Suggested Library of the Runemasters Changes--Incentive for DPS to pick up runes?

    I really liked the changes made to Ghar Station Eyn in the recent patch, which gave DPS incentive to pick up eggs by giving them a damage increase while holding one. Teams who stacked healers were no longer rewarded with points for standing in a corner healing themselves until an egg/stone killed them, and instead the team whose dps picks up runes can roll over the team who doesn't if their team supports them.

    Seeing how well these changes have worked to make Ghar Station Eyn a lot more fun to play and added more depth to the match beyond standing around and healing yourself until you die, I think Library matches would benefit from the same changes, although perhaps not the same 25% damage increase--maybe something a bit less, possibly 15% or so, due to the map being as small as it is and preventing 3-4 dps from rolling over the opposing team all with a 25% damage increase as they teleport back down from their spawn.

    As it is now, teams who stack heals with no real dps can easily win a match if they simply pick up enough runes and stay alive, rewarding people for doing nothing but standing around and healing themselves, which to me isn't really pvp, isn't fun to do, and isn't fun to play against. I've recently seen games where kills are 5:1 in favor of the losing team, but since so many runes spawn later on in the match, it becomes very easy for 5-6 healers to grab runes and stay alive long enough to win while not really participating in pvp at all.
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    RIFT Guide Writer Meaghanne's Avatar
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    I think this is a great idea!

    Only thing I'd add here is maybe an increase in damage taken depending on the amount of heals received if there isn't damage output? I'm not sure if that would work though, it is a game mechanic to hide and heal yourself while your DPS gets slaughtered.
    Last edited by Meaghanne; 01-14-2015 at 02:27 PM.
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    Library is fine as is. The last thing it needs is an advantage for the team holding the most runes, hence leading to more lob-sided matches. There already are incentives for DPS to pick up runes: winning the match and receiving more attention from healers.

    Don't fix what isn't broken.
    Last edited by Nefelia; 01-14-2015 at 05:01 PM.

  4. #4
    RIFT Guide Writer Meaghanne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nefelia View Post
    There already are incentives for DPS to pick up runes: winning the match and receiving more attention from healers.

    Don't fix what isn't broken.
    I disagree with you here, they don't always get more attention from healers. Healers stand alone and heal themselves while the DPS run around in circles in the middle never picking up runes.

    Healers will win a match over DPS in Library.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meaghanne View Post
    I disagree with you here, they don't always get more attention from healers. Healers stand alone and heal themselves while the DPS run around in circles in the middle never picking up runes.

    Healers will win a match over DPS in Library.
    The team that gathers its healers, runes, and DPS in the center wins. Healers hiding away in a corner are easy pickings for the first rogue to cross their path.

    There are matches in which both teams are bad and the battle devolves into a ridiculous game of hide and seek. Some healers just don't know how to play that warfront properly. Does it really need a mechanic change to try to fix this problem? Would your suggested change lead too easily to one-sided domination of one team over the other? I'm on the fence on this, at best.

  6. #6
    RIFT Guide Writer Meaghanne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nefelia View Post
    The team that gathers its healers, runes, and DPS in the center wins. Healers hiding away in a corner are easy pickings for the first rogue to cross their path.

    There are matches in which both teams are bad and the battle devolves into a ridiculous game of hide and seek. Some healers just don't know how to play that warfront properly. Does it really need a mechanic change to try to fix this problem? Would your suggested change lead too easily to one-sided domination of one team over the other? I'm on the fence on this, at best.
    I think what Ecru is trying to say is how the subtle Ghar change has made that map more active, people aren't hiding as much. The suggestion could be the same for Library. I'd like to see less people hiding (and whining about lack of heals) and more people working as a team.
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    Ascendant asianguywithacamera's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meaghanne View Post
    I disagree with you here, they don't always get more attention from healers. Healers stand alone and heal themselves while the DPS run around in circles in the middle never picking up runes.

    Healers will win a match over DPS in Library.
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    The other team won because they not only had more heals, they had smarter healers.
    I could've easily gone 25-0 or 30-0 in that match if I didn't pick up the runes but I was actually trying to win instead of fluff my numbers. Usually I'll let the lower dps players do the objectives (and eventually die) while I kill off their rune holders and healers.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Meaghanne View Post
    I think what Ecru is trying to say is how the subtle Ghar change has made that map more active, people aren't hiding as much. The suggestion could be the same for Library. I'd like to see less people hiding (and whining about lack of heals) and more people working as a team.
    The change in play style at Ghar is more likely due to the reduction of stones. Previously, three could get stones from the side and cross-heal each other. Now, there is only one stone available on the side. A single healer can grab it and hide if he so wishes, while the others are forced to make a play for the middle or the opposite side.

  9. #9
    Prophet of Telara
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    I agree with Ecru, there has to be a incentive for players that will never pick up a stone because in their mind they dont think about winning the game but killing them. With a buff from stones they will pick them up.

  10. #10
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    Ecru hit the nail on the coffin. And the same can go for particularly whitefall with the healfest in the middle. I would almost suggest something like this for the first thing you pick up. Always in the middle a minute or 2 after game start: Just with that first spawn I think it should have like a 30m radius thingy around it reducing healing across the board by 90% rather than the 75% or whatever it is right now.

    The later spawns are fine I think.

    I like the changes to blighted antechamber though and to ghar station eyn. Good job on those!!!

  11. #11
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    I'm sorry, but i hate it when dps pick up the runes in Library. The rune makes you a pretty big target, and you don't have the health or mitigation to take big hits. I can see grabbing them later in the match when a lot of runes spawn and its a mad scramble grab the rune those extra points can be the difference. Too often though i see a dps pick up a rune early and after a few short ticks and a simple burst for him to go down. DPS still have a place there, but early part of the match it isn't holding the rune. I think this place is a perfect example of picking the right soul for the map and your team.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Studly View Post
    I'm sorry, but i hate it when dps pick up the runes in Library. The rune makes you a pretty big target, and you don't have the health or mitigation to take big hits. I can see grabbing them later in the match when a lot of runes spawn and its a mad scramble grab the rune those extra points can be the difference. Too often though i see a dps pick up a rune early and after a few short ticks and a simple burst for him to go down. DPS still have a place there, but early part of the match it isn't holding the rune. I think this place is a perfect example of picking the right soul for the map and your team.
    The problem is, dps get criticized if we don't pick up but also if we do pick up. I prefer letting the healers take them but not hiding away from mid. It's such a small platform that rune holders end up taking more damage from each other and when you spread out, it causes LoS issues with the pillars and stairs.

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