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Thread: @Warriors

  1. #31
    Plane Walker deathstormer's Avatar
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    really a nerf to warlords is a nerf to all you guys who are you going to get to go front line in a fight? S&B tanks? whats going to happen to all you squishies when there is no warlord left to soak up all that damage intended for you? tunign odwn the 61 point version yeah ok it does maybe need it but nerfing it at 48 points just destroys hybrids.
    Last edited by deathstormer; 07-10-2014 at 11:41 PM.
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  2. #32
    Plane Touched HeLLBoY77's Avatar
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    I haven't checked in a wf but on practice dummy in TB KF crits for 8198 with 1361CP. If its any indication..

  3. #33
    Plane Touched SpellwarriorX's Avatar
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    Default So what is really wrong with warlord and the warrior class?

    I would be all for the nerf, except even though it has been said countless of times there is still no change to make other warrior souls play better in pvp. An ae stun or fear should be added since warlord has no decent cc, except roots. Warlord is only mainly op as a melee spec because of its multiple charges, gap closing skills and that ranged mitigation combined with normal mitigation a lot better compared to other souls. Also don't forget that ae damage from clear the breach and killing field. For instance, a sin could dominate a warlord 1v1 any day.

    Melee is generally messed up in this game. This game has got some skills mixed up between different types of souls. Ask yourself this why do range souls have ranged ae stuns? Answer: thanks for making melee making unviable as much as possible Trion!?
    Ranged souls should only have snares,binds and stuns. It is melee that needs the op cc and multiple breaks being in the front-line and not ranged! As usual melee will never be fixed in the game. As a result, if nothing is done there will only be mainly rogues in warfronts in 3.0. So people say warriors got paragon. I don't consider the soul a true warrior melee spec mainly because grasping the horizon is a comical skill that gives 20m range. The skill also gives no damage penalty, unless you count death touch, which still can't be used from range when this skill is active. So why were these skill made in the first place, along with tempest with shock pulse at 0? because we all know be Trion is bad at making good pvp mechanics. So this is the situation we have currently: be ranged, have slip away, bring some op pocket healers; otherwise, roll warlord or gg.

    Warriors are so messed up and many good souls had are now ruined did you know champion was originally a damage soul that was supposed to specialize in burst damage 1v1.

    • "The Champion class is available under the Warrior calling. Champions are powerful Warriors who excel at melee combat. Wielding massive two-handed weapons, these battle-tested fighters find few equals in one-on-one battle"

    • "The Paragon class is available under the Warrior calling. The Paragon moves like a furious storm, never giving his enemy time to regroup. A master of dual-wielding, he uses parries and disciplined forms to build up power attacks and stay out of danger."

    I lol'd when I read this:
    • "Paragons suffer against healers who can outpace their steady damage output, and these methodical warriors tend to be weaker against opponents who specialize in burst damage."

    source: http://rift.wikia.com/wiki/RIFT_Wiki

    The souls are sadly only catered for pve players since storm legion, which, consequently, rendered many souls, especially of the warrior class broken or useless. Warlord was also originally designed to be the support class, and only excelled if your team was around. Atm I believe the class devs clearly don't know what they are doing, except nerfing the damage of the only good pvp damage soul without any payoffs ie. cc cause they are to lazy. Another example is the recent nerf "tempest". There was no payoff to make the soul better cause they are to lazy. In an playing environment with better gear standardization,matchmaking.It would then easy to find some fine tweaks for other souls to be balanced.

    I gather the devs are only limited to changing values on existing code, to satisfy the qq nerf @ forums.In the future, they might have to modify some stats for the new upcoming gear and minor tweaks to existing gear. Also look forward to copy and pasting over from pve to pvp. Now that's a good game.
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  4. #34
    Plane Touched RainDogs's Avatar
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    Cutting dps output in a healing intensive state of this game? If they were concerned about wl's they should bring other souls up to the same output. ttk is way too slow in wf's now. It makes for a stale game that isn't dynamic nor fast pace.
    Last edited by RainDogs; 07-11-2014 at 01:46 AM.

  5. #35
    Plane Walker deathstormer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpellwarriorX View Post
    I would be all for the nerf, except even though it has been said countless of times there is still no change to make other warrior souls play better in pvp. An ae stun or fear should be added since warlord has no decent cc, except roots. Warlord is only mainly op as a melee spec because of its multiple charges, gap closing skills and that ranged mitigation combined with normal mitigation a lot better compared to other souls. Also don't forget that ae damage from clear the breach and killing field. For instance, a sin could dominate a warlord 1v1 any day.

    Melee is generally messed up in this game. This game has got some skills mixed up between different types of souls. Ask yourself this why do range souls have ranged ae stuns? Answer: thanks for making melee making unviable as much as possible Trion!?
    Ranged souls should only have snares,binds and stuns. It is melee that needs the op cc and multiple breaks being in the front-line and not ranged! As usual melee will never be fixed in the game. As a result, if nothing is done there will only be mainly rogues in warfronts in 3.0. So people say warriors got paragon. I don't consider the soul a true warrior melee spec mainly because grasping the horizon is a comical skill that gives 20m range. The skill also gives no damage penalty, unless you count death touch, which still can't be used from range when this skill is active. So why were these skill made in the first place, along with tempest with shock pulse at 0? because we all know be Trion is bad at making good pvp mechanics. So this is the situation we have currently: be ranged, have slip away, bring some op pocket healers; otherwise, roll warlord or gg.

    Warriors are so messed up and many good souls had are now ruined did you know champion was originally a damage soul that was supposed to specialize in burst damage 1v1.

    • "The Champion class is available under the Warrior calling. Champions are powerful Warriors who excel at melee combat. Wielding massive two-handed weapons, these battle-tested fighters find few equals in one-on-one battle"

    • "The Paragon class is available under the Warrior calling. The Paragon moves like a furious storm, never giving his enemy time to regroup. A master of dual-wielding, he uses parries and disciplined forms to build up power attacks and stay out of danger."

    I lol'd when I read this:
    • "Paragons suffer against healers who can outpace their steady damage output, and these methodical warriors tend to be weaker against opponents who specialize in burst damage."

    source: http://rift.wikia.com/wiki/RIFT_Wiki

    The souls are sadly only catered for pve players since storm legion, which, consequently, rendered many souls, especially of the warrior class broken or useless. Warlord was also originally designed to be the support class, and only excelled if your team was around. Atm I believe the class devs clearly don't know what they are doing, except nerfing the damage of the only good pvp damage soul without any payoffs ie. cc cause they are to lazy. Another example is the recent nerf "tempest". There was no payoff to make the soul better cause they are to lazy. In an playing environment with better gear standardization,matchmaking.It would then easy to find some fine tweaks for other souls to be balanced.

    I gather the devs are only limited to changing values on existing code, to satisfy the qq nerf @ forums.In the future, they might have to modify some stats for the new upcoming gear and minor tweaks to existing gear. Also look forward to copy and pasting over from pve to pvp. Now that's a good game.
    The way i see it atm there are certain souls that are basically the "pvp soul" for classes. Dom for mage warlord for warrior. They seem to be outside the pve shell (excluding the warpest hybrid) maybe that should be the pvp direction give every class 1 or 2 pvp specific souls to main or hybrid into.

    EDIT: I don't really play rogue or cleric but I am sure you guys have that one soul that is useless for pve but does ok in pvp.

    Double EDIT: i also believe this is the main reason warlord seem OP their crazy mobility with charges. but then thats the way i see the class they are a spearhead for the rest of the team
    Last edited by deathstormer; 07-11-2014 at 01:51 AM.
    Deathion Reaperblade <Aspies> Warrior
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  6. #36
    Plane Walker deathstormer's Avatar
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    beside we've already been secretly nerfed i went to charge, jump back, charge jump back someone the other day mucking around and apparently tactical advance doesn't reset defensive maneuvre on one charge =P nerf warlord mobility
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  7. #37
    Ascendant butkus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SpellwarriorX View Post
    I would be all for the nerf, except even though it has been said countless of times there is still no change to make other warrior souls play better in pvp. An ae stun or fear should be added since warlord has no decent cc, except roots. Warlord is only mainly op as a melee spec because of its multiple charges, gap closing skills and that ranged mitigation combined with normal mitigation a lot better compared to other souls. Also don't forget that ae damage from clear the breach and killing field. For instance, a sin could dominate a warlord 1v1 any day.

    Melee is generally messed up in this game. This game has got some skills mixed up between different types of souls. Ask yourself this why do range souls have ranged ae stuns? Answer: thanks for making melee making unviable as much as possible Trion!?
    Ranged souls should only have snares,binds and stuns. It is melee that needs the op cc and multiple breaks being in the front-line and not ranged! As usual melee will never be fixed in the game. As a result, if nothing is done there will only be mainly rogues in warfronts in 3.0. So people say warriors got paragon. I don't consider the soul a true warrior melee spec mainly because grasping the horizon is a comical skill that gives 20m range. The skill also gives no damage penalty, unless you count death touch, which still can't be used from range when this skill is active. So why were these skill made in the first place, along with tempest with shock pulse at 0? because we all know be Trion is bad at making good pvp mechanics. So this is the situation we have currently: be ranged, have slip away, bring some op pocket healers; otherwise, roll warlord or gg.

    Warriors are so messed up and many good souls had are now ruined did you know champion was originally a damage soul that was supposed to specialize in burst damage 1v1.

    • "The Champion class is available under the Warrior calling. Champions are powerful Warriors who excel at melee combat. Wielding massive two-handed weapons, these battle-tested fighters find few equals in one-on-one battle"

    • "The Paragon class is available under the Warrior calling. The Paragon moves like a furious storm, never giving his enemy time to regroup. A master of dual-wielding, he uses parries and disciplined forms to build up power attacks and stay out of danger."

    I lol'd when I read this:
    • "Paragons suffer against healers who can outpace their steady damage output, and these methodical warriors tend to be weaker against opponents who specialize in burst damage."

    source: http://rift.wikia.com/wiki/RIFT_Wiki

    The souls are sadly only catered for pve players since storm legion, which, consequently, rendered many souls, especially of the warrior class broken or useless. Warlord was also originally designed to be the support class, and only excelled if your team was around. Atm I believe the class devs clearly don't know what they are doing, except nerfing the damage of the only good pvp damage soul without any payoffs ie. cc cause they are to lazy. Another example is the recent nerf "tempest". There was no payoff to make the soul better cause they are to lazy. In an playing environment with better gear standardization,matchmaking.It would then easy to find some fine tweaks for other souls to be balanced.

    I gather the devs are only limited to changing values on existing code, to satisfy the qq nerf @ forums.In the future, they might have to modify some stats for the new upcoming gear and minor tweaks to existing gear. Also look forward to copy and pasting over from pve to pvp. Now that's a good game.
    i pretty much agree with what your saying execpt for warlord being OP'ed.

    " a sin could dominate a warlord 1v1 any day"
    i agree with that statement 100%-how many 61 warlords rock cq?=none =not op'ed.how many 61 warlords can 1 vs1 the best of the other players/classes/spec =none.warlord is in a good spot but its far from op'ed.i made a reaver spec and i crush warlords all day with it and reaver is weak.

    warlord is what our devs should aim for while bringing our other souls up to par.para has the best burst but is to soft without pocket healer up your backside.warlord is strong but its still weaker then what other classes have atm and its not good 1 vs1 at 61 points.

    i would hate to see my fav spec "warlord" that i been playing since day 1 get nerfed to **** again for no reason.
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  8. #38
    Rift Master ConclusionTheFirst's Avatar
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    If Rogues are ever balanced(won't happen), I might be able to play one without feeling guilty.
    Last edited by ConclusionTheFirst; 07-11-2014 at 06:52 AM.

  9. #39
    Ascendant HannonHellbringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by butkus View Post
    i pretty much agree with what your saying execpt for warlord being OP'ed.

    " a sin could dominate a warlord 1v1 any day"
    i agree with that statement 100%-how many 61 warlords rock cq?=none =not op'ed.how many 61 warlords can 1 vs1 the best of the other players/classes/spec =none.warlord is in a good spot but its far from op'ed.i made a reaver spec and i crush warlords all day with it and reaver is weak.

    warlord is what our devs should aim for while bringing our other souls up to par.para has the best burst but is to soft without pocket healer up your backside.warlord is strong but its still weaker then what other classes have atm and its not good 1 vs1 at 61 points.

    i would hate to see my fav spec "warlord" that i been playing since day 1 get nerfed to **** again for no reason.
    That's something I've said before, back when warlord was first redesigned. That is how warrior melee should play as. The current warlord is what all warrior melee should be based around then build the souls to do damage in different ways. Instead you have this separation between what warlord is and the glass cannon melee souls which is why they do not work. Para only works with major heals behind it. Why is that? Why did warlord work and the others didn't? Because they are not made for frontline fighting. They are melee who are cursed with the inability to go melee, at least without support.

    It has been so long that every other class has gotten spoiled with their ranged and good souls that when warlord popped up they could not figure out how to deal with them. Good players know how to stop them which is why good warriors stopped playing warlord and formed premades and went with paragon. Warriors offer little to nothing for pvp and nerfing warlord will only further limit what warriors can do. But hey we are getting a new reaver, you know a glass cannon souls with a mix of melee and 20m ranged abilities. I hope those defensive CDs work real good cuz if not, pop goes the reaver.

  10. #40
    Shield of Telara Talzoor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by deathstormer View Post
    really a nerf to warlords is a nerf to all you guys who are you going to get to go front line in a fight? S&B tanks? whats going to happen to all you squishies when there is no warlord left to soak up all that damage intended for you? tunign odwn the 61 point version yeah ok it does maybe need it but nerfing it at 48 points just destroys hybrids.
    WL are mowing down all the squishies right now lol.

    S&B tanks would just be forced to I dunno... guard the dps or guard the healers. I guess the concept is too foreign to op warriors who can absorb all the dmg and dish out all the dmg - AT THE SAME TIME.

    BTW i'm not in favor of nerfing any DPS specs or HEALs spec in terms of damage or heals.

    But if warriors/dps classes are gonna hit the hardest they should also be squishy like all the other glass cannons. How is asking for that unreasonable?
    Last edited by Talzoor; 07-16-2014 at 01:29 AM.

  11. #41
    Ascendant HannonHellbringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talzoor View Post
    WL are mowing down all the squishies right now lol.

    S&B tanks would just be forced to I dunno... guard the dps or guard the healers. I guess the concept is too foreign to op warriors who can absorb all the dmg and dish out all the dmg - AT THE SAME TIME.

    BTW i'm not in favor of nerfing any DPS specs or HEALs spec in terms of damage or heals.

    But if warriors/dps classes are gonna hit the hardest they should also be squishy like all the other glass cannons. How is asking for that unreasonable?
    We actually have been asking for that but how exactly are warriors supposed to "guard" their teammates in tank souls? Tanks offer nothing to pvp, they soak damage but that is easy to bypass by just ignoring them, there is nothing that makes a tank force enemies into them or legitimately redirect damage. Voidknight used to have tons of tools to be useful but now it's just a pull bot. Trust me, if tank gets made to be useful, I'll be the first warrior my foes will call a bas**** because I'll roll tank. For now we have warlord (our tanky front liner) and paragon (glass cannon).

    Oh yeah, before I forget, block is easily bypassed since pvp gear offers not +block stats. So again, tanks = pointless.
    Last edited by HannonHellbringer; 07-16-2014 at 01:49 AM.

  12. #42
    Ascendant HannonHellbringer's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Talzoor View Post
    WL are mowing down all the squishies right now lol.

    S&B tanks would just be forced to I dunno... guard the dps or guard the healers. I guess the concept is too foreign to op warriors who can absorb all the dmg and dish out all the dmg - AT THE SAME TIME.

    BTW i'm not in favor of nerfing any DPS specs or HEALs spec in terms of damage or heals.

    But if warriors/dps classes are gonna hit the hardest they should also be squishy like all the other glass cannons. How is asking for that unreasonable?
    You also mention warrior dps, warlord is not dps but a hybrid and it doesn't do paragon level of dps or burst. Do you know why paragon works? Because it gets massive healing from a premade, outside of that it's going to die. Warlord is what melee for warriors should be based on. It can sustain a frontline presence why still being a threat, something the other warrior dps cannot do and thus makes them almost useless except paragon because it can range and kill very quickly. This is a concept people forget, melee has to stay in melee to be worth anything but everyone has gotten spoiled with their ranged and over tuned classes.

  13. #43
    Shield of Telara Talzoor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HannonHellbringer View Post
    We actually have been asking for that but how exactly are warriors supposed to "guard" their teammates in tank souls? Tanks offer nothing to pvp, they soak damage but that is easy to bypass by just ignoring them, there is nothing that makes a tank force enemies into them or legitimately redirect damage. Voidknight used to have tons of tools to be useful but now it's just a pull bot. Trust me, if tank gets made to be useful, I'll be the first warrior my foes will call a bas**** because I'll roll tank. For now we have warlord (our tanky front liner) and paragon (glass cannon).
    Dude I played a guard tank in SWTOR and in Warhammer.

    DPS and healers wouldn't go ANYWHERE without me. 4v4 swtor or 6v6 in warhammer wasn't even considered without at least 1 or 2 guards.

    Guards are NOT a new concept in pvp or in pve or mmos for that matter.

    It's works and Rift can revive their guards, make them more cc/buffs.

    Right now no one guards because it's not needed. All the hardest hitting melee dps spec sans a few like BD and NB are self reliant and only take a minimal amount of heals (if any) to keep them up.

    Melee DPS should hit the hardest but it should also be a fair trade off. They should be reliant on their team to keep them up. Most warriors debate this basic concept which is why people think it's a conspiracy to keep their op spec.

    Why is this so unreasonable?

  14. #44
    Shield of Telara Talzoor's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HannonHellbringer View Post
    You also mention warrior dps, warlord is not dps but a hybrid and it doesn't do paragon level of dps or burst. Do you know why paragon works? Because it gets massive healing from a premade, outside of that it's going to die. Warlord is what melee for warriors should be based on. It can sustain a frontline presence why still being a threat, something the other warrior dps cannot do and thus makes them almost useless except paragon because it can range and kill very quickly. This is a concept people forget, melee has to stay in melee to be worth anything but everyone has gotten spoiled with their ranged and over tuned classes.
    Dude we've been over this before, you just copy and pasted from the last time we debated this.

    You're a fanatic. I don't know how many way I can say it before it sticks in your head.

    I am not asking for warrior (or any class) damage per second (any soul) nerf. Never had never will. So you can kill all you want but just be a glass cannon like the other souls.

    It should to the point that a glass cannon dps warrior (any soul) should be happy to be guarded by a Pal/Reaver/VK so he/she can continually mow down whoever.

    Right now, guard isn't needed because the DPS souls don't require it (plus rift guard utility is broken).

  15. #45
    Telaran Aquafinn's Avatar
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    Come on we still reply to a name? RGI is to the significance of Rift as... well **** analogies and **** him, stop caring about useless opinions and we will all be better off.

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