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Thread: Best class in PvP for new players

  1. #1
    Soulwalker
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    Default Best class in PvP for new players

    At this moment it is the warrior.
    The combination of their survivability and damage is just unsurpassed at level 60.
    All the other classes are viable until 60, but after 60, all the other classes fall sharply until you get to higher levels of prestige (i.e. better gear). And this takes a lot of time.
    Two examples:
    - As a mage pyromancer, until 60 two main damage dealing abilities (pyroblast and fireball, casted 6sec, 2 sec) deal "proper" damage (25%/15% of the HP of a player). So you can kill someone if played properly. After 60, it drops to 10%/5%, and I had a warriors crystal hit me for 10% of my health (2k hp), and this crystal is just a bonus.. .
    - As a priest healer ( I leveled one exclusively through PvP), you can outheal any one damage dealer before 60 (while you run into your group), and you just die to one warrior post 60 (also die to one properly geared melee rogue).

    And warriors are also good before 60. Just use tempest ( ranged warrior) and kick everyone a**.
    After 60 take warlord and melt those casters.

  2. #2
    Rift Master Sezex's Avatar
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    Physician
    /10char

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    Rift Master Sezex's Avatar
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    Also its not war its rog. War has warlord that's getting nerfed to sh*t and I dare ppl run paragon with current rng for heals in wf, its like running sin with no slip away and stealth. Rog got sin\nb\ranger which are stealth\durable\ranged.

  4. #4
    Prophet of Telara Morwath's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWaine View Post
    - As a priest healer ( I leveled one exclusively through PvP), you can outheal any one damage dealer before 60 (while you run into your group), and you just die to one warrior post 60 (also die to one properly geared melee rogue).
    Are you mad?
    Warrior is the last threat for Cleric.

  5. #5
    Ascendant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sezex View Post
    Also its not war its rog. War has warlord that's getting nerfed to sh*t and I dare ppl run paragon with current rng for heals in wf, its like running sin with no slip away and stealth. Rog got sin\nb\ranger which are stealth\durable\ranged.
    I suggested long ago para needs alacrity gone and make it a flat % damage increase for good, steady dps with shifting as its burst. Then add utility.

    Adding utility to it now would make it a killing machine with how silly alacrity is.

    A glass cannon NB or ranger has little utility, especially the ranger. Glass cannon mind you. Sin i agree with you. It gets too much umph and defense coming out of stealth, which lasts 15 seconds. How long do most people last vs a gank? Lol. Luckily it relies on stealth and doesnt get this constantly.

  6. #6
    Ascendant Violacea's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Wrastion View Post
    A glass cannon NB or ranger has little utility, especially the ranger. Glass cannon mind you. Sin i agree with you. It gets too much umph and defense coming out of stealth, which lasts 15 seconds. How long do most people last vs a gank? Lol. Luckily it relies on stealth and doesnt get this constantly.
    If you use slip away offensively you can maintain this "15s buff" for 45s straight, followed by a 15s downtime before you can pop it again for 15s. Sin stopped relying on stealth when Thread of Death was introduced. Now it just helps.

    Also, NB has pretty fine utility for what it makes itself out to be. Melee power with reasonable 20m range capability. Highly powerful heal/secondary cleanse. Secondary break free/port. The spec certainly has good stuff going for it, and they may be why they keep the damage so toned down outside of CD's. I always tell people if you don't see living flames icon or the other 4 finishers in a row icon, there is really no reason to be scared of a NB unless you are out of mana.

    It's why I have fun when I run into rogues when I play Physician. I just know the DPS specs too well and know what they're going to try to do. Fun saving my 0pt rs port for when a NB hits Living Flames. ;P Or with the 48phy variant. It's fun when you know someone has a CD they wait for, and to Rift Prison everytime they use it. With the right CC, if you know a class, you can really make them garbage.
    Last edited by Violacea; 06-29-2014 at 07:16 AM.
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  7. #7
    Ascendant Kronos v's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWaine View Post
    At this moment it is the warrior.
    The combination of their survivability and damage is just unsurpassed at level 60.
    All the other classes are viable until 60, but after 60, all the other classes fall sharply until you get to higher levels of prestige (i.e. better gear). And this takes a lot of time.
    Two examples:
    - As a mage pyromancer, until 60 two main damage dealing abilities (pyroblast and fireball, casted 6sec, 2 sec) deal "proper" damage (25%/15% of the HP of a player). So you can kill someone if played properly. After 60, it drops to 10%/5%, and I had a warriors crystal hit me for 10% of my health (2k hp), and this crystal is just a bonus.. .
    - As a priest healer ( I leveled one exclusively through PvP), you can outheal any one damage dealer before 60 (while you run into your group), and you just die to one warrior post 60 (also die to one properly geared melee rogue).

    And warriors are also good before 60. Just use tempest ( ranged warrior) and kick everyone a**.
    After 60 take warlord and melt those casters.
    the best spec is not the best class.
    just because a fully geared warrior killed your under geared mage does not make warrior the best class.

    if you want the best class, you want a rogue.
    multiple viable specs for multiple roles. there is quite literally nothing that a rogue cant do in pvp.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    Or to put it more simply, it doesn't matter if you're topping the charts if you're killing the wrong people.

  8. #8
    Prophet of Telara
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    Imho, Warriors are the easiest for new players. 2-3 macros and you are ready to faceroll ;)

    The reason why i say Warriors:

    1. Most's of their best dps buffs cannot be purged
    2. Very high survivality and mobility
    3. Can easily macro most of their abilities
    4. Plenty of 1h long buffs which you dont have to rebuff after you die (recent change)

  9. #9
    Ascendant Kronos v's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otts View Post
    Imho, Warriors are the easiest for new players. 2-3 macros and you are ready to faceroll ;)

    The reason why i say Warriors:

    1. Most's of their best dps buffs cannot be purged
    2. Very high survivality and mobility
    3. Can easily macro most of their abilities
    4. Plenty of 1h long buffs which you dont have to rebuff after you die (recent change)
    again, you are pretty much just talking about one single warrior soul here.
    a soul that is in the process of getting nerfed. I don't think any new player will be happy reading the "warrior (warlord) is op", finally get to 60 and discover that it is no longer even playable.

    ease of use is important for new players, i'll agree with you there. but rogue also has that.
    rogue also has options. something that warriors do not. given the rollercoaster nature of buffs/nerfs to various souls, rogue would be the best choice for a new player who isn't lvl 60 yet.
    there is a reason why all the baddie FotM players are all playing rogues right now, and have been since before SL.

    mind you, more rogues is not exactly what Rifts pvp needs right now.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    Or to put it more simply, it doesn't matter if you're topping the charts if you're killing the wrong people.

  10. #10
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kronos v View Post
    again, you are pretty much just talking about one single warrior soul here.
    a soul that is in the process of getting nerfed. I don't think any new player will be happy reading the "warrior (warlord) is op", finally get to 60 and discover that it is no longer even playable.

    ease of use is important for new players, i'll agree with you there. but rogue also has that.
    rogue also has options. something that warriors do not. given the rollercoaster nature of buffs/nerfs to various souls, rogue would be the best choice for a new player who isn't lvl 60 yet.
    there is a reason why all the baddie FotM players are all playing rogues right now, and have been since before SL.

    mind you, more rogues is not exactly what Rifts pvp needs right now.
    The nerf isnt as big as people claim it to be and it affect hybrids mostly. It will deal less dmg but it will also starve less (kinda like passive LE). Sure not all Warriors are as easy as Warlord but it's without a doubt the most newbe friendly soul in the game.

    The biggest difference between Warlord and specific Rogue souls is huge HP pool, mobility and resistances / armor, ranged dmg reduction and the (most important) unpurgable buffs.

    If you had a newbe playing let say Assassin or a hybrid with RS he would be useless once purged and most newbes dont even notice it until they die. If you get in bad spot you can use leap backwards or +50% movement speed buff. The ranged dmg reduction and high hp pool will help them when they run too far in to enemy group.

    Having high HP pool means they wont be focused until all the other squishy specs die, so they wont get annoying feeling of being send to the respawn every several seconds.

  11. #11
    Ascendant Kronos v's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Otts View Post
    The nerf isnt as big as people claim it to be and it affect hybrids mostly. It will deal less dmg but it will also starve less (kinda like passive LE). Sure not all Warriors are as easy as Warlord but it's without a doubt the most newbe friendly soul in the game.

    The biggest difference between Warlord and specific Rogue souls is huge HP pool, mobility and resistances / armor, ranged dmg reduction and the (most important) unpurgable buffs.

    If you had a newbe playing let say Assassin or a hybrid with RS he would be useless once purged and most newbes dont even notice it until they die. If you get in bad spot you can use leap backwards or +50% movement speed buff. The ranged dmg reduction and high hp pool will help them when they run too far in to enemy group.

    Having high HP pool means they wont be focused until all the other squishy specs die, so they wont get annoying feeling of being send to the respawn every several seconds.
    once again you miss the point.

    the subject isn't which is the best soul for a beginner, but which class.
    you are basing the recommendation of the warrior solely around the warlord soul, as this is all the warrior soul has going for it. I do not deny that the warlord soul is pvp viable nor that it is easy.

    my argument is that for everything the warlord soul has going for it, the rogue class has it all and more too.
    what's more the rogue class has options of viable roles that the warrior class does not have. if you want to do ranged damage, the rogue does it well. if you want to deal melee damage, the rogue does it well. support...heals.... tank... all are viable in pvp for the rogue class.
    the warrior class simply does not have the same role viability that the rogue class has.
    Last edited by Kronos v; 06-29-2014 at 08:31 PM.

    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho View Post
    Or to put it more simply, it doesn't matter if you're topping the charts if you're killing the wrong people.

  12. #12
    Prophet of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kronos v View Post
    once again you miss the point.

    the subject isn't which is the best soul for a beginner, but which class.
    you are basing the recommendation of the warrior solely around the warlord soul, as this is all the warrior soul has going for it. I do not deny that the warlord soul is pvp viable nor that it is easy.

    my argument is that for everything the warlord soul has going for it, the rogue class has it all and more too.
    what's more the rogue class has options of viable roles that the warrior class does not have. if you want to do ranged damage, the rogue does it well. if you want to deal melee damage, the rogue does it well. support...heals.... tank... all are viable in pvp for the rogue class.
    the warrior class simply does not have the same role viability that the rogue class has.
    In PvE or PvP?

    In PvE Warriros are #1 melee and ranged dps wise.

    Supports? Bard is outclassed by Oracle so you wont see much raiding with it, but it's quite easy to play. BM is used very rarely (mostly because of Archon hybrids being superior) however there's at least one encounter where you must have BM (due to spammable purge).

    Healing? Liberator is used on specific encounters (the biggest reason to not use him is the fact that Warriors are #1 at dps, so it's usually lose of the dps for the raid). Physician get's used only as a hybrid, more often than Liberator but not really a must have.

    Tanks? Warriors a lot more options for this role and a lot easier spec.

    In PvP:

    Outside of MM, Bard and Ranger I dont see any Rogue soul which would be as easy and effective as WL and it's various hybrids.

    MM and Ranger while easy to play dont have these easy heals or shield which Tempest does + all their buffs are purgeable. MM get advantage of purge while Tempest can get lot's of good things from sub souls which doesnt require weapon swapping. (try to use TF from NB for slow while dpsing with MM or Ranger and then compare it to Tempest using EotS)

    BM can be effective with just purge spam and using one finisher once per 30sec. Dps will be low but the easier part is that you wont get annoyed be recasting these stupid motifs every 20sec when you dont have 5 combo points to refresh them. BM's motifs will reaply by itself when you use a finisher which makes it a lot easier to get started with basic supporting and there's no chance that new player will forget them.

    Tempest is still very effective with aoe stun, self heal + shield and unpurgable buffs (not all but some of them) You even get some weak version of stealth which could be useful in rare situations and a lot better sub souls. Ranger and MM dont have any hybrids which would be better than 61 build. For example you can get spammable and uncleanseable slow from Warlord or lot's of passive movement speed from RB / BM.


    If Warlord didnt exist i would say go Rogue but imho Warlord and all the hybrids which are related to this soul is what makes this calling more effective and easier for new players than Rogue.

    For the Rogue to get as effective with RS hybrids newbe would have to track Planar boost stacks which you can get only from generating 5th or more combo points for 30sec, so you can't just spam finishers all the time because you will lose the stacks and the dmg if you mess it up. There's also duration of the buff which you get from stalker phase after using teleports (the dming teleports require weapon swap and target) while Walord get it's done a lot easier with just generating 3 combo points for Surge ability and a lot stronger 1h long dps buffs (which cant be purged, so there's simply less things to worry about).

  13. #13
    Ascendant Lords0fpain's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kronos v View Post
    the best spec is not the best class.
    just because a fully geared warrior killed your under geared mage does not make warrior the best class.

    if you want the best class, you want a rogue.
    multiple viable specs for multiple roles. there is quite literally nothing that a rogue cant do in pvp.
    And being OPed while doing it, always best for a new player....yea, rogue.
    "There are other aspects of the game that we want you to engage in."

    ~Daglar

  14. #14
    Plane Walker
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    Assuming you're not being pocket healed...

    Warriors - doesn't matter
    Rogues & Clerics - ranged class until you're at least in Warlord gear
    Mages - Chloro until you have relic gear.

  15. #15
    Rift Master ConclusionTheFirst's Avatar
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    Rogue, anything.

    They are head and shoulders the best class in the game with absurdly overpowered specs to boot.

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