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Thread: non-stacking or diminishing effects

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    Champion Marnos's Avatar
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    Default non-stacking or diminishing effects

    Hello, all. I am trying to get a more factual understanding of healing effects that do not stack or incur diminishing effects when stacked. I try to stay abreast of these things to determine how many of a certain type of healer to invite to a cq premade. Does anyone have numbers, or perhaps links to information on healing effects that lose effectiveness when stacked (such as heals from wardens, chloros, bards and tacts)?

    ~Respectfully,

    Assistant

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    10 target AOE healers are most effective when they have 10 targets to hit, and are less effective when there are less targets to heal. Pool of restoration incurs a penalty when there is less than 10 targets around because it applies a buff that does a 3 target splash heal off of each target affected by it.

    I don't think there's any other diminishing returns in effect when stacking healers.


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    RIFT Guide Writer Orangu's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marnos View Post
    Hello, all. I am trying to get a more factual understanding of healing effects that do not stack or incur diminishing effects when stacked. I try to stay abreast of these things to determine how many of a certain type of healer to invite to a cq premade. Does anyone have numbers, or perhaps links to information on healing effects that lose effectiveness when stacked (such as heals from wardens, chloros, bards and tacts)?

    ~Respectfully,

    Assistant
    I can tell you chloros can't heal other chloros because if you have a veil up, you can't receive healing from another person's veil.
    Warden has a 2% damage reduction bonus that doesn't stack, but their aoe burst healing is so good it's negligible.
    Purifier shields leave a debuff and it would take 3 puris to be able to keep that debuff on CD for the whole raid.
    sentinel there isn't an issue except healer's covenant which isn't really a thing in CQ
    Tell your defilers only to use their 30 and 20 % links so that other defilers are useful to have and to make link swapping more effective since you won't get stuck with a 10% link on someone that instantly needs a 30%
    you can have more than one bard, but it's frowned upon since sab and tact do so much easy dps.

    Optimal heal builds would probably be
    1 sentinel
    1 defiler
    2 puris
    2 wardens
    1 bard
    1 chloro
    total of 8 people. Maybe change one of the puris out for something else as needed and make sure your wardens actually know how to play warden which is a lot rarer than you'd think since they don't maintain HoT stacks on themselves or danger of the deep stacks 99% of the time.

    ALSO it's noteworthy the purifiers have an AOE cd that reduces the dmg your raid takes by 20% and increases their damage by 5% and smartheals 10 ppl for 10-17k a second.


    Lithmygoober@deepwood
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    Mostly buffs/cooldowns wouldn't stack:
    Symbiosis
    Healer's covenant
    Motifs(pretty sure only one bard can pop the healing one)
    Links

    Also support buffs

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    Champion Marnos's Avatar
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    Default thanks

    Thanks for the responses, I thought trion had patched in more "diminishing effects" to reduce healing stacks over the years, but I guess not as much as I imagined.

    ~Cheers

    Assistant

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    Champion Tengri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangu View Post
    make sure your wardens actually know how to play warden which is a lot rarer than you'd think since they don't maintain HoT stacks on themselves or danger of the deep stacks 99% of the time.
    I just spam healing cataract cause im ****ing good like that

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    Champion Marnos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Orangu View Post
    I can tell you chloros can't heal other chloros because if you have a veil up, you can't receive healing from another person's veil.
    Does this apply to raid members in range of multiple chloros with veil up? So if I have two chloros in a raid, would one veil override the others if I am in range of both? Or is the penalty only to a chloro with veil up?

    ~Respectfully,

    Assistant

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marnos View Post
    Does this apply to raid members in range of multiple chloros with veil up? So if I have two chloros in a raid, would one veil override the others if I am in range of both? Or is the penalty only to a chloro with veil up?

    ~Respectfully,

    Assistant
    Veils don't work like that. Veils are a self buff that generate healing from chloros using damaging abilities. Having a veil active on yourself means you cannot receive heals from other mages buffed with veils.

    For example: If you have 2 LGV chloros in your raid, the raid will receive veil heals from both of them, but they will not receive the heals the other chloro is generating. Also if anyone else outside of these 2 LGV chloros buffs themselves with lifegiving or lifebound veil, they in addition will not receive veil heals from the other two chloros.

    I have a question for you now Assistant, why are you asking these questions about the functionality of abilities? Did you not know most of this even though you've been running conquest premades and setting up raid compositions this entire time? I do not mean to insult you with this question, I just figured you knew this stuff already.


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    Champion Marnos's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Candoalot View Post
    Veils don't work like that. Veils are a self buff that generate healing from chloros using damaging abilities. Having a veil active on yourself means you cannot receive heals from other mages buffed with veils.

    For example: If you have 2 LGV chloros in your raid, the raid will receive veil heals from both of them, but they will not receive the heals the other chloro is generating. Also if anyone else outside of these 2 LGV chloros buffs themselves with lifegiving or lifebound veil, they in addition will not receive veil heals from the other two chloros.

    I have a question for you now Assistant, why are you asking these questions about the functionality of abilities? Did you not know most of this even though you've been running conquest premades and setting up raid compositions this entire time? I do not mean to insult you with this question, I just figured you knew this stuff already.
    To be honest, I have a macro-level (or more honestly, surface-level) understanding of the mechanics of these healing abilities; at least when it comes to how they interfere with each other. I do have a 60 of each class, and have a 61 bard, 61 tact, bard/tact hybrid, 61 chloro, 61 def, 61 puri, 61 sent, 61 warden, all used for healing. I have done testing with a lot of different raid compositions in cq matches, and use rift meter to help me decide what is effective and why (or why not). However, I generally question myself when someone only plays a particular class and says "you should have 2 of these" or "more than 1 of those doesn't work" etc. I asked around on here to get a bit of clarity on things like how much healing might be lost if i have two bards in a raid, or 1 bard, 1 bard/hybrid, or 2-3 chloros, or 2-3 wardens.

    ~Cheers

    Assistant

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    Quote Originally Posted by Marnos View Post
    To be honest, I have a macro-level (or more honestly, surface-level) understanding of the mechanics of these healing abilities; at least when it comes to how they interfere with each other. I do have a 60 of each class, and have a 61 bard, 61 tact, bard/tact hybrid, 61 chloro, 61 def, 61 puri, 61 sent, 61 warden, all used for healing. I have done testing with a lot of different raid compositions in cq matches, and use rift meter to help me decide what is effective and why (or why not). However, I generally question myself when someone only plays a particular class and says "you should have 2 of these" or "more than 1 of those doesn't work" etc. I asked around on here to get a bit of clarity on things like how much healing might be lost if i have two bards in a raid, or 1 bard, 1 bard/hybrid, or 2-3 chloros, or 2-3 wardens.

    ~Cheers

    Assistant
    When it comes to bards, usually only 1 is utilized because what makes a bard stand out is the buffs, and one bard can apply their buffs to the entire raid. You could probably get away with using tacticians for some extra AOE healing and utility, it really depends. I suspect most raids don't go above 2 chloros because lifegiving veil heals 10 targets, 2 chloros could cover the full raid with veil heals if everyone's taking equal damage. You can stack wardens as much as you like because they're able to cross heal each other. but warden healing is all about the CD's. Effusion spam will burn your mana too fast, and cataract is a slow 2 second cast for a weaker heal than effusion albeit being more mana efficient.

    Playing to AOE healers strengths, you'd have a mixture of wardens, chloros and bards/tacticians to cover both burst and sustained AOE damage.


    "microtransactions done properly is game design done poorly." - Some dude on an internet forum

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