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Thread: How to track effects for purging/cleansing?

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    Plane Touched Malcanthe's Avatar
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    Default How to track effects for purging/cleansing?

    Hi all, how do you keep track of buffs/dots/effects so you can cleanse or purge the right stuff? For instance, if you're healing and someone gets Scourge'd or feared then you might want to cleanse that right away. But if it's under, say, 10 stacks of haunting pain then you may not want to.

    For purging similar question, I rarely know what exactly I'm purging or if it was worth it. There has to be some better way than looking through the million changing buffs that everyone has and trying to tell what order they're all in and which ones are purgeable.

    Thanks!

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    Ascendant Stay's Avatar
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    If you really cared about getting it right, add-ons.

    Karuulalert could be set to pop up notifications when your target has certain buffs, or lacks certain buffs. Possibly it can do that for group member's debuffs too without needing to target them. Although if it can, I don't know how to do it. At the least you could get it to pop up notifications for debuffs when you target the guy.

    Clickboxhealer can replace your raidframes with ones that turn different colors when debuffed. You can set whitelist and blacklist for debuffs you want to ignore and ones you want to cleanse ASAP.

    Fair warning tho, these are hard to set up and come with some problems. Rift's tools for addon makers are limited so they don't work as well as you might remember WOW addons working. For example, if you use CBH, anyone who joins late while you are already in combat will have a broken raidframe that simply does not work at all. Until you die or /reloadui while out of combat.

    If there was rated PvP I would definitely set these up, spend hours configuring them, and learn to play around their limitations. I'm sure I could find some other addons that might be helpful, too, if I spent a lot of time trying out addons. In the end it would make me more effective. But there's not rated PvP, and that's a lot of hassle. So I haven't and probably won't.
    Last edited by Stay; 10-28-2013 at 08:03 AM.
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    Ascendant Wing man's Avatar
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    That's a tough call. On one hand most healers spend 50%+ of the a match cleansing instead of having fun/healing. On the other hand addons are just borrowed skill you'll eventually rely upon making you a far worse player overall.

    Damned if you do... or don't.

    My advice is stop healing and enjoy something that takes more than 3 buttons to play. (which is why you see so many things that need to be cleansed lately)

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    Plane Touched Malcanthe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stay View Post
    Karuulalert could be set to pop up notifications when your target has certain buffs, or lacks certain buffs.
    I use karuulalert to notice when I get purged, and I've set it up to notice a few buffs on other players so I can tell, e.g., who's a sent and who's an inq. But AFAIK it has no way of conveying the order of buffs or effects on your target. And also there are so many buffs people can have it would take me forever to enter each one separately using the Karuulalert config window. The visual interface would also turn into a mess because, unless I'm missing something, there's no way to have it show a list---all the notifications just appear in a preset location.

    Clickboxhealer can replace your raidframes with ones that turn different colors when debuffed. You can set whitelist and blacklist for debuffs you want to ignore and ones you want to cleanse ASAP.
    Thanks, I do use CBH and think it's great despite the bugs. I've been pretty lazy about putting whitelists/blacklists together though. Does anyone have a canned version they'd be willing to share? Also, like Karuulalert, it doesn't tell you the order. So even if you know a player has a debuff you want cleansed, you don't know whether cleansing that player would actually get that debuff.

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    Ascendant Stay's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanthe View Post
    The visual interface would also turn into a mess because, unless I'm missing something, there's no way to have it show a list---all the notifications just appear in a preset location.
    You can modify each individual alert to show up with some different offset from the anchor, so they don't stack over each other. Huge PITA, but I don't think there's a list function.
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    Champion TadaceAce's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Stay View Post
    For example, if you use CBH, anyone who joins late while you are already in combat will have a broken raidframe that simply does not work at all. Until you die or /reloadui while out of combat.

    The newer versions of cbh don't seem to have this issue. It still happens really rarely and I didn't know you could /reloadui

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    Ascendant Taptap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malcanthe View Post
    I've been pretty lazy about putting whitelists/blacklists together though. Does anyone have a canned version they'd be willing to share?
    Put the below into the CBH Whitelist (click the text box directly under the Whitelist box to add one at a time):
    Ones to Whitelist
    =================
    Blight
    Burning Bonds
    Countdown
    Explosive Venom
    Fell Blades
    Haunting Pain
    Lethal Poison
    Mass Betrayal
    Mass Exhaustion
    Natural Conversion
    Priest's Lament
    Retribution
    Scourge

    A while back some peeps in another thread helped me get that above list of debuffs that really need to be cleansed asap. But, CBH will turn the background color of a frame blue (if detecting debuffs is enabled) for every thing that can be cleaned, so to limit that to just turning blue when one on the Whitelist is on a raid member means creating a Blacklist of all the others (unless the default "turn blue if anything can be cleansed" can be disabled so only the Whitelist entries will be paid attention to). I don't have such a Blacklist, I'd think it would be pretty big. Test with a friend in a group to make sure the frame will turn blue when a cleanse is needed, it might have to be enabled in its Config section.

    I know that nkRebuff can show what debuffs and how many stacks of it are on an enemy, but I'm not sure it can do so unless you can apply the debuff yourself. You'd have to have a friend who is not grouped debuff someone (not you) while you have that target targeted too AND you have the nkRebuff Analyze window open at that same time so it can learn, and see if it shows up there - if so, then nkRebuff will do what you want and show stacks too when you target someone that CBH indicates needs cleansing. But I've not tried to see if nkRebuff can detect that way or not, it might only detect/learn things that you yourself cause to happen.
    Last edited by Taptap; 10-28-2013 at 05:17 PM.
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    Prophet of Telara Raistlinxx's Avatar
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    Default Warrior POV

    From my POV if it's not transference, TI, or MB I really don't care what they throw on me. The purges from inq and mm suck also. Paragons rely heavily on SLI and Alclarity
    My advice is to find which debuffa hurt you the most an learn what they look like.
    When I see MB or TI in me I run to the back lines and wait em off, beacuse most pug healers won't cleanse it.
    Last edited by Raistlinxx; 10-28-2013 at 05:25 PM.

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    Ascendant Taptap's Avatar
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    Meh, my comment Malcanthe about nkRebuff wasn't of proper scope. I don't think it can learn (its Analyze window open) to show debuffs that are on a friendly player target - but maybe it can just the same as it can if one is on an enemy target, but maybe even then only if it was applied by you or applied to you. You'd just have to experiment unless someone knows for sure.
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    Ascendant Shinkirou's Avatar
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    Personally: Cleansing Rush, Cleansing Rush, Cleansing Rush, Cleansing Rush.

    However if you're a cleric, or even just want to keep track of your own buffs for if you get purged, I second Karuulalerts. It looks a little confusing at first, but is rather quick to understand, and then you can have it easily track any buff/debuff/dot you want, on either yourself, or your target.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ocho
    Also nerf bards.

  11. #11
    Plane Touched Malcanthe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taptap View Post
    Ones to Whitelist
    =================
    Great, I think this is a good start. Thanks! Taptap, I think I've seen you playing a mage (like me), so your list may be a little mage centric. There are probably some others from other classes that others could add if they wanted to chime in.

    On the mage side though, there may be a few more debuffs to worry about, here are the ones I can think of:

    Traitorous Influence (as Raistlin said)
    Transference
    Fear
    Transmogrify
    Flashfire
    Burn
    Death's Edict
    Storm Shackle
    Corpse Explosion (is this worth cleansing after nerf?)
    Choke
    Conflux

    Also I'm not sure Haunting Pain is worth it, because it usually comes in stacks of 10 or more. Easier to just healing the dmg and let the person run around to get rid of them.

    I'm not sure if CBH can do it, but I'd almost want 3 colors, one for very serious debuffs (e.g. Mass Betrayal), one for CCs, and one for semi-important stuff (Withering Vine maybe).

    Quote Originally Posted by Shinkirou
    Personally: Cleansing Rush, Cleansing Rush, Cleansing Rush, Cleansing Rush.
    Ya same here I tend to use it on CD. It's harder to decide with Nature's Cleansing, esp you need to decide between it and healing. Personally I probably Natural Healing too much and Nature's Cleaning too little.

  12. #12
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    Do what I do and watch the raid frames?

    Also, there are sound effects for the two most important debuffs for cleasning: TI and MB

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    Champion Tengri's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tookmyjob View Post
    Do what I do and watch the raid frames?

    Also, there are sound effects for the two most important debuffs for cleasning: TI and MB
    Raid frames r for ze noobs. Who plays with sound on anyway?

  14. #14
    Ascendant Taptap's Avatar
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    Don't thank me Malcanthe, all of those were suggested by others for addition into CBH Whitelist. I think it was in the Mage section of the forums here, but I don't have a thread link handy. At the time I was trying to build up for Chloro and give it a whirl. It gave me a whirl instead, I had major issues with both CBH and nkRebuff back then and my few attempts were so horrific and I felt so stupid that I've only recently even started working on the build again but not yet played it. CBH, it took me forever to find out if I Whitelist something then it would trigger the frame turning blue or if I had to Blacklist for that effect, why it wasn't turning blue at all. The forum here wasn't that helpful (I was basically told to play it and find out myself, but not by the author of CBH) but at Curse the author has a link and directions too so after much use of Google I found the answers (I think).

    I don't think CBH can be used to color frames based on priority of a range of cleanse types needed, it has no way to classify that way that I know of, but you could configure to have specific icons show up at a specified corner in the raid frame so I think you could use that as an indicator of priority. Top left corner active = high priority, bottom left ones = medium priority, etc. Or however you prefer. The blue frame itself is just to let you know a cleanse is needed, is all. I might be wrong though. But stacks, no, I think you'd have to target to see the stacks that way. Or maybe Karuulalerts will do that? I don't think any addon will though unless you actually target, but maybe (I mean, CBH can tell if a non targeted raid member has received a debuff so maybe). I like nkRebuff for my own enemy targets and for myself, it works great for that and I can manually group its icons it puts up any way and where I want.

    You've probably seen my Mage, yes Malcanthe, but not as me playing healer. I'm an old player, I mean physically one of the oldest ones playing this game but probably not the oldest, so I have my own issues and they're also partly why I won't premade - I can't be counted on and might have to leave without warning, so I pug and enjoy it too. Don't much care being told what I should do. I enjoy playing Rift the ways I want to try to play.

    I hope sharing that debuff list proves of use to you and others. It was kindly shared with me. Thanks for the additions, I've added them to that list source.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tengri View Post
    Raid frames r for ze noobs. Who plays with sound on anyway?
    It must be hard to hear through all that dubstep right?

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