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Thread: The Battle of Port Scion -- Biased

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    Default The Battle of Port Scion -- Biased

    I am going to demonstrate while this map has distinct terrain advantages in favor of one faction. It has been my experience that this specific map is dominated by a singular faction during PvP for the simple reason that the map heavily favors their objectives. The faction which rules in Port Scion? The Guardians.


    1. The Bridge:

    The Bridge is pretty simple to hold for both factions. The singular advantage the Guardians have in this setting is the distance from Rez Pad A to Bridge B.

    The distance is shorter by enough time to allow them to mass on the bridge much faster than the Defiants. At the same time, the choke point to prevent them from massing is much larger, so they have the ability to form a better offensive to take the bridge than do the Defiants.

    http://i.imgur.com/8YlIH02.jpg

    As you can see in this simple diagram - the Guardians path is close to being a straight line. There are virtually no obstacles, and the 150% mounts easily pass through this area without getting caught on corners or having to weave through objectives.

    This simply means the Guardians can "get there quicker", and you will always notice when a match starts that the number of guardians at the Bridge objective point is greater than Defiants right out of the gate.

    Can this be overcome? Sure - with the right composition and organization, the Guardian's larger numbers and faster reinforcement can be defeated. It does, however, present a tangible advantage.


    2. Idols / Planars:

    These are simply entirely imbalanced as far as Defense and Access are considered. First we'll discuss the Southern objectives:

    • The Defiants can be cut off from their southern planar via the Bridge which connects their rez pad to the Planar Capacitor.
    • The Guardians Southern Idol of Planes is better defended as it is in a depression in the ground, which requires players get within 20m of the Idol to DPS, or they will be LoS'd - that is not the case for either of the Defiant Planar objectives. Neither of them are defended by a LoS mechanic which requires you must be closer than maximum range to attack the object.

    http://i.imgur.com/N4if2zJ.jpg

    As you can see with the above diagram - the choke point for these southern objectives prohibits a defense from the Rez Pad by the Defiants. In addition, the much more significant distance between the Rez Pad and the Point of Attack gives the Guardians an additional advantage when attacking the Southern Objective while it is being defended. This is one of the most significant advantages the Guardians have over the Defiants on this map.

    Now we can discuss the Northern Objectives - where the Guardians still have a distinct advantage.

    • It is at least 20-30% faster to reach and reinforce an assault on the Defiant Northern Capacitor than for a Defiant to reach the Guardian's Northern Idol when the Bridge is not controlled.

    http://i.imgur.com/U0vIj78.jpg

    • When the Bridge is controlled, is dramatically easier for the Guardians to attack the northern objective. Defending the Northern Idol for the Defiants also leads to a battle at two locations, while the Guardians normally only have to defend a single point of attack since it is dramatically shorter.

    http://i.imgur.com/xhnw4I9.jpg


    Bosses:

    The final obstacle is a matter of objective opinion and a matter of annoyance more than a significant advantage. The distance a Defiant must run to capture the Sourcestones. The map will show a very similar distance. The issue comes at the very end of the Defiant Sourcestone run. The long snaking pathway that leads up to the boss adds an additional few seconds to the run over the Guardians much more direct ramp that has less obstacles.
    Last edited by Patchkid; 07-06-2013 at 04:53 PM.

  2. #2
    Ascendant Kronos v's Avatar
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    guardians can still climb the northern road blockade for faster (and considerably safer) stone running.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kronos v View Post
    guardians can still climb the northern road blockade for faster (and considerably safer) stone running.
    Defiant can climb theirs too. The point is moot since SL anyway due to 61pt archon.

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    The archon thing is interesting as a strategy for PS. Too bad 61 archon is so squishy so as to be very little played in WFs, or it might be cool to have that option. Does the sourcestone not drop? I thought they made most teleports drop objective items, like when a rogue uses flashback.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Patchkid View Post
    The archon thing is interesting as a strategy for PS. Too bad 61 archon is so squishy so as to be very little played in WFs, or it might be cool to have that option. Does the sourcestone not drop? I thought they made most teleports drop objective items, like when a rogue uses flashback.
    61 archon squishy?

    1/10 troll, too obvious.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ahov View Post
    61 archon squishy?

    1/10 troll, too obvious.
    Really? Any archon I've seen is one of the easiest mages to crush quickly... Are there some crazy survivable 61 PvP archon builds? I've never seen an archon survive me as an inquisitor for longer than 30 seconds...


    Back on topic though - Port Scion = Imbalanced Terrain.
    Last edited by Patchkid; 07-06-2013 at 10:24 PM.

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    61 Archon is less squishy than a 61 Pyro, with regards to how much damage they can negate - 12 % or so with all Auras - but a Pyro have more CC capabilities. But then a Necro is even tougher.

    Anyways, I agree that we Guardians seem to win Scion pretty often.

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    A interesting an considered argument, which (fortunately for me) doesn't bear out my personal experience of this map.

    Since returning to rift a few weeks ago I've played about 10 PS maps, and have won about half, maybe more, as defiant. We usually get to the 1st dragon boss thing first for a quick 50 points and take the bridge. Generally it seems about the same as when I played in the 50 bracket and defiants in my experience won well over half.

    PS is won, in my opinion, (assuming equal dps and heals) by the team that avoids the trap of attacking the bridge from the SOUTH. I see this all the time from both sides and it usually results in a loss as the other team simply run stones from the north.

    If the other team is holding the bridge in force, priorities should be to take out the other teams idols/planars and mini bosses to minimise points from ss (this often draws enough away from the bridge to allow it to be taken), then attack the bridge from the north while running stones behind the line.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Astelle View Post
    A interesting an considered argument, which (fortunately for me) doesn't bear out my personal experience of this map.

    Since returning to rift a few weeks ago I've played about 10 PS maps, and have won about half, maybe more, as defiant. We usually get to the 1st dragon boss thing first for a quick 50 points and take the bridge. Generally it seems about the same as when I played in the 50 bracket and defiants in my experience won well over half.

    PS is won, in my opinion, (assuming equal dps and heals) by the team that avoids the trap of attacking the bridge from the SOUTH. I see this all the time from both sides and it usually results in a loss as the other team simply run stones from the north.

    If the other team is holding the bridge in force, priorities should be to take out the other teams idols/planars and mini bosses to minimise points from ss (this often draws enough away from the bridge to allow it to be taken), then attack the bridge from the north while running stones behind the line.
    Excellent strategic points. I do agree that it is possible for either team to win this map with superior strategy. It doesn't, however, negate the fact that this terrain advantage tends to make said strategy easier to execute for the Guardians - and due to that ease, I find it is easier to "convince" the Guardians to actually use strategy since it's more "convenient".

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    Cool that assumes the players understand the game. In the 50-54 and 55-59 bracket, most guardians have no idea what the objectives even are. If I don't start telling people what we need to do next they just stand at the bridge the whole time.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanzanite View Post
    Cool that assumes the players understand the game. In the 50-54 and 55-59 bracket, most guardians have no idea what the objectives even are. If I don't start telling people what we need to do next they just stand at the bridge the whole time.
    This is true, but neither team knows what they're doing most of the time and just fight for the bridge. Still doesn't address the glaring terrain imbalance.

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    "A interesting an considered argument, which (fortunately for me) doesn't bear out my personal experience of this map.

    Since returning to rift a few weeks ago I've played about 10 PS maps, and have won about half, maybe more, as defiant. We usually get to the 1st dragon boss thing first for a quick 50 points and take the bridge. Generally it seems about the same as when I played in the 50 bracket and defiants in my experience won well over half.

    PS is won, in my opinion, (assuming equal dps and heals) by the team that avoids the trap of attacking the bridge from the SOUTH. I see this all the time from both sides and it usually results in a loss as the other team simply run stones from the north.

    If the other team is holding the bridge in force, priorities should be to take out the other teams idols/planars and mini bosses to minimise points from ss (this often draws enough away from the bridge to allow it to be taken), then attack the bridge from the north while running stones behind the line. " -Astelle

    This post should be stickied..... On the Port of Scion Load Screen in game.
    Last edited by Yyrkroon; 07-08-2013 at 11:06 AM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Yyrkroon View Post

    This post should be stickied..... On the Port of Scion Load Screen in game.
    For ease of reading - I recommend using the [ quote ] [ /quote ] tags instead of " ". At first I thought your post was a double-post, and then I realized you were "quoting" someone else...

    (PS - remove the spaces within the brackets)
    Last edited by Patchkid; 07-08-2013 at 12:21 PM.

  14. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tanzanite View Post
    Cool that assumes the players understand the game. In the 50-54 and 55-59 bracket, most guardians have no idea what the objectives even are. If I don't start telling people what we need to do next they just stand at the bridge the whole time.
    Most people know, they just want Player vs Player, not Player vs Sourcestone.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Patchkid View Post
    For ease of reading - I recommend using the [ quote ] [ /quote ] tags instead of " ". At first I thought your post was a double-post, and then I realized you were "quoting" someone else...

    (PS - remove the spaces within the brackets)
    I did initially, but realized I had hit Reply with Quote above the post in question, not below, so i had the wrong one. Rather than start over, I tried to fix it, and we see where I ended up....
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