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Thread: Bring back World PvP!

  1. #1
    Shield of Telara Jawsnap's Avatar
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    Default Bring back World PvP!

    Dearest PvP'ers, longing for an alternative to Warfronts.

    Those of you are tired of endless Warfronts. Those of you who even wish the calamity that is Conquest would return. Those of you who just like sitting out in the world somewhere, waiting for a Defagant or Gaydian to show up and give him/her a good hiding.

    I, Effects @ Bloodiron, one of three GM's to Lords of War, invite you to protest with me to increase the reward gains from World PvP! The two top PvP Guilds on Bloodiron EU are protesting to Trion through tickets and feedback to increase the gains of favor and prestige in Open World PvP to give people more of a reason to contest each other out in the open world, whether organised or just going out looking for a fight!

    World PvP back in the earlier days - primarily before Conquest, was at least semi-decent. A few guilds were present on the Shard and World PvP was available almost every day. That's not necessarily the case any more and just running in to people in the world of Telara is a big enough task as it is! Back then - we could easily muster 20 of each faction to go for a brawl somewhere!

    Now there's not even any PvP Dailies to assist with the World PvP activity!

    We believe on Bloodiron, that if the Prestige/Favor gains were greater - more people would hang around the world of Telara PvP'ing whilst queued for Warfronts, instead of being sat in Tempest Bay / Sanctum / Meridian waiting for Warfronts.

    Please open up your Feedback report and send in the feedback that you wish to see the same! We truly believe it will at least assist the regeneration of World PvP if not fully restore and nurture it!

    Whilst we're also in the process - if you love PvP and are EU Region players - come over to Bloodiron and join us! The more PvP'ers we have - the easier it will be to restore World PvP.

    Thanks!

    All members of The Lords of War, Eye of Sorrow and Raptus Tempus. Bloodiron's Defiant and Guardian top PvP Guilds.

  2. #2
    RIFT Guide Writer
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    Nope.

    Arena.

  3. #3
    Champion of Telara kronor's Avatar
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    Wpvp will never be what is was 1.5-1.7 just get used to conquest and wfs mate

  4. #4
    Dhu
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jawsnap View Post
    Dearest PvP'ers, longing for an alternative to Warfronts.

    Those of you are tired of endless Warfronts. Those of you who even wish the calamity that is Conquest would return. Those of you who just like sitting out in the world somewhere, waiting for a Defagant or Gaydian to show up and give him/her a good hiding.

    I, Effects @ Bloodiron, .................to increase the reward gains from World PvP! The two top PvP Guilds on Bloodiron EU are protesting to Trion through tickets and feedback to increase the gains of favor and prestige in Open World PvP to give people more of a reason to contest each other out in the open world, whether organised or just going out looking for a fight.......................... activity!

    We believe on Bloodiron, that if the Prestige/Favor gains were greater ..................ts, instead of being sat in Tempest Bay / Sanctum / Meridian waiting for Warfronts.

    All members of The Lords of War, Eye of Sorrow and Raptus Tempus. Bloodiron's Defiant and Guardian top PvP Guilds.
    As said before -
    1) rewards not the real problem in open PVP
    2) real problems are to name just 2
    Gear - all gear should be PVP and PVE playable - no specialist gear for PVP/PVE outside of dungeons and warfronts
    Stuns/breaks etc should be the same for all classes and each class should have the same number of
    there are more but the 2 above are a couple of the most obvious - ALSO a personal bugbear of mine in PVP - the rogue slip away skill - my opinion is you make a mistake and you die

    So to recap waste of time asking for favour etc - get the real problems sorted 1st

  5. #5
    Ascendant Zaros's Avatar
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    Honestly, I think Rift should just kill wPvP altogether. Remove it entirely. Hear me out:

    Gamemodes like Conquest can't coexist with world PvP. It splits the playerbase--there'll still be people who want to do wPvP, but the population is severely diminished because most people are spending their time in Conquest, in lieu of wPvP. The waning wPvP population is further exacerbated by the way that guilds function now. Quite a few PVP guilds have transferred to PvE servers because they want to group with members of the opposite faction, which is totally justified.

    Basically what this does is creates two sectors of the game: people who want real wPvP and people who want Conquest, but both chunks of population are dwindling because of the existence of the other half. If we want a thriving "wPvP" community, Trion needs to amputate one of these so the other can grow. It might be painful at first, but it'll be better in the long run. But it seems like Trion is leaning heavily to the side of Conquest, with the aforementioned changes in place. I don't think they'd be losing too much, compared to the potential gains, if they dropped wPvP. They can then focus on pumping effort into improving the one gametype they have, and not have to worry about it being content that 46% of the PvP playerbase won't ever engage in.

    TL;DR: Remove PVP servers, remove wPvP entirely, focus on instanced wPvP instead.
    Come at me.
    Last edited by Zaros; 12-07-2012 at 05:29 AM.
    ~Quiescent

  6. #6
    Shield of Telara Jawsnap's Avatar
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    Instanced wPvP might be good Zaros, but at the same time - it'll just end up with Elite Mobs in there and the PvP will end up being PvPvE - like everything else Trion does.

    World PvP is unabused by Trion. It's just NPC's that are already there and don't interfere. There's no game mode... it's kill the opposing team, or be killed. Simple as that. There's no free-resses at the graveyard with full HP and Mana, safe from harms way whilst you rebuff, etc etc. It's all out strategic play.

    I think those people who don't miss wPvP didn't do it enough - or enjoy the comforts of instanced PvP instead.

    Anyway - I just wanted to put the word out there that Bloodiron players are actively trying to get Trion to raise the bar on wPvP rewards to help entice PvP'ers to come back out in to the world, instead of sitting in their home cities all day waiting for Warfronts.

  7. #7
    Plane Touched hziulquoigmnzhah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dhu View Post
    As said before -
    1) rewards not the real problem in open PVP
    2) real problems are to name just 2
    Gear - all gear should be PVP and PVE playable - no specialist gear for PVP/PVE outside of dungeons and warfronts
    Stuns/breaks etc should be the same for all classes and each class should have the same number of
    there are more but the 2 above are a couple of the most obvious - ALSO a personal bugbear of mine in PVP - the rogue slip away skill - my opinion is you make a mistake and you die

    I agree with literally none of this.

    Quote Originally Posted by Dhu View Post
    So to recap waste of time asking for favour etc - get the real problems sorted 1st
    This is right! (except for that what you deem the "real problems" are not the real problems)

    Quote Originally Posted by Zaros View Post
    TL;DR: Remove PVP servers, remove wPvP entirely, focus on instanced wPvP instead.
    Come at me.
    I absolutely agree with this. If Trion could just fix CQ to be something enjoyable, something people wanted to play with siege mechanics / large open map / instanced but drop-in/drop-out with no penalty then that **** would be off the hook.

  8. #8
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    OWPVP is just zerging and ganking anyway. It's really terrible, especially when there is nothing to fight over anyway. They would have to change the whole open world system around it.

    IFOWPVP (Instanced Faked Open World PVP) with semi-team balance is much better . . . if they actually made things to fight over matter and they made the reward system work if you just jump in for 10 minutes or play the 6 hour match from beginning to end. Plus the rewards in PVP should never be sought after for PVE and PVE not for PVP. . . . it just creates animosity and terrible gaming because people feel forced (even though they technically aren't) to play a style of play they don't want to play. Then your teams suck and your games suck.

    I also agree that PVE and PVP gear should be just as good for open world content, we're pretty close now in that if you expect PVP (on a PVP server or flagged) you want to have your PVP gear on, and if you expect PVE you want your PVE gear on . . . and in both cases all open world content is face roll easy. I wonder if there could be an enchant that is purchased with favor that would increase your damage by a certain percent when not in PVP combat . . . at least then the open world grind speeds would be similar, but you would still need PVE hit gear/weapons if you wanted to do raids . . . or possibly when you are in PVE combat your gear is auto replaced with the entry level expert gear if you have PVP gear on so that it doesn't cost anything like PVE players get in PVP (I'm just throwing the ideas out there).

  9. #9
    Telaran
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaros View Post
    Honestly, I think Rift should just kill wPvP altogether. Remove it entirely. Hear me out:

    Gamemodes like Conquest can't coexist with world PvP. It splits the playerbase--there'll still be people who want to do wPvP, but the population is severely diminished because most people are spending their time in Conquest, in lieu of wPvP. The waning wPvP population is further exacerbated by the way that guilds function now. Quite a few PVP guilds have transferred to PvE servers because they want to group with members of the opposite faction, which is totally justified.

    Basically what this does is creates two sectors of the game: people who want real wPvP and people who want Conquest, but both chunks of population are dwindling because of the existence of the other half. If we want a thriving "wPvP" community, Trion needs to amputate one of these so the other can grow. It might be painful at first, but it'll be better in the long run. But it seems like Trion is leaning heavily to the side of Conquest, with the aforementioned changes in place. I don't think they'd be losing too much, compared to the potential gains, if they dropped wPvP. They can then focus on pumping effort into improving the one gametype they have, and not have to worry about it being content that 46% of the PvP playerbase won't ever engage in.

    TL;DR: Remove PVP servers, remove wPvP entirely, focus on instanced wPvP instead.
    Come at me.
    I agree, however nice world pvp is.. and i love a good hate-war between factions, it feels like that ship has sailed on Rift. Focusing on instanced pvp and overall pvp balance would be a better choise.

  10. #10
    Ascendant Credo's Avatar
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    Make all servers PvE.
    Add a "Frontiers Zone" for world pvp that all servers can access.
    Kill.
    Even free cost too much now

  11. #11
    Ascendant Aeonblade's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zaros View Post
    Honestly, I think Rift should just kill wPvP altogether. Remove it entirely. Hear me out:

    Gamemodes like Conquest can't coexist with world PvP. It splits the playerbase--there'll still be people who want to do wPvP, but the population is severely diminished because most people are spending their time in Conquest, in lieu of wPvP. The waning wPvP population is further exacerbated by the way that guilds function now. Quite a few PVP guilds have transferred to PvE servers because they want to group with members of the opposite faction, which is totally justified.

    Basically what this does is creates two sectors of the game: people who want real wPvP and people who want Conquest, but both chunks of population are dwindling because of the existence of the other half. If we want a thriving "wPvP" community, Trion needs to amputate one of these so the other can grow. It might be painful at first, but it'll be better in the long run. But it seems like Trion is leaning heavily to the side of Conquest, with the aforementioned changes in place. I don't think they'd be losing too much, compared to the potential gains, if they dropped wPvP. They can then focus on pumping effort into improving the one gametype they have, and not have to worry about it being content that 46% of the PvP playerbase won't ever engage in.

    TL;DR: Remove PVP servers, remove wPvP entirely, focus on instanced wPvP instead.
    Come at me.
    Well said sir, at this point, let's just focus on making CQ something everyone can enjoy rather than beating a dead horse! Here's to hoping for a keep siege/tower siege type map in the future for me
    Leondria 60 P6x Mage

  12. #12
    Champion of Telara Leif's Avatar
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    Default Instant Adventures and PVP

    The idea I've been kicking around my head lately: PVP IA's.

    Conceptually, this would be a queue, like the existing Random Zone IA queue, to take you to a random zone, with two competing factions vying to complete the same objective in a small area, thereby creating open world PVP combat. Objectives would range from gathering X number of finite resources before the other faction, to "defend the wardstone" IA's where one faction plays the role of the "planar invaders", in the same vein as Defiant and Guardian NPC's invading Freemarch and Silverwood. Locations for the IA's would be scattered throughout a zone, with the IA periodically switching zones to keep the scenery from stagnating.

    Some notes:
    -Through mentoring and stat normalization, all zones could be used, which would also involve lower level players who want to PVP. This would also allow slot normalization, as is used in warfronts.
    -Multiple graveyards around the objective area, to prevent camping.
    -Warfront Merc'ing can be used to balance teams.
    -IA scaling implemented for various group sizes.
    -While in the group, each faction would be PVP flagged, but only to those in the PVP IA, thereby preventing huge swaths of people not in the IA group from dominating the other faction.
    -With the IA reward system, rewards could be given that make the IA's worthwhile, ranging from bonus favor/prestige granting consumables, to exp crystals and vanity loot.
    -Could tie into existing open world PVP content, like PVP rifts, guild PVP quests, and Unseen/Order of the Eye rep dailies.
    Last edited by Leif; 12-07-2012 at 07:02 AM.
    Waiting for Wildstar...

  13. #13
    Ascendant
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    Quote Originally Posted by Leif View Post
    Through mentoring and stat normalization, all zones could be used, which would also involve lower level players who want to PVP. This would also allow slot normalization, as is used in warfronts.
    Of course, since it's open world one team would just bring their tricked out level 60 to whatever zone and slaughter the level 20 "newbies" . . . since in Rift cheating always wins.

    Quote Originally Posted by Leif View Post
    Multiple graveyards around the objective area, to prevent camping.
    Good plan, but as soon as people know where the nearest spawns are they will just camp anyway. It will instantly turn in to a zerg fest of who can bring the most out-of-IA people and then one team will give up and it will fizzle out in a few minutes.

    Quote Originally Posted by Leif View Post
    -Warfront Merc'ing can be used to balance teams.
    Not so sure that can work open world, which is why the cross faction stuff is disabled on PVP servers and when flagged for PVP.

    Quote Originally Posted by Leif View Post
    IA scaling implemented for various group sizes.
    But if the objectives aren't PVP the PVP players won't play it anyway and will instead fill up the forums with "Why do you make us PVE to PVP".

    Quote Originally Posted by Leif View Post
    While in the group, each faction would be PVP flagged, but only to those in the PVP IA, thereby preventing huge swaths of people not in the IA group from dominating the other faction.
    Then why not just make the whole thing in an instance anyway . . . it's not OW-PVP-IA it's segregated from OW. Plus, in an instance it can be cross-server making it far more likely to match groups up anyway.
    Last edited by Sariina; 12-07-2012 at 07:34 AM.

  14. #14
    Champion of Telara Leif's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sariina View Post
    Of course, since it's open world one team would just bring their tricked out level 60 to whatever zone and slaughter the level 20 "newbies" . . . since in Rift cheating always wins.
    Read.
    Quote Originally Posted by Leif View Post
    While in the group, each faction would be PVP flagged, but only to those in the PVP IA, thereby preventing huge swaths of people not in the IA group from dominating the other faction.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sariina View Post
    Good plan, but as soon as people know where the nearest spawns are they will just camp anyway. It will instantly turn in to a zerg fest of who can bring the most out-of-IA people and then one team will give up and it will fizzle out in a few minutes.
    Rotating respawn locations.

    Also, read.

    Quote Originally Posted by Leif View Post
    While in the group, each faction would be PVP flagged, but only to those in the PVP IA, thereby preventing huge swaths of people not in the IA group from dominating the other faction.

    Quote Originally Posted by Sariina View Post
    Not so sure that can work open world, which is why the cross faction stuff is disabled on PVP servers and when flagged for PVP.
    Coding new features, how does that work? /sarc

    Quote Originally Posted by Sariina View Post
    But if the objectives aren't PVP the PVP players won't play it anyway and will instead fill up the forums with "Why do you make us PVE to PVP".
    Just stop. Objectives exist to focus the attention of players to specific areas and create conflict points and serve as a means to "win".

    Quote Originally Posted by Sariina View Post
    Then why not just make the whole thing in an instance anyway . . . it's not OW-PVP-IA it's segregated from OW. Plus, in an instance it can be cross-server making it far more likely to match groups up anyway.
    Team balance is more important to an enjoyable PVP experience than the ability to zerg. If it's in the open world, and it's PVP, it's open world PVP.
    Last edited by Leif; 12-07-2012 at 07:49 AM.
    Waiting for Wildstar...

  15. #15
    Plane Touched Shyessa's Avatar
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    Design new epic map instead of recycling the existing map. Copy and paste WvWvW of GW2.

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