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Thread: How I would fix Conquest

  1. #1
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    Default How I would fix Conquest

    There is a lot right with conquest and a few things wrong, imho. First the difference in favor, prestige, exp from 1st place, 2nd place, 3rd place. I have been on a lot of both wining sides and losing sides. Winner's earn 40 - 60k favor, losers 10 - 15k that is a huge issue.

    So my 3 biggest issues with CQ:
    1) Mini bosses!!!!
    Either get rid of mini bosses or make them do something. Have them spawn at important points like EYE, RW, CM and have them control that point when the spawn.

    For example: Oath holds CM, the mini spawns and now that mini controls CM and you have to kill it to gain control of that point from now on.

    This will help the PvE and PvP people.

    2) Que issues
    So we all know (right now) NF maxes out and has much bigger numbers of people than Oath or Dom. How can we fix it. Well random ques would be one way to go, but then you'll just have a lot of 5 man teams trying to get into groups.

    The other fix would be bolstering. Either you bolster the hit points, Armor, Attack power or the weaker teams or you bolster the exp, prestige, and favor of the weaker teams.

    I would be fine with being on the losing end of a CQ if I was getting 75% or 80% of the winner but not 30 to 40% it becomes a waste of time.

    3) AFK players.
    Put back in AFK reporting or add a 24 or 48 hour CQ ban (like the 15 minute WF ban) for CQ afk people. Right now on the losing side I see people just go AFK in the base and tell the rais. "F this going AFK, i'll be back later."

    This is needs a fix.

    Thanks!

  2. #2
    Plane Touched Khatovar's Avatar
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    A bit off topic, but on topic if your "24 to 48 hour ban" actually got implemented. Assuming it affected conquest in the same way it does WF.

    I'm a bit frustrated with the WF 15 minute ban right now.

    For about the past month Rift has been crashing my computer. This is on two different machines that have previously had not problems with this sort of thing.

    When my computer crashes, it boots me from the WF.

    When it boots me from the WF, I get the penalty.

    If I'm running a vial, that's a good portion of that vial completely wasted. I've lost as much 30% to 50% of a vial due to this issue.
    Last edited by Khatovar; 11-05-2012 at 01:11 PM.

  3. #3
    RIFT Guide Writer Redcruxs's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Khatovar View Post
    A bit off topic, but on topic if your "24 to 48 hour ban" actually got implemented. Assuming it affected conquest in the same way it does WF.

    I'm a bit frustrated with the WF 15 minute ban right now.

    For about the past month Rift has been crashing my computer. This is on two different machines that have previously had not problems with this sort of thing.

    When my computer crashes, it boots me from the WF.

    When it boots me from the WF, I get the penalty.

    If I'm running a vial, that's a good portion of that vial completely wasted. I've lost as much 30% to 50% of a vial due to this issue.
    You are getting the penalties mixed up. In warfronts, if you leave early (or crash, or get kicked by AFK) then you get the deserter debuff. In conquest you are free to join and leave at any time so there is no such thing as getting the deserter debuff by crashing in conquest.

    The OP is talking about an AFK only debuff similar to the deserter debuff that would only get applied if you were kicked from the conquest by being AFK. I think 24-48 hours is a little extreme though, in a warfront the 15min debuff you get is about equal to the length of one warfront so conquest debuff should be an equivalent amount of time. Basically it should prevent you from entering the current CQ for as long as it lasts plus the hour CQ cooldown

  4. #4
    Ascendant Charlice's Avatar
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    Had a great leader in an Oath match last week.

    He dragged the mini boss to one of the Caps we needed to grab. Worked a treat. Best of all we won the match.

    The mini bosses are a frustration if you want to win, but, tactically they're doing their job.
    If a team is going to waste time on them, they deserve to lose.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlice View Post
    Had a great leader in an Oath match last week.

    He dragged the mini boss to one of the Caps we needed to grab. Worked a treat. Best of all we won the match.

    The mini bosses are a frustration if you want to win, but, tactically they're doing their job.
    If a team is going to waste time on them, they deserve to lose.
    Not sure what you mean. If you mean tactically they are doing their job by having more PvE focused players join CQ and do nothing other than kill the mini's then yes. I just thought the purpose of CQ was for PvP and having min's really detracts from that. It is common to have half or more of the raid group on a losing side just leave to go kill a mini, basically just giving up and saying well at least I can earn a few more marks.

    In one match a guy spent over 10 minutes explaining that if we killed all the mini instead of trying to win we would earn more marks and source stones than if we won.

  6. #6
    Ascendant Charlice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archongamer View Post
    Not sure what you mean. If you mean tactically they are doing their job by having more PvE focused players join CQ and do nothing other than kill the mini's then yes. I just thought the purpose of CQ was for PvP and having min's really detracts from that. It is common to have half or more of the raid group on a losing side just leave to go kill a mini, basically just giving up and saying well at least I can earn a few more marks.

    In one match a guy spent over 10 minutes explaining that if we killed all the mini instead of trying to win we would earn more marks and source stones than if we won.
    I think everything PvE related should be removed from CQ's. The CQ bonus should only be usable in PvP, the ISS should go, the letting of players in when the timer up.. STUPID.

    Yeah, chasing mini's is stupid.. but... it's not always just PvE players that chase them. There's no surer way to lose a match than focus on them imo. But the way I look at it, they are there as a diversion. They are there to make the 'team' play like a team. Sadly most people don't.. but then... they lose.

    CQ teams, playing as teams, if the numbers are even, all have equal chance of winning. CQ is tactics more than anything else. That's the only reason I think they should stay.

    It's the uneven numbers on teams that bugs me. Players should be zoned in, in equal numbers, across all teams.

    The guy explaining the mini's and how awesome they are... wouldn't it be nice if you could vote kick him and it stuck? That needs to be fixed too.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlice View Post
    Had a great leader in an Oath match last week.

    He dragged the mini boss to one of the Caps we needed to grab. Worked a treat. Best of all we won the match.

    The mini bosses are a frustration if you want to win, but, tactically they're doing their job.
    If a team is going to waste time on them, they deserve to lose.
    I saw that and had to wonder if the evil spirit that was posessing NF had moved on to Oath. GG!

    /pray this means COMPETITIVE matches are incoming.....
    Quote Originally Posted by Hailolyergory View Post
    All, Please nerf paper it is too strong, but leave scissors alone they are fine.
    Yours Truly,
    Rock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlice View Post
    I think everything PvE related should be removed from CQ's. The CQ bonus should only be usable in PvP, the ISS should go, the letting of players in when the timer up.. STUPID.

    Yeah, chasing mini's is stupid.. but... it's not always just PvE players that chase them. There's no surer way to lose a match than focus on them imo. But the way I look at it, they are there as a diversion. They are there to make the 'team' play like a team. Sadly most people don't.. but then... they lose.

    CQ teams, playing as teams, if the numbers are even, all have equal chance of winning. CQ is tactics more than anything else. That's the only reason I think they should stay.

    It's the uneven numbers on teams that bugs me. Players should be zoned in, in equal numbers, across all teams.

    The guy explaining the mini's and how awesome they are... wouldn't it be nice if you could vote kick him and it stuck? That needs to be fixed too.
    I think they should leave ALL the normal zone mobs in, only make em hit twice as hard. That way you can kick people in to stuff for the lulz.
    Quote Originally Posted by Hailolyergory View Post
    All, Please nerf paper it is too strong, but leave scissors alone they are fine.
    Yours Truly,
    Rock.

  9. #9
    Ascendant Charlice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bliter View Post
    I saw that and had to wonder if the evil spirit that was posessing NF had moved on to Oath. GG!

    /pray this means COMPETITIVE matches are incoming.....
    They're just so few and far between, and it could be so much fun.

    Yes there is still some great matches, but so many are full of whiners it makes me feel like killing kittens.


    Who ever it was leading that match kudos to you! I am almost embarrassed to say I was SOOOO excited when we won! GO OATH GO!! PEW PEW PEW!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bliter View Post
    I think they should leave ALL the normal zone mobs in, only make em hit twice as hard. That way you can kick people in to stuff for the lulz.
    Lol, that would be awesome.
    Last edited by Charlice; 11-05-2012 at 05:17 PM.


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  10. #10
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    First of all about removing all the PvE related stuff i totaly agree.

    The problem tough is more on the pvp stuff... what i mean is that CQ is not the most effective way to get ISS they are jsut and added bonus, people dont join CQ to get ISS.
    The greatest problem are the essences that are BiS for PvE too and thus even though they are avtually PvP essences many PvE players join CQ to get them.

    Think how much better a CQ match would be if the ones who joined where only (or at least mostly) the ones who wanted to pvp....


    Also about the random queue i dont think it will solve anything.

    Rememeber at the first days of CQ that NF used to farm favor in a big zerg and Oath used to win? What did Dom do then? Absolutely nothing... all the players who couldnt join Oath or NF went Domi and they couldnt coordinate because some of them wanted to form a zerg and farm and some wanted to split cap and win.
    With a random queue all factions will be like that.

    There are other ways to balance teams.

    Perhpas bolstering as u said, or perhaps a slightly modified queue system.

    If an not mistaken the way it is now is:
    all factions can have 1 raid, when its full on all 3 factions a second is available, when all factions have 2 full raids a 3rd is available etc etc.
    If u replace the word "raid" with "party" would teams be much more balanced??

    As for AFK reporting, it goes without saying... ofc i agree

    Penalty for the ones kicked... i have no opinion.. i dont mind having no penalty.

    About mini bosses i agree with your idea but i dont really mind where they spawn now...

    I just think they should be focus points for pvp. Something should be done to make it necesairy to kill them and then people will go to them and there will be some fights similar to the final Archlich fight in the first days of CQ.
    Perhaps if capping was impossible while a mini-boss is up and if mini-bosses spawned one at a time, OR if killing a mini-boss would give a buff to the whole faction perhaps +% all stats or +% dmg on extractors or -% dmg from players. Things that could potentially change the course of a battle.


    The kill count as it is would be huge problem if teams are balanced...
    The kill count at this point is huge... i ve had matches that lasted around 2hours or more and we still had 3.5-4k kill remaining...
    Kill count should be based on the number of palyers in the current match or, as someone suggested a long time ago, X kills could be substracted every Y mins from the kill count to ensure a maximun duration of each CQ match.

    And finally to the most important problem in my opinion...
    Zerg always wins (or at least almost always)

    Think about why this happens...
    3 of the 4 portals are surrounded by extractors while CM is at the far edge of nowhere with minmal strategic use.
    On the other hand the Eye is the center of everything.

    Near the Eye there are 5 or 6 extractors (including the portal) that can be easily kept by a zerg, no strategy needed. This means that a zerg can very easily control 30-35% of the extractors purely due to numbers with minimal movement.
    Pretty hard for others to win, isnt it?

    I ve often been in matches playing as Oath and we would cap points around the map having 44%-50% control and all that was left to cap where the Eye (where death by NF was certain) and some high risk points very close to the enemy bases.

    My point is that the number of the extractors should remain the same but they should be moved further away from the Eye to allow for more strategic movement and capping


    Sorry for the long post
    Thank you for reading (if u did )
    Last edited by emferian; 11-05-2012 at 07:42 PM.

  11. #11
    General of Telara Ashh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Archongamer View Post
    Not sure what you mean. If you mean tactically they are doing their job by having more PvE focused players join CQ and do nothing other than kill the mini's then yes. I just thought the purpose of CQ was for PvP and having min's really detracts from that. It is common to have half or more of the raid group on a losing side just leave to go kill a mini, basically just giving up and saying well at least I can earn a few more marks.

    In one match a guy spent over 10 minutes explaining that if we killed all the mini instead of trying to win we would earn more marks and source stones than if we won.
    I think you missed his point and your suggestions suck.

  12. #12
    Ascendant Charlice's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ashh View Post
    i think you missed his point and your suggestions suck.

    omg ashh!!! Her point! /stab!


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  13. #13
    General of Telara Ashh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by emferian View Post
    First of all about removing all the PvE related stuff i totaly agree.

    The problem tough is more on the pvp stuff... what i mean is that CQ is not the most effective way to get ISS they are jsut and added bonus, people dont join CQ to get ISS.
    The greatest problem are the essences that are BiS for PvE too and thus even though they are avtually PvP essences many PvE players join CQ to get them.

    Think how much better a CQ match would be if the ones who joined where only (or at least mostly) the ones who wanted to pvp....


    Also about the random queue i dont think it will solve anything.

    Rememeber at the first days of CQ that NF used to farm favor in a big zerg and Oath used to win? What did Dom do then? Absolutely nothing... all the players who couldnt join Oath or NF went Domi and they couldnt coordinate because some of them wanted to form a zerg and farm and some wanted to split cap and win.
    With a random queue all factions will be like that.

    There are other ways to balance teams.

    Perhpas bolstering as u said, or perhaps a slightly modified queue system.

    If an not mistaken the way it is now is:
    all factions can have 1 raid, when its full on all 3 factions a second is available, when all factions have 2 full raids a 3rd is available etc etc.
    If u replace the word "raid" with "party" would teams be much more balanced??

    As for AFK reporting, it goes without saying... ofc i agree

    Penalty for the ones kicked... i have no opinion.. i dont mind having no penalty.

    About mini bosses i agree with your idea but i dont really mind where they spawn now...

    I just think they should be focus points for pvp. Something should be done to make it necesairy to kill them and then people will go to them and there will be some fights similar to the final Archlich fight in the first days of CQ.
    Perhaps if capping was impossible while a mini-boss is up and if mini-bosses spawned one at a time, OR if killing a mini-boss would give a buff to the whole faction perhaps +% all stats or +% dmg on extractors or -% dmg from players. Things that could potentially change the course of a battle.


    The kill count as it is would be huge problem if teams are balanced...
    The kill count at this point is huge... i ve had matches that lasted around 2hours or more and we still had 3.5-4k kill remaining...
    Kill count should be based on the number of palyers in the current match or, as someone suggested a long time ago, X kills could be substracted every Y mins from the kill count to ensure a maximun duration of each CQ match.

    And finally to the most important problem in my opinion...
    Zerg always wins (or at least almost always)

    Think about why this happens...
    3 of the 4 portals are surrounded by extractors while CM is at the far edge of nowhere with minmal strategic use.
    On the other hand the Eye is the center of everything.

    Near the Eye there are 5 or 6 extractors (including the portal) that can be easily kept by a zerg, no strategy needed. This means that a zerg can very easily control 30-35% of the extractors purely due to numbers with minimal movement.
    Pretty hard for others to win, isnt it?

    I ve often been in matches playing as Oath and we would cap points around the map having 44%-50% control and all that was left to cap where the Eye (where death by NF was certain) and some high risk points very close to the enemy bases.

    My point is that the number of the extractors should remain the same but they should be moved further away from the Eye to allow for more strategic movement and capping


    Sorry for the long post
    Thank you for reading (if u did )
    1. Don't remove all the PvE stuff, its where the battles start, derp.
    2. CQ is meant for everyone, not just PvPers. Raids are meant for everyone, not just PvEers. See what I did there.
    3. An OPTION for random Queue is not a terrible idea.
    4. Bolstering is in place already.
    5. AFK reporting is ok , 15 mins though.
    6. Mini Bosses serve their purpose whether you realize it or not.
    7. Kill count is to high now.
    8. Zergs defiantly do not always win, I know this for fact. Organized raids win CQ's.

    CQ's is pretty chill right now, just really need to lower the kills tbh. It even has fishing, although Legendaryheals always ruins my fishing expeditions :'(

  14. #14
    General of Telara Ashh's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Charlice View Post
    omg ashh!!! Her point! /stab!
    derp.... her

    sorry i was to worried about being clever to fully read the post :'(
    Last edited by Ashh; 11-05-2012 at 09:49 PM.

  15. #15
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ashh View Post
    I think you missed his point and your suggestions suck.
    Well thanks for you well thought out plan to make it better. Go back to the bridge you crawled out from under

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