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Thread: PvP Arena in Rift. Yes or no?

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    Soulwalker KillTastic123's Avatar
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    Default PvP Arena in Rift. Yes or no?

    I'm not sure if this kind of thing has been posted on forums before or if Trion is already working on bringing Arenas into the game.. but I am going to make this simple and easy. Just post your opinions about what you think. 'Yes there should be Arenas introduced', or 'no, there shouldn't be.' In my opinion... Yes there should be Arenas introduced because they are skill based PvP matches (Once you have high end PvP gear obviously).
    Thanks

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    Champion of Telara
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    Quote Originally Posted by KillTastic123 View Post
    I'm not sure if this kind of thing has been posted on forums before or if Trion is already working on bringing Arenas into the game.. but I am going to make this simple and easy. Just post your opinions about what you think. 'Yes there should be Arenas introduced', or 'no, there shouldn't be.' In my opinion... Yes there should be Arenas introduced because they are skill based PvP matches (Once you have high end PvP gear obviously).
    Thanks
    Im on the fence.

    Yes if its understood that no balancing will be done as a result of imbalances within arenas and that no gear better than T2 PvP gear / HK gear is available from it.

    Otherwise no, it would perpetuate imbalance and overly easy gear aquisition.

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    Shadowlander Malignos's Avatar
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    No, there shouldn't be arenas in RIFT because that is contrary to the "massively" part of it being an MMO. As a PVP'er I want epic sized battles that rage for hours and cause you to forget what time it is so your spouse has to yell at you to log off because you were having too much fun. Arena is the opposite of that.

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    Telaran Themuzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malignos View Post
    No, there shouldn't be arenas in RIFT because that is contrary to the "massively" part of it being an MMO. As a PVP'er I want epic sized battles that rage for hours and cause you to forget what time it is so your spouse has to yell at you to log off because you were having too much fun. Arena is the opposite of that.
    This^^, tbh.

    But perhaps the current dueling system could be tweaked to allow for anything from 1 v 1's to 5 v 5's with a last man standing victory condition?

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    Plane Touched Nakotix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Malignos View Post
    No, there shouldn't be arenas in RIFT because that is contrary to the "massively" part of it being an MMO. As a PVP'er I want epic sized battles that rage for hours and cause you to forget what time it is so your spouse has to yell at you to log off because you were having too much fun. Arena is the opposite of that.
    Why can't there be both? All the more content the better.

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    It doesn't matter to me. I won't be playing them, but I do pvp. But IF they are introduced the rewards should NOT be anything to enhance an item or character as far as winning. Cosmetic only i.e. mount, hat, outfit, etc. I don't want to be pigeon-holed like they did in WOW where all the arena teams went into BG's and facerolled everyone because their gear was king of the hill, thus forcing you to do arena to get the best gear.

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    Id like the option of a controlled environment to test builds in 1v1, some kind of "default" arena would be nice where both players are completely *even* apart for class imbalances.

    I think it would be really helpful for the community so we can actually WATCH and learn too, and it will aid the devs with fine tuning the balance on a 1v1 basis.

    A betting system could work out very nicely too, like a bank where arena combatants deposit a little plat as a forfeit if they lose or maybe an item or whatnot.

    Why not!

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    5vs5 Black Garden, Group Queue only. Best solution for anyone.

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    Ascendant Kyera's Avatar
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    No. Put in a 5v5 warfront (or a couple, if you want terrain variety). No leaderboards or gear or stupid **** -- just bragging rights.
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    Rift Disciple Euthan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pett View Post
    Im on the fence.

    Yes if its understood that no balancing will be done as a result of imbalances within arenas and that no gear better than T2 PvP gear / HK gear is available from it.

    Otherwise no, it would perpetuate imbalance and overly easy gear aquisition.
    This all day long and twice on Sundays.
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    Ascendant Meina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pett View Post
    Im on the fence.

    Yes if its understood that no balancing will be done as a result of imbalances within arenas and that no gear better than T2 PvP gear / HK gear is available from it.

    Otherwise no, it would perpetuate imbalance and overly easy gear aquisition.
    This

    Quote Originally Posted by Balrog21 View Post
    It doesn't matter to me. I won't be playing them, but I do pvp. But IF they are introduced the rewards should NOT be anything to enhance an item or character as far as winning. Cosmetic only i.e. mount, hat, outfit, etc. I don't want to be pigeon-holed like they did in WOW where all the arena teams went into BG's and facerolled everyone because their gear was king of the hill, thus forcing you to do arena to get the best gear.
    And this

    The biggest problem with WoW arenas was that they were made to focal point of WoW PvP. Arenas are a very niche form of PvP and forcing the masses to do them so they could compete did nothing but create a lot of animosity and dissension within the WoW player base.

    They also created a ton of extra work for the Blizzard dev's because the game was not designed with arenas in mind. This led to a constant string of "must have" team compositions and an endless cycle of nerfs and buffs based on small scale PvP, which the game was not built to support.

    Trion is trying to avoid all that. They've stated from the very beginning that Rift will not have an "esport". They've also mentioned that they will not be attempting to balance this game around small scale, arena-like PvP because, quite simply, it is nearly impossible to do.

    This is not to say that we will never have an arena-esque WF, but if we did it will most likely be something like people have described in this thread. No special stat effecting rewards, no special attention from the dev's, balance-wise and almost definitely not anything smaller than 5v5.
    Last edited by Meina; 06-08-2012 at 07:35 AM.

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    Plane Walker Grimt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Meina View Post
    This


    The biggest problem with WoW arenas was that they were made to focal point of WoW PvP. Arenas are a very niche form of PvP and forcing the masses to do them so they could compete did nothing but create a lot of animosity and dissension within the WoW player base.

    They also created a ton of extra work for the Blizzard dev's because the game was not designed with arenas in mind. This led to a constant string of "must have" team compositions and an endless cycle of nerfs and buffs based on small scale PvP, which the game was not built to support.

    Trion is trying to avoid all that. They've stated from the very beginning that Rift will not have an "esport". They've also mentioned that they will not be attempting to balance this game around small scale, arena-like PvP because, quite simply, it is nearly impossible to do.

    This is not to say that we will never have an arena-esque WF, but if we did it will most likely be something like people have described in this thread. No special stat effecting rewards, no special attention from the dev's, balance-wise and almost definitely not anything smaller than 5v5.

    This is exactly true. I played a lot of WoW PvP and so did a couple of my sons. WoW totally screwed it up by giving arena players the best way to get gear that was significantly better than you could get otherwise. It's the single biggest reason I quit WoW and came to Rift.

    I also do not think that there is fundamentally much wrong with arena-style play, but it should not define PvP in the game and it needs to be designed more intelligently than WoW did it. No access to better gear or better stats and no messing with abilities by the devs to make it work. Maybe have leaderboards for rankings or even unique titles, but limit the rewards to bragging rights.

    I wonder if it would require much development effort to simply set things up like a PvP version of a dungeon, where you queue for a predetermined slot (five player example: two melee dps, one ranged dps, two healers). They might even be able to hold them in the existing dungeon maps themselves, except with the mobs and bosses turned off. Make it kind of a search-and-destroy mission. A point for each player on the winning side, nothing for the loser.

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    Ascendant Taptap's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nakotix View Post
    Why can't there be both? All the more content the better.
    Quote Originally Posted by Pett View Post
    Im on the fence.

    Yes if its understood that no balancing will be done as a result of imbalances within arenas and that no gear better than T2 PvP gear / HK gear is available from it.

    Otherwise no, it would perpetuate imbalance and overly easy gear aquisition.
    I've been in limited agreement to the two above quoted since game launch. I do note that some people who would not participate are still, somehow, against it and I'm old enough not to really wonder why.


    Quote Originally Posted by Kyera View Post
    No. Put in a 5v5 warfront (or a couple, if you want terrain variety). No leaderboards or gear or stupid **** -- just bragging rights.
    Your way or the highway? Well, I don't really think you mean for it to be taken that way but that you would instead like to see 5v5 warfronts if it had to be either/or. But it doesn't have to be either/or. It can be both, and I like both ideas. Not that I'd participate in either of them, but I'm supportive for those who want to. Variety is the spice of life and keeps subs.
    Last edited by Taptap; 06-08-2012 at 08:56 AM. Reason: missing word

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    Mei
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    He said the "A" word!
    Fluent

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    Ascendant Kyera's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Taptap View Post
    Your way or the highway? Well, I don't really think you mean for it to be taken that way but that you would instead like to see 5v5 warfronts if it had to be either/or. But it doesn't have to be either/or. It can be both, and I like both ideas. Not that I'd participate in either of them, but I'm supportive for those who want to. Variety is the spice of life and keeps subs.
    I'd make the case that arena and arena-style environs foster and develop a different culture, reduce group makeup to an extremely base, cookie-cutter level, influence balancing decisions (and subsequent complaints about balancing decisions), and bisect the community in an unfavourable way. This is especially true if you put a quantifiable rating system in play -- ELO-based or otherwise -- that people will try to game and/or use as a measuring stick.

    If Trion wants to put arenas in, and is willing to ignore them in the grand scheme of design/balance/engine improvements, I'm not going to oppose them. It's not what I want from guild vs. guild or "open" PvP, and I sure as **** don't want it to become a large part of the game and siphon resources so a select few can *** their e-peens about their scores and bring it up in other games as though it actually means a ******* thing.

    So, yes, my way, or the highway. Besides, that's how most people are on here -- am I held to a higher or different standard, for some special reason?
    Last edited by Kyera; 06-08-2012 at 09:15 AM.
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