The Rage against the Twinks

[Rymer]

Ah, the QQing of twinks... so funny, so tasty.

The Goodbye Twinking thread had the right quotes, but didn't give sources, so here they are:

* Experience locking has been removed now that you can set your level lower via Mentoring!

Warfronts - You will not be allowed to enter lower level WFs while mentored. No idea if this is how it is working at the moment since I haven't tried, but that is the plan - No mentoring for WFs.

A couple of notes however:
* Twinking could always be added back in trivially. All they have to do is enable mentoring in WFs. Of course then, anyone could twink (sort of).
* Why add twinking in, and then remove it again? ... Well I'm sure they'll never tell us, but quick guess would be that enough new players are entering that they don't need it to keep the lower level queues alive.

[tevikolady]

So who is with me to put in extra effort into twinking while its here and pwn under skilled under geared QQ noobs because of what they have done ?? I honestly never went out of my way to kill all the noobs, I always went for the more geared / Pro twinkers but now I wont be...

Uhm, yeah...

No.

But make them cry for me. Beat them into utter oblivion and make it hurt so bad they won't want to roll up alts for fear that the beating carries over to tehir alts.

[Kyera]

With Conquest coming in, I'm not sure how much time I'd actually be playing on my twinks... but I guess it's good to know I can free up the 49 Cleric slot, since I've already got a 50 cleric.

[Charlice]

Ah, the QQing of twinks... so funny, so tasty.

The Goodbye Twinking thread had the right quotes, but didn't give sources, so here they are:


A couple of notes however:
* Twinking could always be added back in trivially. All they have to do is enable mentoring in WFs. Of course then, anyone could twink (sort of).
* Why add twinking in, and then remove it again? ... Well I'm sure they'll never tell us, but quick guess would be that enough new players are entering that they don't need it to keep the lower level queues alive.

I don't think mentoring for warfronts is a good idea, unless the undergeared players really want something to complain about. Imagine going toe to toe with a mentored down lvl 50 ID raider with max PA.. lool.

That being said, I can imagine Trion bringing it in, purely because they won't spend any time thinking about the consequences.

[tevikolady]

I don't think mentoring for warfronts is a good idea, unless the undergeared players really want something to complain about. Imagine going toe to toe with a mentored down lvl 50 ID raider with max PA.. lool.

That being said, I can imagine Trion bringing it in, purely because they won't spend any time thinking about the consequences.

Love the new Avatar Charlice.

[Kyera]

I don't think mentoring for warfronts is a good idea, unless the undergeared players really want something to complain about. Imagine going toe to toe with a mentored down lvl 50 ID raider with max PA.. lool.

"This non-problematic or situationally problematic situation inconveniences me, please adjust it and replace it with a far more globally problematic solution" is a common position to be held on these boards, from PvP content to PvE content to class balance.

I ran into a lot of arguments like that from other DAoC TLs when I was in the program. So awful.

[Kyera]

Copy-pastaing this here, since I think it's relevant.

Not entirely unexpected.

Trion nerfs a lot of things in PvP based on vocal player feedback and not necessarily on the root causes/issues. Warriors and mages ate lots of nerfs early on because people were crying about them, when the problem was the red orb in warfronts. The same sort of thing went for Sabs, except the problem there was a lack of tells that charges were incoming (so that people could react/cleanse). Clerics have continually eaten healing nerfs because they're "unkillable", when the problem is ostensibly a lack of coordination. Champion, Paragon and Riftblade have been redesigned a billion times when the only 'problem' with each was arguably Lingering Wounds, Strike Like Iron, and Planar Blade + Riftwalk, respectively.

Twinks were problematic because of grape augments and abuse of runes intended for higher level characters (that were subsequently grandfathered in), especially in the 10-19 bracket. Instead of putting level limits on augments (as we already see with Valorstone, for example), eliminating grandfathered items (item has a min equip level of the item or any attached consumables -- runes, whetstones, whatever -- as we saw with BoA sigils), or eliminating twinking in the one bracket where you can argue it's truly problematic, they opted to axe the entire XP locking system.

Fortunately for me, I don't have a total aversion to end-game PvP (I just got tired of solo queuing warfronts -- especially Port Scion for Super Awesome PvE adventures), and Conquest looks like it might keep me around.

[Rymer]

The Trion giveth and the Trion taketh away. A couple of quotes that look amusing with 20/20 hindsight...

In fact, Scott Hartsman (Chief Creative Officer and Producer of Rift) has gone on record stating that..

"Judging by the stats, there have not been many cases of ["natural" characters getting steamrolled by twinks] at all. I know that the fear of it happening was a lot greater than the reality of it happening. Our game, unlike some other games, doesn't have the incredibly broken, overpowered stuff that really causes that problem, and that was an intentional part of the item and spell design. So the fear of it was definitely huge, but in reality it doesn't exist too terribly much.

Now, that said, if that ever did happen we'd have no problem - the same way we have rank bracketing at level 50, we could easily do gear level bracketing at lower levels. Our system inherently supports it if we ever need to. But we look at the stats every day, and so far it doesn't look like it."

In short, he thinks people are blowing the twink issue way out of proportion. The gear available to XP locked toons is not as uber powerful as people make it out to be, nor is it anything that any average player cannot get, with a couple exceptions (most of which has already been addressed).

I went through the effort to twink, and found, surprisingly, that its not all that hard to accomplish on your own. The only way DEVs can undo twinking right now, is to remove all gear from game, and I assure you, the twinks would keep on playing, but the non-twinks would quit. Why?

Then I read *this*. That XP lock was going away and instead mentoring was being put into play.

So....Trion just lost my $15/mo.

[Kyera]

The Trion giveth and the Trion taketh away. A couple of quotes that look amusing with 20/20 hindsight...

I'm not sure what becomes amusing with hindsight in those quotes, unless we have different definitions of either amusing or hindsight.

[Charlice]

I'm not sure what becomes amusing with hindsight in those quotes, unless we have different definitions of either amusing or hindsight.

Your post is relevant to me too Ky. I just think it's a shame, lower level warfronts could of been a thriving part of the game.

I find nothing amusing in the fact, that level locking has been left wide open for PvE players, but will be made unavailable to PvP players.

Please no one that has complained, about so called twinks, ever come back and complain about level 50 warfronts.
You honestly have no clue, how much more evenly matched lower level warfronts are, than unmatched lvl 50warfronts.

But hey, what do I care. I have two rank 40 toons. See you in there... maybe.

[tevikolady]

The Trion giveth and the Trion taketh away. A couple of quotes that look amusing with 20/20 hindsight...

I will admit that this is a clever and intelligent way of removing XP lock and still giving players the option to run with their friends.

However, I see this deeply impacting low level warfronts.

Have fun.

[MitsuMarty]

It most definitely will. People like the QQ'ers are closed minded small picture thinkers. They complain about twinking in low level WF's and say it's ruining it. STILL not understanding that, the reason they can even run so many WF's is because it's full of twinks.
Talk about run of the mill dumbasses. Do you actually think you'll be able to level in WF's now that twinks will be gone?
Believe me, do the math, you'll get more xp running 10 losing WF's per hour, than winning 2 in an hour, because thats all your gonna get once twinks are completely out of bracket. And the best part is, I can guarantee the QQ'ers didn't lose every match because of the merc system. So basically you guys just screwed the pooch because your still gonna have the same win/loss ratio. Just longer queue times.

EDIT: Let me state the 10/hr-2/hr is just an example showing that you'll be doing less wf's now. Since this forum is filled with closed minded cry babies, figured it necessary to spell it out for them.

[Misun]

All I have to say is this-

If you complained about low level wf's..I can't wait to see you complain when you hit level 50.

You will be wishing you never hit level 50. Truth.

[Zaiana]

Hopefully they'll try and make the mentoring system work as a more fairer method of twinking, not that there'll be any demand for it.

[MitsuMarty]

All I have to say is this-

If you complained about low level wf's..I can't wait to see you complain when you hit level 50.

You will be wishing you never hit level 50. Truth.

Unfortunately, your preaching to a wall. You've said this a million times, I've said it quite a few, everyone has said it. They just don't listen. Now they'll be forced to only gear grind at level 50.

But no worries, they'll be satisfied with it, it only takes...what?....a few months of getting your arse handed to you via 1-2 shots? But it'll be worth it....because those few weeks they had to deal with twinking is over. That obviously was worse....oh wait.